Goat

[ramAnag]

Yes...Wanchope’s debut was truly iconic.
Only claimed Ravanelli to be ‘overated’ not ‘hated’. To me he wasn’t a team player. It was all about him and he continued to cost us a fortune after he’d left.
Best player or GOAT is a bit of a waste of time for the reasons MA has suggested.
You can’t compare a striker with a keeper for instance...on the subject of which...Shilton is an interesting one. Capable of greatness undoubtedly but also flawed imo...personally I preferred Poom (for skill) and Martin Taylor (for attitude) and I very much doubt Shilts would have made it in the more modern game, let alone played for England, given his very limited ability with the ball at his feet.

[Ramshank72]

Yes...Wanchope’s debut was truly iconic.
Only claimed Ravanelli to be ‘overated’ not ‘hated’. To me he wasn’t a team player. It was all about him and he continued to cost us a fortune after he’d left.
Best player or GOAT is a bit of a waste of time for the reasons MA has suggested.
You can’t compare a striker with a keeper for instance...on the subject of which...Shilton is an interesting one. Capable of greatness undoubtedly but also flawed imo...personally I preferred Poom (for skill) and Martin Taylor (for attitude) and I very much doubt Shilts would have made it in the more modern game, let alone played for England, given his very limited ability with the ball at his feet.

I think MA said hated... just checked, "least liked". He was just a bit weird for me, but you're right, we suffered from that purchase.
Agree on the GOAT thing, though to keep it interesting, we could consider a GOAT to be a single player who had the most impact on a team. For example, we could say Dave McKay for his impact on the team, despite not being the most exciting or trickiest. It's on that same basis that I don't rate Messi or Ronaldo as GOATs, as they don't have that same impact on the team. Messi in particular, just plays for himself, and Portugal's performances were better without Ronaldo.
I would give Martinez the player of the world cup award, for me he had more impact than any other individual.

[ramAnag]

I think MA said hated... just checked, "least liked". He was just a bit weird for me, but you're right, we suffered from that purchase.
Agree on the GOAT thing, though to keep it interesting, we could consider a GOAT to be a single player who had the most impact on a team. For example, we could say Dave McKay for his impact on the team, despite not being the most exciting or trickiest. It's on that same basis that I don't rate Messi or Ronaldo as GOATs, as they don't have that same impact on the team. Messi in particular, just plays for himself, and Portugal's performances were better without Ronaldo.
I would give Martinez the player of the world cup award, for me he had more impact than any other individual.

I never saw Mackay play for Derby...but I take your point and love the image of the man...uncompromising but honest, fair and tough as teak.
Saw the likes of McFarland - although he was dreadfully injury prone - Hector, Hinton, Todd etc and they were all great players.
MA mentioned Steve Powell who I know slightly. Maybe underrated...certainly under rewarded as a player who gave everything for Derby but has suffered, in terms of mobility, since.

Agree about Martinez as player of the tournament, although Mbappé might have challenged him had France won. Fine lines.