Phillip Cocu

[ramAnag]

I’m with Wesso, start a new thread

Why? It’s a thread about our (possible) new Dutch manager and I’ve introduced the (possible) implications of an impending Brexit on his ability to introduce signings from Holland/Europe. What’s wrong with that or have the thought police stopped us referring to the ‘B word’ in any shape of form?
Too much paranoia on here. MA, GP and Swale didn’t seem to have any difficulty responding intelligently.

[Geoff Parkstone]

fight, fight, fight..............

[Andy_Faber]

Why? It’s a thread about our (possible) new Dutch manager and I’ve introduced the (possible) implications of an impending Brexit on his ability to introduce signings from Holland/Europe. What’s wrong with that or have the thought police stopped us referring to the ‘B word’ in any shape of form?
Too much paranoia on here. MA, GP and Swale didn’t seem to have any difficulty responding intelligently.

Is the silent majority again RA, in this case the folk who want to talk footy and see another thread hijacked by the 'putting the world to rights' circle jerking brigade (in which I include myself), not helping me to attract/retain DCFC supporters who want to rattle on about footy but who despise politics

[ramAnag]

Is the silent majority again RA, in this case the folk who want to talk footy and see another thread hijacked by the 'putting the world to rights' circle jerking brigade (in which I include myself), not helping me to attract/retain DCFC supporters who want to rattle on about footy but who despise politics

You’re totally missing the point Andy. It’s nothing to do with politics...well not directly anyway.
Hypothetically, if we were sticking with Lampard we’d be looking at benefitting from having access to Chelsea youngsters. If we were going back to giving Rowett a second chance we might be asking who he might want to link up with from Stoke City. The same is true of Karanka...Forest and Boro’ connections, or Clough...no one outside a twenty five mile radius of Derby or Scotland.

As it happens we’ve chosen to venture into the European managerial market for the first time ever. It’s a big step and, in our current situation, one of the attractions is that Cocu will have extensive knowledge of both established Dutch players along with up and coming youngsters keen to make a name for themselves in England.

Unfortunately and completely peripherally, our venture coincides with a time when it may become harder to attract players from abroad.
I don’t know whether that is true or not and am making no comment on the rights and wrongs of that situation.

My questions, which were never designed to stir up such a hornet’s nest, are...

1) Is it likely to become harder to sign Europeans? Which three posters answered intelligently.
2) All managers come with perceived additional perks (i.e.Clough and Rowett’s history and knowledge of the club, or Lampard’s connections). Cocu’s ‘connections’ are with Dutch and European football. In a different ‘climate’ I’d be happily enthusiastic about that, but can we still be as enthusiastic if those ‘perks’ are no longer available for us to benefit from?

In short...do we still want Cocu if the potential for signing new and undiscovered Dutch talent does not come with him or would we be better sticking with the domestic managerial market?

It’s a question...not a statement...and I think you’ll find it’s entirely about football.

[Andy_Faber]

You’re totally missing the point Andy. It’s nothing to do with politics...well not directly anyway.
Hypothetically, if we were sticking with Lampard we’d be looking at benefitting from having access to Chelsea youngsters. If we were going back to giving Rowett a second chance we might be asking who he might want to link up with from Stoke City. The same is true of Karanka...Forest and Boro’ connections, or Clough...no one outside a twenty five mile radius of Derby or Scotland.

As it happens we’ve chosen to venture into the European managerial market for the first time ever. It’s a big step and, in our current situation, one of the attractions is that Cocu will have extensive knowledge of both established Dutch players along with up and coming youngsters keen to make a name for themselves in England.

Unfortunately and completely peripherally, our venture coincides with a time when it may become harder to attract players from abroad.
I don’t know whether that is true or not and am making no comment on the rights and wrongs of that situation.

My questions, which were never designed to stir up such a hornet’s nest, are...

1) Is it likely to become harder to sign Europeans? Which three posters answered intelligently.
2) All managers come with perceived additional perks (i.e.Clough and Rowett’s history and knowledge of the club, or Lampard’s connections). Cocu’s ‘connections’ are with Dutch and European football. In a different ‘climate’ I’d be happily enthusiastic about that, but can we still be as enthusiastic if those ‘perks’ are no longer available for us to benefit from?

In short...do we still want Cocu if the potential for signing new and undiscovered Dutch talent does not come with him or would we be better sticking with the domestic managerial market?

It’s a question...not a statement...and I think you’ll find it’s entirely about football.

So here are your answers

1.Possibly
2. Possibly

And at that, and realising you either missed or chose to ignore my point, I know you won't drop it so I will

[mistaram]

You’re totally missing the point Andy. It’s nothing to do with politics...well not directly anyway.
Hypothetically, if we were sticking with Lampard we’d be looking at benefitting from having access to Chelsea youngsters. If we were going back to giving Rowett a second chance we might be asking who he might want to link up with from Stoke City. The same is true of Karanka...Forest and Boro’ connections, or Clough...no one outside a twenty five mile radius of Derby or Scotland.

As it happens we’ve chosen to venture into the European managerial market for the first time ever. It’s a big step and, in our current situation, one of the attractions is that Cocu will have extensive knowledge of both established Dutch players along with up and coming youngsters keen to make a name for themselves in England.

Unfortunately and completely peripherally, our venture coincides with a time when it may become harder to attract players from abroad.
I don’t know whether that is true or not and am making no comment on the rights and wrongs of that situation.

My questions, which were never designed to stir up such a hornet’s nest, are...

1) Is it likely to become harder to sign Europeans? Which three posters answered intelligently.
2) All managers come with perceived additional perks (i.e.Clough and Rowett’s history and knowledge of the club, or Lampard’s connections). Cocu’s ‘connections’ are with Dutch and European football. In a different ‘climate’ I’d be happily enthusiastic about that, but can we still be as enthusiastic if those ‘perks’ are no longer available for us to benefit from?

In short...do we still want Cocu if the potential for signing new and undiscovered Dutch talent does not come with him or would we be better sticking with the domestic managerial market?

It’s a question...not a statement...and I think you’ll find it’s entirely about football.

RA think it depends what deal we leave with if we ever leave Don't suppose Cocu will worry about that he's got more to worry about learning pounds ,shillings ,and pence I see he's flying straight out to USA he's in for a shock when he realises only Keogh,Marriott and Hudds can kick a ball with both feet

[MadAmster]

RA think it depends what deal we leave with if we ever leave Don't suppose Cocu will worry about that he's got more to worry about learning pounds ,shillings ,and pence I see he's flying straight out to USA he's in for a shock when he realises only Keogh,Marriott and Hudds can kick a ball with both feet

On a thread on a different forum (not the v i ta l one) someone started a thread on what would your one piece of advice to Cocu be?

My answer was have them all in every afternoon working on their "wrong" foot.

Great minds think alike.

[MadAmster]

Originally Posted by swaledale

1. On the formation issue, you did actually post from Dutch training manuals, but in any event the point I was making was that you were quoting these formations when nowhere within the professional football world, neither coaches, media or clubs use them, so until the day they do I can only assume that your trying to appear as a member of football cognoscenti.

2. As for Cocu, well its you who needs to read, because supposedly the reason Mel has gone for him is for the very reason that he brings through academy players, Mel has stated publicly that the next manager must have that in his nature, so it would seem that your host by your own pedantry to misquote a phrase.

3. Oh and he plays attacking football, though I did note that this was in the Dutch league so didn't count according to your expert opinion. I feel I must demure to one so clued up as yourself, obviously I am not sufficiently ITK to be able to challenge your tiresome rants!

1. Pedant (again), yes, I did post ONE from a Dutch site and TWO or THREE from English County FAs.

2. You may have read that BUT I have gone through his squad at PSV and, apart from a fair few 22 to 24 year olds he bought from other clubs, there is a distinct lack of promotion from the PSV Academy to PSV 1st XI

3. The football PSV played during his tenure was generally described by Dutch public and press alike as being "zakelijk". That means busieness-like, the term I used.

[swaledale]

Is the silent majority again RA, in this case the folk who want to talk footy and see another thread hijacked by the 'putting the world to rights' circle jerking brigade (in which I include myself), not helping me to attract/retain DCFC supporters who want to rattle on about footy but who despise politics

I don't see this as being other than how Brexit might affect player recruitment, there was no political points being made, just an assessment of the situation - which could be an impact of Derby appointing a continental manager and coaching staff who won't necessarily be au fait with players in the UK.

[swaledale]

1. Pedant (again), yes, I did post ONE from a Dutch site and TWO or THREE from English County FAs.

2. You may have read that BUT I have gone through his squad at PSV and, apart from a fair few 22 to 24 year olds he bought from other clubs, there is a distinct lack of promotion from the PSV Academy to PSV 1st XI

3. The football PSV played during his tenure was generally described by Dutch public and press alike as being "zakelijk". That means busieness-like, the term I used.

Oooh we are touchy aren't we when found out! So what your saying contradicts what Mels says is the reason then? Mmm think I'll trust Mel's view.