Maurice Ross Sacked

[drillerpie]

If you are calling someone African purely on the basis of his skin colour, yes. For starters, Africa is a continent, not a single country. The average Moroccan and the average Rwandan would look very different. Both countries are in the African continent but are very much populated be different people.

At best, the comment was racism based on ignorance and stereotyping. As has been said before.

There's a lot of people trying to defend a clear act of racist behaviour. Makes you wonder why.

To be fair he didn't call him African, he humorously queried whether he had a doctored African passport in reference to the number (comparatively small in relation to the total number of African players, comparatively large in relation to players from other continents) of famous suspected cases of this from sub-Saharan Africa. Neither did he imply that 'all African players have doctored passports', as has been previously suggested.

This happens in sub-Saharan Africa because the state bureaucracy is less developed than in the Maghreb. Many births are registered years afterwards, if at all, which can lead to some flexibility in the official date of birth.

If we want to get technical about it, the players with the passports in question will have had the same kind of skin pigmentation as Enzio, and I don't think he was seriously implying that Enzio has a doctored passport, or that Enzio was born in Africa, but the fact remains that he used Enzio's skin colour as the premise for a joke, which is inadvisable as a line manager in a work context, especially with people you haven't known for long.

How would Doyle react to a joke using Irish stereotypes? He might find it funny, he might not find it funny but it would be water of a duck's back, or he might take offence, perhaps even extreme offence. He might be ok with it if said directly to him with a smile, but less so if it was said behind his back while he was playing, as part of comments critical of his performance. Unless you know the person well enough to know they'llbe ok with it, you have to err on the side of caution, which Ross seems to have acknowledged.

As I've said before, I don't think it's impossible for this kind of joke to be taken in good spirits, but your judgement needs to be spot on in terms of when, where and with whom.

I think a lot of this boils down to details like the context things like this are said in, what you're used to in terms of things like social class, work environment etc. Some people on here clearly see it as a bit of banter, and they are probably used to environments where you get the piss ripped out of you for any distinguishing features whatsoever, and comments relating to nationality or skin colour would pass unobserved. Others may be used to more sophisticated environments where this kind of comment is the height of embarrassment.

[queenslandpie]

To be fair he didn't call him African, he humorously queried whether he had a doctored African passport in reference to the number (comparatively small in relation to the total number of African players, comparatively large in relation to players from other continents) of famous suspected cases of this from sub-Saharan Africa. Neither did he imply that 'all African players have doctored passports', as has been previously suggested.

This happens in sub-Saharan Africa because the state bureaucracy is less developed than in the Maghreb. Many births are registered years afterwards, if at all, which can lead to some flexibility in the official date of birth.

If we want to get technical about it, the players with the passports in question will have had the same kind of skin pigmentation as Enzio, and I don't think he was seriously implying that Enzio has a doctored passport, or that Enzio was born in Africa, but the fact remains that he used Enzio's skin colour as the premise for a joke, which is inadvisable as a line manager in a work context, especially with people you haven't known for long.

How would Doyle react to a joke using Irish stereotypes? He might find it funny, he might not find it funny but it would be water of a duck's back, or he might take offence, perhaps even extreme offence. He might be ok with it if said directly to him with a smile, but less so if it was said behind his back while he was playing, as part of comments critical of his performance. Unless you know the person well enough to know they'llbe ok with it, you have to err on the side of caution, which Ross seems to have acknowledged.

As I've said before, I don't think it's impossible for this kind of joke to be taken in good spirits, but your judgement needs to be spot on in terms of when, where and with whom.

I think a lot of this boils down to details like the context things like this are said in, what you're used to in terms of things like social class, work environment etc. Some people on here clearly see it as a bit of banter, and they are probably used to environments where you get the piss ripped out of you for any distinguishing features whatsoever, and comments relating to nationality or skin colour would pass unobserved. Others may be used to more sophisticated environments where this kind of comment is the height of embarrassment.

Context is key as you say and his judgement was poor. Did he deserve to get sacked / leave / whatever. Not sure. But context is key and his judgement was very poor.

[Notts78]

Context is key as you say and his judgement was poor. Did he deserve to get sacked / leave / whatever. Not sure. But context is key and his judgement was very poor.

Particularly given he had only been at the club a few weeks too. In any environment you establish boundaries through building relationships. Clearly this hasn’t been the case here.

[LaxtonLad]

If you are calling someone African purely on the basis of his skin colour, yes. For starters, Africa is a continent, not a single country. The average Moroccan and the average Rwandan would look very different. Both countries are in the African continent but are very much populated be different people.

At best, the comment was racism based on ignorance and stereotyping. As has been said before.

There's a lot of people trying to defend a clear act of racist behaviour. Makes you wonder why.

His question can't have been based on colour alone then, can it?

[ulaggypie]

His question can't have been based on colour alone then, can it?

He wouldn't ask a white man if he had a doctored African passport. Again, why are people so keen to defend what was said?

You don't have to be a racist person to make a racist remark. Drillerpie had probably the best take I've seen in this thread. It was an ill-judged remark, based on stereotypes and he would not have said it to a white man, therefore there is a racist component. The key to any "joke" is to know your audience.

[TSANHO]

I’ve just seen the words said by Maurice Ross. I can’t help but feel this has been blown out of proportion, I don’t see the racist connotations in it to be honest....it’s quite clearly just a reference to the joke about Kanu being like 50 years old and African governments being corrupt, which they are.

When I heard it was racist comments I was expecting it to be much more cut and dry than what it has actually turned out to be, a private apology would more have sufficed.

It’s going to be a very bland world before too long.

[LaxtonLad]

He wouldn't ask a white man if he had a doctored African passport. Again, why are people so keen to defend what was said?

You don't have to be a racist person to make a racist remark. Drillerpie had probably the best take I've seen in this thread. It was an ill-judged remark, based on stereotypes and he would not have said it to a white man, therefore there is a racist component. The key to any "joke" is to know your audience.

Perhaps he wouldn't have suspected a white man would have a doctored African passport? Chicksen is from Zimbabwe but does he run around like a 40 year old?

[magpie_mania]

I’ve just seen the words said by Maurice Ross. I can’t help but feel this has been blown out of proportion, I don’t see the racist connotations in it to be honest....it’s quite clearly just a reference to the joke about Kanu being like 50 years old and African governments being corrupt, which they are.

When I heard it was racist comments I was expecting it to be much more cut and dry than what it has actually turned out to be, a private apology would more have sufficed.

It’s going to be a very bland world before too long.

Good post above which made it clear why there are racist connotations:

'It was an ill-judged remark, based on stereotypes and he would not have said it to a white man, therefore there is a racist component.' Enzio is Dutch anyway!

As I said, it couldn't have come at a worse time than when there's a boycott on social media.

[the_anticlough]

t’s quite clearly just a reference to the joke about Kanu being like 50 years old and African governments being corrupt, which they are.
.

This keeps getting lost, what have any alleged tendencies of African governments got to do with a bloke from Holland?
Why does he have to be associated with any of that?

Another point is that Boldewijn was far from the only one to look poor in the Alty game, Wootton, Knight and Knowles screwed up almost every time as well.

And finally the point about a coach slagging off players on the pitch to the subs bench....is that what we want?

[Borg elite]

Let's have a count, I think it was racist.