What is it with Americans and guns!

[baggieal]

I realise that in a previous post I stated that this is a topic on guns and not immigration. However, living in Leicestershire I would like to point out that over 50% of the city of Leicester population is Asian. Surely this is not right in a British city. I don't have a problem with Asians but do have a problem with how the city has changed because of this. It would be far better if, when people arrive in this country, they are more spread out and not concentrated just in places like Leicester or Bradford.

Bradford won the U.K. City of Culture! Question the judging panel on this!!!

[baggiematt]

What has this go to do with black urban gun crime? Everything.

You know we have black people in our society too, but very little gun crime and definitely none in schools.

I wonder why that is….

[Robus]

I realise that in a previous post I stated that this is a topic on guns and not immigration. However, living in Leicestershire I would like to point out that over 50% of the city of Leicester population is Asian. Surely this is not right in a British city. I don't have a problem with Asians but do have a problem with how the city has changed because of this. It would be far better if, when people arrive in this country, they are more spread out and not concentrated just in places like Leicester or Bradford.

I'm deeply sorry to hear this. What a tragedy for your city, your country, the English people. The first order of business is the speak truth. That's difficult and dangerous in the UK where the police might come round if you speak truly. Respect to you for saying clearly what is being done your community and that IT IS WRONG.

You let in a million in the year ending in March 2022, 800,000 in twelve month previous to that. There is nowhere to put those numbers, no way to spread them out. If there is an empty hotel room near you, it's occupied by an Afghan. Wherever you put them, they will cluster in urban areas, recreate their native cultures, and drive out English either directly, or indirectly by creating Islamized, Africanized, and Asianized sub-cultures where English people do not thrive. As cities transform the countryside over the long run and not vice versa, that non-English urban culture become more dominant.
Why are your leaders doing this to you?

[Robus]

I'm aware that majority of gun related deaths in the US are suicides and that the level of deaths and injury from guns amongst children is also staggeringly high. I think I posted this earlier. In relation to states like Alaska, Wyoming and Montana then, with their high level of gun ownership, I accept that these probably account for the majority of deaths due to fire arm incidents rather than gun "crime" as such. However, surely there is still a correlation between the number of deaths by gun and the number of guns available? The point is, if there were less guns and less access to them, would this figure go down? I believe it would. Certainly the number of child fatalities/injury would decline but I guess the moot point is about the suicide rate. Trump argues this is about mental health not guns and he has a point to a degree but if you took such an easily accessible means away this must surely help? Certainly don't deny that mental health issues-and their causes- need to be dealt with but it's got to be easier and quicker to pull a trigger than to contemplate and go through with hanging/poisoning/jumping?

Gun suicides correlate with the presence of guns the way that hanging suicides correlate with the presence of rope. Two questions to consider: 1) Does the presence of guns INCREASE the frequency of suicide in a population? Or is the case that suicidal individuals choose a gun over some other method when given the opportunity? 2) Should suicide deterrence be a goal of gun policy?

As to the first question, that's an ongoing debate. From what I understand some comparisons between states have found higher overall suicide rates in places where guns are common. One problem is confounding variables. BOTH gun ownership and higher suicide rates tend to be more common in rural areas, but is the link causal? Another is that the studies are so politicized on both sides it is hard to know whom to trust. Internationally, there doesn't seem to be much correlation between suicides and access to guns. The US ranks higher among the world's nations in gun ownership than in suicide, while countries near the top of the list like Japan have few guns.

Should suicide deterrence be a goal of gun policy? I won't say it is irrelevant. We've been talking about mental illness in connection to recent mass shootings. However we distinguish between homicide and suicide. We tend to see suicide as a private tragedy and not a matter for public policy. Those ideas are rooted in our shared English culture. The gun control movement has tried to leverage suicide prevention to build support. It doesn't work. Americans have made up their minds about it.

The argument against access to AR15 type weapons however seems a far easier case to make and regardless of mental health issues it should be clear that you can cause far greater damage with assault type weapons than others. The clue might be in the word "assault". Why would anyone purchase such a weapon other than to use it for its capabilities

Here is why I own one: It's a cardinal rule of combat never to run out of bullets before you run out of threats. Should criminals, zombies, or 2011 UK-style arsonists approach my home or family, I want to obey that rule. That is the purpose of our Second Amendment. It is as relevant today as when Texas was full of Comanches and Boston full of Redcoats.

The idealistic solution, I guess, would be for both sides to be more welcoming and tolerant and to work at removing prejudices through better communication and understanding of each other. Existing communities should not feel they are being pushed out and newcomers should not be made to feel unwelcome purely based on their skin colour or nationality.

We in the West may have forgotten history, but history has not forgotten about us. What you are dreaming about has happened nowhere, ever. What will it take to convince you of the evidence of your own eyes?

You know we have black people in our society too, but very little gun crime and definitely none in schools.

I wonder why that is….

UK black populations are of recent West Indian and African origins. I haven't checked but would guess that family institutions remain intact in those communities, to a greater extent than among American blacks. I hope you are nowhere near our predicament, where 80% of black babies are born outside of marriage. Violent crime rates are highest among black Britons, as is true throughout the West. Immigration from Asia as well as Africa has driven up your crime rates. The trend will continue as your country becomes increasingly Africanized, Asianized, and Islamized.

[mickd1961]

I'm deeply sorry to hear this. What a tragedy for your city, your country, the English people. The first order of business is the speak truth. That's difficult and dangerous in the UK where the police might come round if you speak truly. Respect to you for saying clearly what is being done your community and that IT IS WRONG.

You let in a million in the year ending in March 2022, 800,000 in twelve month previous to that. There is nowhere to put those numbers, no way to spread them out. If there is an empty hotel room near you, it's occupied by an Afghan. Wherever you put them, they will cluster in urban areas, recreate their native cultures, and drive out English either directly, or indirectly by creating Islamized, Africanized, and Asianized sub-cultures where English people do not thrive. As cities transform the countryside over the long run and not vice versa, that non-English urban culture become more dominant.
Why are your leaders doing this to you?

Where are you originally from Robus?

We have areas local to me in the West Midlands ( Lye near Stourbridge ) which has gone from being a nice area and 99.9% white in the 70’s to now being a dangerous ghetto full of Asians and Romanians.

The Romanians are the bigger problem by far and the place is now around 80-85% ethnic.

Gang fights, drugs, prostitution and people trafficking has become rife.

It was a mile from my house so I moved 5 miles to the countryside 5 years ago.

[Robus]

Where are you originally from Robus?

We have areas local to me in the West Midlands ( Lye near Stourbridge ) which has gone from being a nice area and 99.9% white in the 70’s to now being a dangerous ghetto full of Asians and Romanians.

The Romanians are the bigger problem by far and the place is now around 80-85% ethnic.

Gang fights, drugs, prostitution and people trafficking has become rife.

It was a mile from my house so I moved 5 miles to the countryside 5 years ago.

Texan by birth, Midwesterner by happenstance, American by the grace of God. It's a tragedy, Mick. The English deserved better from their leaders.

The Romanians have fertility rates far below replacement and will disappear from the scene leaving nary a trace. In a generation, Lye will be 90% Muslim non-English, and will have become an anchor for further chain migration and Islamization into surrounding areas.

Really, if you want to see these dynamics at work, go study Greek society of Anatolia in the 1000s and 1100s, or Muslim Andalusia during the first couple of hundred years, before the Reconquista kicked into high gear. Or the Punjab in the time of the Delhi Sultanates. Etc.

As I said, we in the West have forgotten history. History has not forgotten about us.

[kettering_baggie]

There is little or no public debate anymore about immigration; stating one’s opposition to immigration and regretting Britain becoming a multi cultural society will get you ‘cancelled’, maybe even prosecuted for inciting racism. I’m not saying here that I am for or against any aspect of immigration (that’s a separate argument) but it should be possible in a free society to express one’s views, even if it goes against general acceptance, it’s called freedom of speech. Anyway, this has nothing to do with the title of this thread, American gun laws!

[Robus]

The connection between the two is constitutional government and freedom. A government that can disarm you will silence you, and vice versa. And one that will do both will open your borders and flood your country with immigration at levels nobody wanted, and then gaslight you about it. Where you have no right to speak, you have no ability question a corrupt media that has become a mouthpiece of globalist elites and the state.

[baggiematt]

UK black populations are of recent West Indian and African origins. I haven't checked but would guess that family institutions remain intact in those communities, to a greater extent than among American blacks. I hope you are nowhere near our predicament, where 80% of black babies are born outside of marriage. Violent crime rates are highest among black Britons, as is true throughout the West. Immigration from Asia as well as Africa has driven up your crime rates. The trend will continue as your country becomes increasingly Africanized, Asianized, and Islamized.

Have you never considered that poverty causes crime and black minorities have never properly escaped the poverty they have historically been placed in?

A quick Google search tells you that nearly 20% of black Americans are living below the poverty line compared to 8% of white Americans. Similar inequalities are the case in the uk. There’s more than enough evidence around historic marginalisation of black people in America and the UK over the years.

I still struggle to understand your logic for why guns should exist in America and think this blinkered suspicion of other historically oppressed races is what has caused not enough momentum to change gun laws and has cost the lives of innocent children. I honestly believe Robus, that you and many Americans have childrens blood on your hands.

[mickd1961]

It’s a non argument.

The more guns the more shootings, it’s as simple as that.

Anyone can reply with a boringly long post if they wish but it’s that simple.