O/T. To misquote Henry II...

[ramAnag]

...but you might, consciously or not, be looking for it, or at least looking for a Brexit angle to it. You do have 'previous', you did it with the bins thing. Back onto travel in Europe, East Mids was a shambles when Mrs F 'transitted' the other day, MUCH worse than PMI, my Sheff Wed supporting mate spent FIVE HOURS getting through Schipol (and missed his flight by three) yesterday simply because Schipol can't raise the staff, there are anecdotes to be had everywhere, some Brexit, most not.

Well I might...in much the same way as those who defend Brexit might have their eyes closed to it.
You can’t half dredge things up, but your ‘bins thing’ really doesn’t serve your argument well...and if you’re suggesting that Brexit hasn’t CONTRIBUTED to a shortage of certain workers and increased queues for those wishing to travel then I’m afraid you’re just blind to the problems we are faced with.

[Trickytreesreds]

Well I might...in much the same way as those who defend Brexit might have their eyes closed to it.
You can’t half dredge things up, but your ‘bins thing’ really doesn’t serve your argument well...and if you’re suggesting that Brexit hasn’t CONTRIBUTED to a shortage of certain workers and increased queues for those wishing to travel then I’m afraid you’re just blind to the problems we are faced with.

I'm sure Brexit has caused problems somewhere or for someone.
But you can't blame Brexit every time you are inconvenienced in life dude.
It's like the lorry drivers argument. Oh how they wailed, through the land. Until it became obvious that there was a shortage running through Europe. All wages based, with even the east euro drivers realising they were being ripped off, never mind those refusing to make a career of it.

I actually understand you and your personal moans. You go to Europe and have connections, more than Joe Bloggs. So upset you will be.
Like the ex pats, who had their cake and wanted to eat it as well.

I go to Thailand. Do I feel aggrieved, having to have my finger prints/photo taken everytime? No I don't. It's border security.
What the Thais do, is man up every booth, to get you through as quickly as possible. They want my money and me to visit. But they have a job to do.
So do I mind, showing my passport etc? No I don't.
I don't like governments/airports/ check points not doing their job correctly though.

[Andy_Faber]

I'm sure Brexit has caused problems somewhere or for someone.
But you can't blame Brexit every time you are inconvenienced in life dude.
It's like the lorry drivers argument. Oh how they wailed, through the land. Until it became obvious that there was a shortage running through Europe. All wages based, with even the east euro drivers realising they were being ripped off, never mind those refusing to make a career of it.

I actually understand you and your personal moans. You go to Europe and have connections, more than Joe Bloggs. So upset you will be.
Like the ex pats, who had their cake and wanted to eat it as well.

I go to Thailand. Do I feel aggrieved, having to have my finger prints/photo taken everytime? No I don't. It's border security.
What the Thais do, is man up every booth, to get you through as quickly as possible. They want my money and me to visit. But they have a job to do.
So do I mind, showing my passport etc? No I don't.
I don't like governments/airports/ check points not doing their job correctly though.

Supports my point, and yes rA Brexit is in the mix, but most delays are due to staffing, and some but not all of that is because corporations know they can get away with it without the revolution.

[MadAmster]

AF. sorry about your Wendy mate missing his flight. I passed through Schiphol on Sunday en route to Burton for the last ever OBA dinner following the winding up of the association. There were two very large and different queues. Both of which took in excess of 2 hours. I chose, knowing about the queues, to get there 4 hours before my flight. I was able to side step the first queue as I had already checked in online. Instead of having to join a 500+ yard queue outside, I was able to walk straight to the security area where I joined the rear of another 500+ yard queue which took 2 hours to get to the security desks. The airport has 6 x two desks so a max of 12 security desks. 3 of the pairs were not in operation at all leaving 6 open desks. 4 for we plebs and 2 for those with expensive Privium and other expensive membership schemes. Those 2 desks never had more than about 30 people in the queue. A number of people got to the security area with little time to get their plane. When they made that known, their fellow travellers let them through. When I got to about 30 yards from the front of the queue they allowed plebs to use one of the two priority lanes. I was through security in just over 2 hours. My bag failed the xray test due to my CPAP which, for reasons best known to themselves, they decided to swab for narcotics. Twenty minutes to get through passport control.

I felt for the staff. Thy get the brunt of the anger from pi55ed off travellers. The fault lies with the bosses. The Dutch government owns 75% of the shares in Schiphol. During Covid, with less flights, the airport laid off a lot of security people and also baggage handlers. Post Covid when more people started travelling the airport was "surprised" that it was taking a long time to process people at security and that baggage took ages to get to the plane or to the carousel. Flights often leaving with passengers but hardly any suitcases... That came to a head earlier this year so they hired, screened and trained enough to deal with the summer holiday rush. Come the end of the school holidays, what did they do? Yes, you guessed it, they laid them all off again. That is the cause of the current problems. For some of those laid off it was the 2nd time, having also been laid off during Covid. That allied to low wages and changes in procedures where they now have 2 doing what 6 used to do and you understand why the former staff don't want to return.

My return from Birmingham yesterday was a totally different kettle of fish. Again I had checked in online so straight up to security (again 4 hours ahead of my flight). through security and passport control in 40 minutes. 3 and a bit hours to kill so I got an all day breakfast and a few beers in Wetherspoons. Then we got news that the flight was delayed. the news changed every 20 minutes. Having received a message en route to the airport that the plane was expected to land back at Schiphol 15 minutes early due to a favourable wind, the next message was 20 minutes late, then an hour, then 45 minutes. We eventually took off 30 minutes late and landed a mere 10 minutes late at 2030. Sailed through passport control inside 5 minutes. Out to the car park where my lady wife was waiting to drive me home. Got home just after 9 and put RamsTV on. At 21:47 I got another message, the luggage from the flight was now on the carousel. Well pleased I only had hand luggage.

The solution? Schiphol has to start paying more and also reduce the work pressure. Pressure which has also seen quite a lot of staff off work, and they can't be laid off.....

It's a mess and it's not one of the staff's making. It's the Directors and the Government instructions.

[Andy_Faber]

AF. sorry about your Wendy mate missing his flight. I passed through Schiphol on Sunday en route to Burton for the last ever OBA dinner following the winding up of the association. There were two very large and different queues. Both of which took in excess of 2 hours. I chose, knowing about the queues, to get there 4 hours before my flight. I was able to side step the first queue as I had already checked in online. Instead of having to join a 500+ yard queue outside, I was able to walk straight to the security area where I joined the rear of another 500+ yard queue which took 2 hours to get to the security desks. The airport has 6 x two desks so a max of 12 security desks. 3 of the pairs were not in operation at all leaving 6 open desks. 4 for we plebs and 2 for those with expensive Privium and other expensive membership schemes. Those 2 desks never had more than about 30 people in the queue. A number of people got to the security area with little time to get their plane. When they made that known, their fellow travellers let them through. When I got to about 30 yards from the front of the queue they allowed plebs to use one of the two priority lanes. I was through security in just over 2 hours. My bag failed the xray test due to my CPAP which, for reasons best known to themselves, they decided to swab for narcotics. Twenty minutes to get through passport control.

I felt for the staff. Thy get the brunt of the anger from pi55ed off travellers. The fault lies with the bosses. The Dutch government owns 75% of the shares in Schiphol. During Covid, with less flights, the airport laid off a lot of security people and also baggage handlers. Post Covid when more people started travelling the airport was "surprised" that it was taking a long time to process people at security and that baggage took ages to get to the plane or to the carousel. Flights often leaving with passengers but hardly any suitcases... That came to a head earlier this year so they hired, screened and trained enough to deal with the summer holiday rush. Come the end of the school holidays, what did they do? Yes, you guessed it, they laid them all off again. That is the cause of the current problems. For some of those laid off it was the 2nd time, having also been laid off during Covid. That allied to low wages and changes in procedures where they now have 2 doing what 6 used to do and you understand why the former staff don't want to return.

My return from Birmingham yesterday was a totally different kettle of fish. Again I had checked in online so straight up to security (again 4 hours ahead of my flight). through security and passport control in 40 minutes. 3 and a bit hours to kill so I got an all day breakfast and a few beers in Wetherspoons. Then we got news that the flight was delayed. the news changed every 20 minutes. Having received a message en route to the airport that the plane was expected to land back at Schiphol 15 minutes early due to a favourable wind, the next message was 20 minutes late, then an hour, then 45 minutes. We eventually took off 30 minutes late and landed a mere 10 minutes late at 2030. Sailed through passport control inside 5 minutes. Out to the car park where my lady wife was waiting to drive me home. Got home just after 9 and put RamsTV on. At 21:47 I got another message, the luggage from the flight was now on the carousel. Well pleased I only had hand luggage.

The solution? Schiphol has to start paying more and also reduce the work pressure. Pressure which has also seen quite a lot of staff off work, and they can't be laid off.....

It's a mess and it's not one of the staff's making. It's the Directors and the Government instructions.

I'm not as across your country as much as yourself obvs but yes, broadly agree.

[MadAmster]

I'm not as across your country as much as yourself obvs but yes, broadly agree.

We're back over on the 23rd to the 25th. Hopefully things are somewhat better by then but I won't be holding my breath.....

[ramAnag]

I'm sure Brexit has caused problems somewhere or for someone.
But you can't blame Brexit every time you are inconvenienced in life dude.


I go to Thailand. Do I feel aggrieved, having to have my finger prints/photo taken everytime? No I don't. It's border security.
What the Thais do, is man up every booth, to get you through as quickly as possible. They want my money and me to visit. But they have a job to do.
So do I mind, showing my passport etc? No I don't.

Contrary to the picture you and GP wish to paint...I don’t.

I have the same experience as you do in Thailand each time I go to the States and I don’t complain/moan...that however is a ‘red herring’ which misses my point...that being...since Brexit UK travellers to Europe have been seriously inconvenienced. Sure some of what has happened has been down to the pandemic but it’s also been one hell of a smokescreen for those who supported all things Brexit to hide behind in so many ways.

Ask yourself...has it become harder/slower for Brits to travel to Europe since we left the EU? If you honestly suggest it hasn’t I think you’re seriously mistaken.

[MadAmster]

Shortly, you'll need a visa, and have to pay for it to visit EU countries. The UK (with or without Scotland) will reciprocate. That's when having 2 passports comes in handy.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Contrary to the picture you and GP wish to paint...I don’t.

I have the same experience as you do in Thailand each time I go to the States and I don’t complain/moan...that however is a ‘red herring’ which misses my point...that being...since Brexit UK travellers to Europe have been seriously inconvenienced. Sure some of what has happened has been down to the pandemic but it’s also been one hell of a smokescreen for those who supported all things Brexit to hide behind in so many ways.

Ask yourself...has it become harder/slower for Brits to travel to Europe since we left the EU? If you honestly suggest it hasn’t I think you’re seriously mistaken.

I have asked myself and the honest answer, based on a minute sample size, is "no". Your answer is "yes" on an equally minute sample size. We each have different experience. Noone is right, noone is wrong. It suits your agenda to be inconvenienced though, that is the point.

[Trickytreesreds]

Contrary to the picture you and GP wish to paint...I don’t.

I have the same experience as you do in Thailand each time I go to the States and I don’t complain/moan...that however is a ‘red herring’ which misses my point...that being...since Brexit UK travellers to Europe have been seriously inconvenienced. Sure some of what has happened has been down to the pandemic but it’s also been one hell of a smokescreen for those who supported all things Brexit to hide behind in so many ways.

Ask yourself...has it become harder/slower for Brits to travel to Europe since we left the EU? If you honestly suggest it hasn’t I think you’re seriously mistaken.

I think you miss my/our point RA.
We don't care. If I am happy travelling to Thailand and going through their more stringent pass port controls. What makes you think I, or anyone who voted for Brexit thinks a proper border control isn't worth it?
Like I said, If I can put up with the Spanish being arseholes holding a coach up at Gib, after I have travelled through Spanish customs.
Then realistically, the extra time to flick through my passport/stamp it/ ask me a couple of questions, means bugger all really., in the rest of the EU.

You happily do the USA border controls, so I don't see why you're crying with the EU.