O/T DDay for Brexit..well sort of...

[KerrAvon]

If leave means leave and the idea of Brexit to bring sovereignty back to the UK then leaving with no deal to trade under WTO will not achieve that end.

WTO rules are made at their head office in Geneva - we have no say in formulating trading*regulations. The resolution of trade disputes are done in by WTO nominated bodies applying WTO legislation - the UK courts have no influence at all.

So not only a really dumb deal for UK businesses but totally undemocratic. I dont see how it can be considered a realistic option.

That's a nonsense argument. Entering into any sort of international obligation or treaty arguably involves a degree of surrender of sovereignty. As an example, the UK is a signatory to the European Convention on Human Rights and accepts the jurisdiction of the European Court of Human Rights. The point is, however, that our democratically elected government chose to surrender a degree of autonomy and sovereignty in doing so.

Being a member of the EU involves a substantial surrender of sovereignty. One of the arguments in the referendum campaign was that we had given up too much and that we should take it back. That side of the argument 'won' in a democratic exercise.

From a personal perspective, leaving the EU but remaining subject to some of its laws and the jurisdiction of its court is a complete red line. That amounts to a surrender of sovereignty that results in us being subject to laws that we have not been involved in making. That is truly is undemocratic and why I reject such nonsense as the Norway model or permanent membership of a Customs Union. Remaining or a no deal are both preferable to that.