Transfer in's and out's rumours etc.

[Rev72]

Gutted this one has fell through and we have till Monday to get something else sorted.

[ozleeds]

Gutted this one has fell through and we have till Monday to get something else sorted.

Nothing gets done on weekends they enjoy the time off plus they have games to worry about.
About Germany apart Bayern the rest of the comp must be gash as my Greek side AEK beat Wolfsburg lol
You would think a team like Bayern would have known if the dude had an injury and had him fixed up might be more to this who knows.

[ozleeds]

We are in trouble again one of our spies got caught out silly bugger.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=55b3Q_yLTzY

[Jezleeds]

Getting to the point where we get a player to take a medical is as you say, inevitably Ortas ultimate responsibility. No contract would (or should), be entered into without his signature. If that logical statement be true, it means that at LEAST a dozen counter-productive contracts have been entered into on his say so (ask me for names, if necessary!), and even with Bielsas "calming" influence he (Orta), he has continued to bring dross to this club and consequently waste precious resources.

But at the same time it has to be acknowledged that he's also brought in a number of good signings too.

[MrsORichSenior]

Getting to the point where we get a player to take a medical is as you say, inevitably Ortas ultimate responsibility. No contract would (or should), be entered into without his signature. If that logical statement be true, it means that at LEAST a dozen counter-productive contracts have been entered into on his say so (ask me for names, if necessary!), and even with Bielsas "calming" influence he (Orta), he has continued to bring dross to this club and consequently waste precious resources.

The medical examination of a professional player is a crucial aspect of any transfer process. It is customary for professional sports clubs to thoroughly examine the health of potential new players and engage them only if such medical examination does not reveal any pre existing medical condition. Consequently, clubs in various sports tend to subject the validity of the contract to a successful medical examination.We (Leeds) invited the player over in 'good faith' of which Bayern and the player accepted to conclude a transfer which appears to now be stalled over a medical issue(s).

Orta's fault ?

https://sports-law.eu/termination-of...dical-reasons/
MOT

[WTF11]

Toughest day in a long time as for a Leeds fan. the collapse of the cuisance deal and stuck with Kiko another year. However, think some of the venom directed at Orta is misplaced. have to defend him.

He's part of radz team and it's easy to forget that just 3 years ago we sat mired in the championship with no chance of ever even sniffing at someone like Cuisance or even James. Now we get Koch, Rodrigo, and the Serie A defender as well as a drove of super young talent. we also kept everyone but White from last years team and locked us costa, meslier and harrison (apparently).

we are top 10 material right out of the box.

Give Orta some due. High risk moves pay off big but also flop bad when they don't work out. I'm actually more upset of not losing Kiko or Douglas that not getting De Paul or Cuisance. He also had a hand in signing MB. That alone makes him worth all the blunders.

look at the bright side. we've had one hell of a better transfer window that scumchester.

Not sure why you feel the need to "defend him"?

It isn't Orta who took a squad of players largely brought together before he arrived and made them into a promotion-winning side, it was (and remains) Bielsa, (and I have said many times that I was wrong about Bielsa!). THAT is why we are able to look at players of the sort you name (whether they turn out to be the right ones, time will tell). And we have retained players for exactly the same reason, they want to play having been coached by Bielsa, not having been selected by Orta (which the vast majority haven't).

Just to give some basis for my statements,

The following were brought in in Ortas first year as DoF (from June 2017), although some you will see were either the results of scouting before he arrived, academy graduates, or loanees from previous years who were converted into "permanent" signatures;

Arrivals 2017/18 (Orta arrived as DoF early June 2017) - Those with bullet points made material first team appearances, all others didn't

• Forshaw – Jan 2018
• Jansson - Aug 2016 (Loan)
• Saiz – June 2017
• Roberts – Jan 2018
• Alisoki – July 2017
• Klich – June 2017

Sacko
De Bock
Grot
Cibicki
Ekuban
Ideguchi
Halme
Wiedwald
Lonergan
Gomes
Borthwick-Jackson
Anita
Dalby
Bouy
Stevens
Lassogga
Pennington
Shaugnessy
Denton
Murphy

• Pearce – June 2016 (from Academy)

Bellusci

Total Spend - £25.59m
Income - £15.75 (£14.76 for Chris Wood)

As a comparison, let's look at the spend/income figures for 2018/19, the first year of Bielsa as head coach

2018/19 (Bielsa arrives early June 2018)

Spend - £10.26m (Bamford £7.11m, Douglas £3.06m)
Income - £6.57m

(None of these figures come from my head, and whilst Transfermarkt might not be perfect, at least it's objective).

No more supermarket sweep tactics on the part of our DoF, hoovering up non-entities and trying to get the various inexperienced coach/managers to use them in the 1st team, Bielsa wouldn't wear that.

None of the current success can be attributed to the performance of our DoF (unless anyone can supply evidence, not hearsay, about whatever part he played in Bielsa coming to Leeds), quite the opposite. If he had not had the influence on his scouting activities that Bielsa brought to bear, we would still have a bloated senior squad, filled with those he could find on the cheap in a desperate hope that one or two might turn out to be ok ("never mind the quality, feel the width", springs to mind), and we would be in the Championship at best.

[WTF11]

But at the same time it has to be acknowledged that he's also brought in a number of good signings too.

See post #716, his hit rate isn't exactly encouraging.

[WTF11]

The medical examination of a professional player is a crucial aspect of any transfer process. It is customary for professional sports clubs to thoroughly examine the health of potential new players and engage them only if such medical examination does not reveal any pre existing medical condition. Consequently, clubs in various sports tend to subject the validity of the contract to a successful medical examination.We (Leeds) invited the player over in 'good faith' of which Bayern and the player accepted to conclude a transfer which appears to now be stalled over a medical issue(s).

Orta's fault ?

https://sports-law.eu/termination-of...dical-reasons/
MOT

My post was in response to Jez' query in post #706. No, a player being found unfit isn't Ortas fault, but taken as a whole (which was the thrust of the query), amongst all his previous attempts at bringing players in, his record isn't good, not even moderate, and without Bielsa to give him "guidance" who knows what we would have on board by now (and even that's not always effective, as the JKA debacle illustrates).

[spaldy]

Not sure you were ever part of a team either in sports or business but...

A team builds synergy. Post #716 only highlights the duds.

If Orta was as weak of a link as you portray him then there is no way we'd be as successful as we are. You don't sign Bielsa and his excellent staff, get outside money, go out and sign players from all over the world and put one of the best products in pro football on the pitch if your DOF is a clown. it's just too important of a position to overcome.

As I said in my post. High risk moves often succeed or fail hugely. There is often no middle ground.

It's also easy to forget we did not have big money early on in his term. We've also built up a development squad that looks very promising for the future and can get young player to sign for us rather than scum, citeh, pool or chelsea. something not dreamed of 3 years ago.

It's a team effort and he's a key part of the team. no single teammate wins or loses a game... well except for maybe kiko.

[WTF11]

Not sure you were ever part of a team either in sports or business but...

A team builds synergy. Post #716 only highlights the duds.

If Orta was as weak of a link as you portray him then there is no way we'd be as successful as we are. You don't sign Bielsa and his excellent staff, get outside money, go out and sign players from all over the world and put one of the best products in pro football on the pitch if your DOF is a clown. it's just too important of a position to overcome.

As I said in my post. High risk moves often succeed or fail hugely. There is often no middle ground.

It's also easy to forget we did not have big money early on in his term. We've also built up a development squad that looks very promising for the future and can get young player to sign for us rather than scum, citeh, pool or chelsea. something not dreamed of 3 years ago.

It's a team effort and he's a key part of the team. no single teammate wins or loses a game... well except for maybe kiko.

Sorry Spaldy, post 716 lists ALL the incoming players, (including those that returned from loans or graduated from the academy), not "just the duds" and since Bielsa arrived the investments have been fewer and of better quality. That's not just my opinion, the stats I quoted (unmassaged!), produced by Transfermarkt, support that conclusion.

Take your comment about money spent. We spent 25m in Ortas first year as DoF, getting 10m. In his second year we spent HALF as much and got half as much in, and Bielsa was coach for the first time in that second year of Ortas tenure. We got better value and spent less with Bielsa on board.

If he was to leave (replaced or not), I suspect we wouldnt notice very much change.