Coronavirus and football.

[ramAnag]

Cheaper rA..... tight wad that I am

We always book 3 months prior to the game we are going to. Hotel is cheaper when non-cancellable. We book Friday to Sunday to cover most eventualities of kick off times. Over the years we've only not seen the game once. That infamous Cardiff game that didn't happen. Last season's Red Dogs game got moved to the Monday evening for Sky. No problem, extend the stay in the hotel by 2 days and book a new return flight.

Never dreamed, when we booked, we'd be at the mercy of Corona virus as to whether or not the game would go ahead or we could actually travel or would the hotel be open....

I will check out insurance over the course of today and tomorrow....... if it would offer financial solace I will take out a policy.

Probably me that’s the ‘tight wad’, MA. The difference between cancellable and non cancellable is negligible compared with the cost of losing the cost of two nights’ accommodation and I hate being ‘ripped off’ or paying out for something I haven’t had.

You’re obviously right...no one could have predicted the current situation, but there are lots of other possible reasons for cancellation hence my reasoning on hotels and that other box covering theatre/concert tickets.

Don’t get Trump’s stance...ban travel from mainland Europe for the next thirty days but not the UK.
Only a matter of time I imagine. Can’t see our trip going ahead, at which point the travel insurance linked to our bank account is likely to be put to the test. Moved our current account banking a couple of years ago for precisely this type of reason - cancellations not a pandemic - as it appears to save a fortune compared with other travel insurance. We’ll see.

[swaledale]

Trumps travel ban is not an effective way of controlling the virus but its a typical political statement. Also banning sporting fixtures isn't either

Chief scientific adviser Sir Patrick Vallance said cancelling sporting events is not a "major way to tackle this epidemic".

"Of course there is a risk," he said. "But on average one person infects two or three others.

"You therefore have a very low probability of infecting a large number of people in a stadium, or a rather higher probability of infecting people very close to you, and that means most of the transmission tends to takes place with friends and colleagues in close environments, not in the big environments.

"It is true that any cancellations of things can have some effect (but) if you then get a displacement activity, when everyone congregates somewhere else, you may have perversely an increased risk, particularly in an indoors environment.

"So it doesn't mean you should at some point make the decision for the resilience point that has been discussed, but this is not a major way to tackle this epidemic.

"The major ways are to try and reduce and delay the transmission across households and people who have become infected and that why that is the concentration of the first actions."

But of course it "looks" as if major action is being taken, when the real facts are that the virus will spread anyway, most will suffer minor if any effects.


Meanwhile on average a round 17,000 die from flu each year (though it was under 2,000 in 18/19 and nearly 5 people die in road accidents each day (approx 1800 a year) but we dont report that on the news every night.

[Geoff Parkstone]

which could be because the corona dead are in addition to those killed by flu, cars, cats and so on, and so "new".

However amongst the lies, damned lies and statistics, I learn from ONS that 56,000 deaths in the UK in 2019 are down to flu, not 17,000: so who knows which is correct

[ramAnag]

Trumps travel ban is not an effective way of controlling the virus but its a typical political statement. Also banning sporting fixtures isn't either

Chief scientific adviser Sir Patrick Vallance said cancelling sporting events is not a "major way to tackle this epidemic".

"Of course there is a risk," he said. "But on average one person infects two or three others.

"You therefore have a very low probability of infecting a large number of people in a stadium, or a rather higher probability of infecting people very close to you, and that means most of the transmission tends to takes place with friends and colleagues in close environments, not in the big environments.

"It is true that any cancellations of things can have some effect (but) if you then get a displacement activity, when everyone congregates somewhere else, you may have perversely an increased risk, particularly in an indoors environment.

"So it doesn't mean you should at some point make the decision for the resilience point that has been discussed, but this is not a major way to tackle this epidemic.

"The major ways are to try and reduce and delay the transmission across households and people who have become infected and that why that is the concentration of the first actions."

But of course it "looks" as if major action is being taken, when the real facts are that the virus will spread anyway, most will suffer minor if any effects.


Meanwhile on average a round 17,000 die from flu each year (though it was under 2,000 in 18/19 and nearly 5 people die in road accidents each day (approx 1800 a year) but we dont report that on the news every night.

Okay...Chris Whitty and Sir Patrick Vallance are experts and to be taken notice of, but I just don’t get the logic.

On the one hand people are being told to self isolate immediately for seven days if they develop any symptoms, there is talk of possibly having to follow the lead of Italy, Ireland and Spain in closing all schools and universities, and advice to stay away from the old and at risk while at the same time becoming more caring, selfless and altruistic (not sure how those last two equate ).
All that suggests is, as we know, that the virus transmits very efficiently from person to person but for some reason huge gatherings of people aren’t apparently going to encourage that. How can that be?

The ‘on average one person infects two or three others’ is, imo, completely meaningless in this context. Norman Nomates who has his shopping delivered online and is devoid of a social life will infect no one and probably remain untouched, but for anyone who regularly uses public transport and visits the pub/cinema/theatre/major sporting event etc surely the risk is massively increased.

The cynic in me suspects they might even be quite happy for the old and the sick to die...they’re an expensive drain on resources after all and short of a major war it’s an effective means of population control...but, although at least sporting events have the advantage of being held in the open air, I just can’t understand how major gatherings aren’t inevitably going to help and speed up the spread of the virus.

[Geoff Parkstone]

If you do get to the States, rA,, you won't have much sport to watch! NBA, NHL, XFL and all college sports cancelled, MLB season start has been delayed.

Additionally UEFA have suspended European champions league and europa league I believe.

Not sure how much longer the PL and EFL can continue to put their heads in the sand. Would be funny if the seasons were cancelled ab initio so annulling NFFC best season in a while and Liverpool's first PL win

[MadAmster]

Over here in the Netherlands...... new instructions yesterday

1. any cold/flu-like symptons whatsoever, self isolate for 7 days
2. Temperature and a dry throat then call a special number, they will ask questions and, based on the answers, they will tell you to either self isolate or to go and get tested.
3. Only go out if absolutely necessary (work, shopping, fetching meds are about it)
4. work from home if at all possible
5. All gatherings/events/sports where 100 or more people would be present are hereby cancelled
6. Just in case you'd forgotten - wash your hands regularly

The exception from 5. above are Schools/Colleges/Uni. They can carry on as per usual. Most folk think it's because keeping kids home would prevent the parents from going to work and cripple the economy even further. The official line is that kids (unless they have pre-exisiting underlying medical conditions) aren't in the critical group like the old, the infirm, pregnant women etc. I think most folk have it right and the official line is wrong. Especially when you consider that healthy young uns getting the virus from school won't, in most cases, be in serious danger BUT.... they seem to have forgotten that the kids will go home to parents, grandparents etc and some of those will be at risk......

[ramAnag]

Over here in the Netherlands...... new instructions yesterday

1. any cold/flu-like symptons whatsoever, self isolate for 7 days
2. Temperature and a dry throat then call a special number, they will ask questions and, based on the answers, they will tell you to either self isolate or to go and get tested.
3. Only go out if absolutely necessary (work, shopping, fetching meds are about it)
4. work from home if at all possible
5. All gatherings/events/sports where 100 or more people would be present are hereby cancelled
6. Just in case you'd forgotten - wash your hands regularly

The exception from 5. above are Schools/Colleges/Uni. They can carry on as per usual. Most folk think it's because keeping kids home would prevent the parents from going to work and cripple the economy even further. The official line is that kids (unless they have pre-exisiting underlying medical conditions) aren't in the critical group like the old, the infirm, pregnant women etc. I think most folk have it right and the official line is wrong. Especially when you consider that healthy young uns getting the virus from school won't, in most cases, be in serious danger BUT.... they seem to have forgotten that the kids will go home to parents, grandparents etc and some of those will be at risk......

What I find scary is the lack of consistency and leadership. The advice of medical experts elsewhere in the World seems to conflict with those in the UK and at 5.00 pm yesterday we were told there was no need to take this step regarding sports events, while just 18 hours later there apparently is such a need!

The EFL seems, for once, to be displaying more common sense and leadership than the Government.

On a lighter note...I’ve taken more than my fair share of stick on here for having a teaching background. Some of it - GP etc - has just been good natured banter. Some of it - all water off a duck’s back - has been more malicious.
Either way...as the possibility of schools closing seems to be causing great consternation throughout the UK maybe some will now recognise the crucial part teachers play, not just in educating the young, but also in allowing the rest of society and the economy to function.
Perhaps Tricky and his mate may even recognise that teaching is a ‘proper job’ after all and one the economy seems dependent on for all sorts of reasons.

P.S. Currently investigating cancellation GP.

MA...surely visiting Amsterdam’s bars must be considered ‘absolutely necessary’ in your case.

[Geoff Parkstone]

So teachers are now just to be highly paid babysitters then

Perhaps this means that they should work until 5 to 6 pm like the rest of the workforce in order to further assist in the babysitting until the parents can come home from their jobs!!

Also, if schools close, will the teachers sacrifice their incredibly long summer holidays in order to run the schools for an extra few weeks to allow the kids to catch up on the work they have missed due to closure

[ramAnag]

So teachers are now just to be highly paid babysitterns then

Perhaps this means that they should work until 5 to 6 pm like the rest of the workforce in order to further assist in the babysitting until the parents can come home from their jobs!!

Also, if schools close, will the teachers sacrifice their incredibly long summer holidays in order to run the schools for an extra few weeks to allow the kids to catch up on the work they have missed due to closure

‘Highly paid baby sitters’? Hmmm...not sure how much you think baby sitters charge but try multiplying it by thirty or so ‘babies’ and then by seven hours. Not so ‘highly paid’, right?

They do! Not necessarily in the presence of pupils any more than all the work that doctors or accountants do is with their patients/clients.

Interesting one. In the U.S. they have to make up the time if there are more than a certain number of ‘snow days’ but then they have ridiculously long summer breaks anyway. Be interesting to hear the views of parents who’ve booked family summer holidays on that though. Sure all parents would be entirely accommodating!

[Geoff Parkstone]

It does also raise the spectre of end of year exams - many O and A (if I can use dated terminology) students will already be at the end of their "contact time" and at home on study leave, but how will the exams operate if it lasts that long? What about students that get the virus during the exams?

There are so many dynamics to this. I spent yesterday working on corona virus planning for a museum client shutdown. Looks like will need it this weekend. So many things to consider though