The class of 2009/10 vs the class of 2022/23

[Elite_Pie]

Rodrigues over Davies

To pinch one of your posts from earlier today:

That doesn't surprise me.

If it was Ruben against any of Pele, Maradona or Messi I think we could guess your answer!

It's just that Ben Davies went on to play loads of games in the Championship, while Ruben's career over here has been spent three divisions below. Same as Macca I think Ruben is definitely capable of playing higher, just not sure it's as high as Ben Davies managed.

[legs77]

Brilliant questions, but I’ve had beer, red wine and now on the rum so I’ll answer tomorrow (maybe) along with the goals and attendance question.

Hughes all day as like Elite says he performed to a much higher level.

I’d go Davies as he did it in the championship / league one we don’t really know if Ruben could although I suspect he could play league one for sure.

Not sure many would make the side of 2010 and it depends on the formation but we got even better when Facey came into that side due to his strength and holding the ball up perfect foil for Hughes though be hard to leave Langstaff out.

Palmer Ruben Langstaff are the only three I would give a chance of starting games.

[jacobncfc]

Perspective required. Did the Munto squad have the luxury of playing teams like Maidstone, Maidenhead, Gateshead, Altrincham, Dorking etc?

It’s hard to directly compare, but even since 2009 there’s been such a further influx of big money and foreign signings into the top two (and even the top of the third) tiers that I suspect the quality of tier five now is probably comparable to tier four back then.

It’s also hard to compare because they’re very different teams. The Munto team was eight hard-working, honest lower league journeymen who were well-organised and three players in Schmeichel, Davies and Hughes who were there because we promised them money they didn’t have and ‘reasons’ in the latter’s case.

Lots of that team would be useless in this one, even at a lower level. The entire back four were very limited on the ball, Ravenhill I loved but he couldn’t cope with the amount of passing he’d have to do etc. Davies’ success was based on his dead ball delivery and crossing from deep/wide, which this team actively tries to avoid most of the time etc. But would Ruben be as good shoehorned into a traditional 4-4-2? As we saw under Ardley, absolutely not.

I think you can say Hughes and Langstaff would score loads of goals in either team, though, ‘cos that’s just what they do.

[jacobncfc]

Palmer Ruben Langstaff are the only three I would give a chance of starting games.

All depends how you play. Graeme Lee would’ve been a disaster in a team playing the high line we do now.

I think it’s easy to forget how limited some of that team was outside of the stars. Chicksen is a much more rounded left back than Stephen Hunt (who I liked a lot) was, and equally I’m taking Jones or Austin over Westcarr.

[legs77]

All depends how you play. Graeme Lee would’ve been a disaster in a team playing the high line we do now.

I think it’s easy to forget how limited some of that team was outside of the stars. Chicksen is a much more rounded left back than Stephen Hnt (who I liked a lot) was, and equally I’m taking Jones or Austin over Westcarr.

True but I go off what I see and Lee is aerially better than what we have now and a better CB at defending which is what I like.

Id still go Westcarr due to number of positions he could play and he scores more.

Limited players are sometimes what you need Ravenhill may not be good on the ball but he didnt stop running and was superb at winning it.

Football in general has changed loads in 10 years especially lower down as teams play more football than they used to.

[MancMagpie]

I think some people are forgetting that Langstaff scored 30 plus goals for Gateshead from the wing. Yes, the wing. Then has been adapted as a poacher by LW and banged in 40. In the modern game I'd take Langstaff over Hughes any day of the week.

The interesting question for me is this.

Does LW Notts of now beat SC Notts of then, both in their prime?
The answer is yes for me.

I reluctantly answered this thread because I hate these kind of comparisons. The time difference is so big that its impossible to say. However, it's just a bit of fun! So there we are.

[the_anticlough]

Tough questions as most have said,....probably requiring a tough response to guard against recency bias.

- Munto was a whole league higher and they stormed into League 1 and held their own there - despite Trew's dodgy appointments and recruitment, which we can see in hindsight, but was no fault of the team that won the title

- we've achieved nothing yet


On the specific questions I'd say...

1) Hughes proved himself a prolific scorer at all all levels and not just in promotion teams, we're not talking about L6 and trips to Spennymoor here. Maca could realise his potential and dreams up the ladder and still not come close to Hughsey. And what would he have done if it wasn't for those years in the clink?

2) At the risk of contradicting some of the above I have to go for Ruben. You could say Davies' career peaked at Notts and there was a lot of lower league and non-league on his resume. At Ruben's age now he hadn't even arrived at Notts but would go on to play another 13 years! There was something of the journeyman about him...
Ruben is a rarer gem, and in terms of role and style he's an on-the-quiet entertainer in the Frank Worthington, Stan Bowles, Tony Currie mould. If he gets us promoted next year he's in the same place Davies was at the same age. We can't discount the level he played in Dutch football too and the fact he's already got 250% the goals and assists that Davies had for us...It's not just the style, he's been bloody prolific in terms of goal contributions since he joined us.

3) A joint team? We'll have to respect the Munto level and achievement and go 4-4-2

Kasper
Thompson Lee Edwards Chicksen
Rodrigues Palmer Bishop Davies
Hughes Langstaff

No problem at all putting in our guys Ruben, Matty and Maca over Ravenhill, Westcarr and Rodgers which says an awful lot about them.

[keldsyke]

I think some people are forgetting that Langstaff scored 30 plus goals for Gateshead from the wing. Yes, the wing. Then has been adapted as a poacher by LW and banged in 40. In the modern game I'd take Langstaff over Hughes any day of the week.

The interesting question for me is this.

Does LW Notts of now beat SC Notts of then, both in their prime?
The answer is yes for me.

I reluctantly answered this thread because I hate these kind of comparisons. The time difference is so big that it’s impossible to say. However, it's just a bit of fun! So there we are.

Just because you can be exceptional at one level doesn’t mean you’re skills are necessarily be the same at the next level up, that’s how people in sport find their ‘level’, until you have proved yourself st higher levels tbere is no way that you can say someone at a lower level is better than someone who has proved themselves. By your reckoning you could say someone playing at Clifton All Whites who’s scored 50 goals in a season in midfield is better than Rodrigues, it’s only relevant at the performance level at the time.

[laddo]

To pinch one of your posts from earlier today:



If it was Ruben against any of Pele, Maradona or Messi I think we could guess your answer!

It's just that Ben Davies went on to play loads of games in the Championship, while Ruben's career over here has been spent three divisions below. Same as Macca I think Ruben is definitely capable of playing higher, just not sure it's as high as Ben Davies managed.

And just like the earlier post, nor should it.

If you factor in the level both sides were at then the naturally the 2009/10 have a significant advantage and built in bias. Plus as you point the 09/10 players have the advantage of finishing their careers to look back on.

Did me Davies was a top end L1 player, with top end Championship dead ball delivery. Ruben is a better player and has more ability in open play IMO.

Although as you know I've been a big fan Ruben's since spotting his talen in the days of the online streams during the pandemic. A very early bandwagoner , you could say, but Maradona would get the nod.

[laddo]

Just because you can be exceptional at one level doesn’t mean you’re skills are necessarily be the same at the next level up, that’s how people in sport find their ‘level’, until you have proved yourself st higher levels tbere is no way that you can say someone at a lower level is better than someone who has proved themselves. By your reckoning you could say someone playing at Clifton All Whites who’s scored 50 goals in a season in midfield is better than Rodrigues, it’s only relevant at the performance level at the time.

A very valid point. However if we can't compare Notts footballers of different eras who played at different levels, same applies to managers, owners etc then you are taking away an interesting hypothetical topic to discuss.

It's just a bit of fun tand good to see people's thoughts.