Derby to stop taking the knee.....

[ramAnag]

Whilst I dont think anyone here has made out GF to be a hero, he has been nominated for Donald Trump's (how ironic is that) statue "Garden of Heroes" in the USA: an accolade that, I feel confident in saying, he would not have been considered for were he still alive.

Mourn him but do not idolize him. He was a career criminal / drug dealer, but let's not forget that the police officer had had 18 complaints recorded against him with MPD Internal Affairs. Neither should be considered role models, but one has become a "poster boy" for a movement. Is that wrong? Perhaps history will judge.

Lets face it Nelson Mandela is considered a hero by billions of people, yet he had a rap sheet probably longer than George Floyd's. He did however have the opportunity to "change for the good", an opportunity not afforded to Floyd

All fair points, but perhaps inadvertently you have taken us back to the initial targets of the BLM protests...the statues dedicated to a variety of colonialists and slave traders etc.
Were they not the ‘poster boy’ equivalents of their time? ‘History’ came along to judge but, as I recall, you and those much further to the Right didn’t much care for the verdict.

[Andy_Faber]

All fair points, but perhaps inadvertently you have taken us back to the initial targets of the BLM protests...the statues dedicated to a variety of colonialists and slave traders etc.
Were they not the ‘poster boy’ equivalents of their time? ‘History’ came along to judge but, as I recall, you and those much further to the Right didn’t much care for the verdict.

the 'slight' difference being that (some of) those protesting aganst said colonialists are quite happy to buy/shoplift from shops that suppress their retail prices by the use of 'slave labour', much of which labour (and ironically much of the fortunes made) come from their own demographic. Slavery/exploitation knows no colour IMO but that, to quote TTR (I'm sure he's said this) doesn't fit 'the agenda'. YES, I do check as much as possible the source of the clothes I wear, right down to my Harris Tweed underwear

Edit: and the protestor's UK role model, who openly encouraged the BAME (I think he actually meant black) people to buy from BAME shops at the same time swallowed his principles enough to take massive sponsorship from non-BAME commercial enterprises

There are no clean hands

[Trickytreesreds]

All fair points, but perhaps inadvertently you have taken us back to the initial targets of the BLM protests...the statues dedicated to a variety of colonialists and slave traders etc.
Were they not the ‘poster boy’ equivalents of their time? ‘History’ came along to judge but, as I recall, you and those much further to the Right didn’t much care for the verdict.

Arrrrrrrr, but you conveniently missed out the ones attacked like Churchill etc.
These same "activists" want Nelson removed etc.

So to pacify a minority, will we be re writing all history?
After watching DR Shola Mos-Shogbamimu, attack the queen and UK yesterday. Calling the monachy and the country, based on slavery, colonialism, hate and oppression. I can only conclude that a fraction with these borders want, our whole culture disassembled and tone of shame forced on the population.

Perhaps these people forget, the Queen is head of the Commonwealth and very proud of it.
I see division and hate alright, but it certainly doesn't all come from the side being portrayed.

[Geoff Parkstone]

ALLEGEDLY

Fanta was created for Nazi Germany when they could not obtain Coke during WW2;
Hugo Boss was a member of the Nazi party and designed/produced uniforms for the SS and Hitler Youth;
Nestle and other companies used slave labour provided by the Germans;
Barclays bank handed over details of jewish employees to the authorities

Plus countless German companies will have collaborated with the nazi rulers.

History doesnt seem to have judged them, history does not stigmatise them. Could it be because the victims were not black? Im not supporting slavery or its proponents, but slavery is far from unique to the black community. Its a crime against humanity, not something to be culturally appropriated.

I know two rights dont make a wrong, but when one pulls down former slave owners statues whilst perhaps sipping your Fanta orange, nibbling on your kitkat, parading your Boss designer clothes and using your Barclaycard, do you not get the irony?

[swaledale]

ALLEGEDLY

Fanta was created for Nazi Germany when they could not obtain Coke during WW2;
Hugo Boss was a member of the Nazi party and designed/produced uniforms for the SS and Hitler Youth;
Nestle and other companies used slave labour provided by the Germans;
Barclays bank handed over details of jewish employees to the authorities

Plus countless German companies will have collaborated with the nazi rulers.

History doesnt seem to have judged them, history does not stigmatise them. Could it be because the victims were not black? Im not supporting slavery or its proponents, but slavery is far from unique to the black community. Its a crime against humanity, not something to be culturally appropriated.

I know two rights dont make a wrong, but when one pulls down former slave owners statues whilst perhaps sipping your Fanta orange, nibbling on your kitkat, parading your Boss designer clothes and using your Barclaycard, do you not get the irony?

And it was the British that invented the "concentration camp" and rounding up and imprisoning women and children as a way of repressing the local population of whatever country we were invading at the time"

Your right GP, rather than pointless virtue signalling and righteous indignation, there needs to be a greater explanation of history set in context so that todays and future generations can understand what happened and why.

[Andy_Faber]

Your right GP, rather than pointless virtue signalling and righteous indignation, there needs to be a greater explanation of history set in context so that todays and future generations can understand what happened and why.

Bunting out time again, I totaly agree with that, but who sets the syllabus?

[Andy_Faber]

Arrrrrrrr, but you conveniently missed out the ones attacked like Churchill etc.
These same "activists" want Nelson removed etc.

So to pacify a minority, will we be re writing all history?
After watching DR Shola Mos-Shogbamimu, attack the queen and UK yesterday. Calling the monachy and the country, based on slavery, colonialism, hate and oppression. I can only conclude that a fraction with these borders want, our whole culture disassembled and tone of shame forced on the population.

Perhaps these people forget, the Queen is head of the Commonwealth and very proud of it.
I see division and hate alright, but it certainly doesn't all come from the side being portrayed.

Thankfully, most of the U.K. appear to have seen through the Markels’ stunt, check out the Yougov poll on the subject

[Trickytreesreds]

Thankfully, most of the U.K. appear to have seen through the Markels’ stunt, check out the Yougov poll on the subject

I saw it mucker.

But this needs major attention now. The race baiting and race card is being used so much now. It has worn very thin with folks and also is fuelling a divide.
Last night was not really just a Royal family bash, it was a pick a side situation.
Either you agree with Markels claims about constant racism, or you don't and back the Queens side.

What was said offended a lot of people on one side and fired up another side.
That is the whole thing about bending the knee for me. It is something, that has worked over here because an American police problem.
The football league had a race equality system in place "lets kick it out"
Now that gets shelved and the BLM salute takes its place. I'm sorry, but the kick it out campaign covered all ethnicitys, now its a black lives matter voice?
Fuel fuel fuel. People like Markel give it oxygen. All we are missing now is a spark.

Is it going to ignite then?

[MadAmster]

I saw it mucker.

But this needs major attention now. The race baiting and race card is being used so much now. It has worn very thin with folks and also is fuelling a divide.
Last night was not really just a Royal family bash, it was a pick a side situation.
Either you agree with Markels claims about constant racism, or you don't and back the Queens side.

What was said offended a lot of people on one side and fired up another side.
That is the whole thing about bending the knee for me. It is something, that has worked over here because an American police problem.
The football league had a race equality system in place "lets kick it out"
Now that gets shelved and the BLM salute takes its place. I'm sorry, but the kick it out campaign covered all ethnicitys, now its a black lives matter voice?
Fuel fuel fuel. People like Markel give it oxygen. All we are missing now is a spark.

Is it going to ignite then?

I saw part of it and both MM and Harry spoke very highly of the Queen. Neither of them appointed any blame at the Queen.

[swaledale]

I saw part of it and both MM and Harry spoke very highly of the Queen. Neither of them appointed any blame at the Queen.

The mystery is why so many Brits seem to approve of a dysfunctional, out of date and anachronistic institution headed by a German and a Greek whose members seem so remote from the real world as to be irrelevant.