Maynard In/Out/Shake it all about, Richard Montague's Recruitment, Cundy's Hip etc.

[upthemaggies]

L2 is there for the taking next season.

This calendar year, Doncaster Rovers have collected 20 points more than Notts have, Crewe 18 more, Walsall 16, Gillingham 15, Tranmere 11, Bradford 10, Swindon 4. Most or all of those clubs will be in L2 next season seeking to improve their squads in the summer, all of them being able to claim with some justification that they should be at least challenging for a place in League One if not actually in it. One of the current top 4 could also miss out in the play offs.
The 2024 points gap implies they all have a head start on us, considerably so in some cases, in being ready for next August.

[matt_magpie]

Just do not think they will - i mean SM is thw worst manager ever - yet they still stick with him - WHY?
They stuck with Ardley for 2 years and what did that achieve- then Burchanll. The fact is the owners apart from LW have made poor choices for head coach -
that being said we have a lot to thank them for, coming in and saving the club , and getting us out the NL
But in this case the best scenerio is they stick with SM next season and we under achieve- eventually sacking him after wasting one or two years, or the worst is we are dragged into a relegation battle, putting everything they achieved under threat ,and if we went down all the good work will be undone- and then i could see the owners pulling out.
One thing that has become evident in the last 20 years is that running a club in the EFL league 1 or 2 is no easy task, as we saw with the trust, Trew , Hardy and now the current owners. It is hard work for a club to break even , in fact up to 75% of clubs are running at a loss, only propped up by owners cash, the qustion you have to ask is what do the owners actually get out of running an EFL club, therte is no prsestige like in the premier ?

I can’t agree, keeping Ardley in my opinion at the time almost turned into a master stroke in keeping continuity, they came in late pre season with the ownership takeover, we were fixture heavy that first 2 months with a threadbare squad and it cost us and yet we were 90 mins away from an instant return, had Rawlinson not got covid before the playoffs I think we may have made it as he was a class act that season.

Second season it was clear we weren’t playing the football they wanted or achieving what they believed we should with the squad and they made the change. I agree Burchnall wasn’t the man really and I don’t think they stood in his way one bit. LW obviously a great appointment. SM at the moment appears a disaster, but when people say we were 6th, I’d probably re-frame it we were 6th down from 1st, we were clearly cracking.
They’ve put 16m quid in now, it’s a crazy amount at this level ignoring Wrexham, I don’t think they’ve get have egos but they’re just not going to be emotional with a decision.
A lot of people said we should have got Luke Gerrard, he was probably the most brought up name a couple of months ago, today he was sacked by BW, sat in the relegation spots just a year after running us to the wire in the playoffs, footballs not a science with a lot a variables and a lot that goes on off the field and that’s what they need to get as stronger view as they can possibly do to take whatever action.

[Davy500]

** this original reply was lost as my login timed out as I wrote it - I see others have made sensible comments since but I'll re-post it anyway **

Trew and Hardy wanted a vanity project, noting that Hardy already had the Cotgrave Golf Club which he cheekily renamed "The Nottinghamshire".

The Bros believe they can take underperforming and undervalued assets, based on their statistical information, and turn them into successful and profitable assets. Notts, especially once relegation was confirmed, met their price valuation. They would have made profits from Burchnall Rodrigues and Williams. There are a number of our players who will make a tidy sum if sold at the right time. The Bros have no inherent interest in Notts in the way that most of us here have. They are playing a numbers game based on their strategy. By all accounts they are intent on playing that game long term and they will accept ups and downs. Success will not come with the expectation of being a smooth straight line upwards the same as no financial investor will expect the value of their stocks to go up linearly every day/week/month or even year.

They will be learning as they go along, absorbing, discussing with competent people. I'm sure they realise that they've underestimated League Two. Was it someone on the Magpie Circle who was taken aback at how different League Two is now to when we were last there?

It sounds very much, listening to Mace, that Stuart is here for next season and I'd assume that there will be a ramping up of the defensive recruitment to give him half a chance and if he fails with that, and a full close season, then the axe will fall.

Look, let's hope he's learnt from this lean spell and we knock out 3 or 4 wins from our remaining games. mmm - do pigs fly at night?

I get the model the brothers use because it saves cash - but buying under performing, in experienced coaches and players will not work in L2, in fact with the coach its worked 1 time out of 4, and the same with players there is only a handfull that are really good players, many more have been average to poor
Fine if this is the model the owners wish to use, but we as supporters should get use to mid table or lower ( with a threat of Relegationn) most years , and perhaps 1 in 4 if they unearth a rising star in a coach or players we might challenge for automatic or playoofs
Most supporters expecting Notts are a big club and should be pushing for promotion will have to learn to be satisfied with less i think

[Davy500]

I can’t agree, keeping Ardley in my opinion at the time almost turned into a master stroke in keeping continuity, they came in late pre season with the ownership takeover, we were fixture heavy that first 2 months with a threadbare squad and it cost us and yet we were 90 mins away from an instant return, had Rawlinson not got covid before the playoffs I think we may have made it as he was a class act that season.

Second season it was clear we weren’t playing the football they wanted or achieving what they believed we should with the squad and they made the change. I agree Burchnall wasn’t the man really and I don’t think they stood in his way one bit. LW obviously a great appointment. SM at the moment appears a disaster, but when people say we were 6th, I’d probably re-frame it we were 6th down from 1st, we were clearly cracking.
They’ve put 16m quid in now, it’s a crazy amount at this level ignoring Wrexham, I don’t think they’ve get have egos but they’re just not going to be emotional with a decision.
A lot of people said we should have got Luke Gerrard, he was probably the most brought up name a couple of months ago, today he was sacked by BW, sat in the relegation spots just a year after running us to the wire in the playoffs, footballs not a science with a lot a variables and a lot that goes on off the field and that’s what they need to get as stronger view as they can possibly do to take whatever action.

Do not think we will ever agree on Ardley
For me one of the worst ever Notts Managers- relegated us after being 7 points ahead of Macclesfield who were in as much or bigger trouble off field ., to defensive , always playing for the point never for the win , SEEMS BIT LIKE SM Then failing in 2 attempts to get us promoted- i relly believe that a better coach would have got us promoted 1st time. Put it this way if LW had been the head coach for our 1st season in the NL would he have done better ??

[Davy500]

Absolutely nailed it. We would never know for certain, but I'm with UTM with this.

The Brothers may have thought, we'll give him a go, because he'd be grateful for the step up and with all we have in place, it will work. If it doesn't work, Notts will finish mid-table at the worse.

Hmm....we're are we currently?

We are not mid table though are we since LW left - we are 17th masked by a good start , in fact we are bottom - 24th from the last 10 matches let that sink in
Last 10 Form Table (EFL League Two)
# Team MP W D L GF GA GD Pts Last 10 PPG CS FTS BTTS Over 2.5
1 Doncaster Rovers FC Badge Doncaster Rovers FC 10 7 2 1 19 8 11 23
WWWWWDLWWD
2.30 50% 0% 50% 40%
2 Crawley Town FC Badge Crawley Town FC 10 7 1 2 16 7 9 22
WLWDWWLWWW
2.20 40% 20% 40% 40%
3 Walsall FC Badge Walsall FC 10 6 2 2 16 13 3 20
WLDDLWWWWW
2.00 20% 20% 60% 60%
4 Milton Keynes Dons FC Badge Milton Keynes Dons FC 10 5 2 3 20 14 6 17
DWLWLWWLWD
1.70 20% 30% 50% 70%
5 Sutton United FC Badge Sutton United FC 10 5 2 3 15 11 4 17
WWWWLDLWDL
1.70 10% 30% 60% 40%
6 Stockport County FC Badge Stockport County FC 10 4 4 2 14 10 4 16
WWWDDWDDLL
1.60 60% 30% 30% 50%
7 Mansfield Town FC Badge Mansfield Town FC 10 5 1 4 27 15 12 16
LDWLWLWWLW
1.60 10% 10% 80% 70%
8 Wrexham FC Badge Wrexham FC 10 4 3 3 14 7 7 15
LWWLDWWDLD
1.50 30% 40% 40% 30%
9 Bradford City AFC Badge Bradford City AFC 10 4 2 4 13 15 -2 14
DWLLLLWDWW
1.40 40% 30% 30% 50%
10 Tranmere Rovers FC Badge Tranmere Rovers FC 10 4 2 4 12 12 0 14
DLLWWDWLLW
1.40 30% 20% 50% 40%
11 Barrow AFC Badge Barrow AFC 10 4 2 4 14 13 1 14
LWWDDWWLLL
1.40 40% 20% 50% 40%
12 Gillingham FC Badge Gillingham FC 10 3 4 3 9 13 -4 13
LDWDLDLWWD
1.30 40% 40% 40% 20%
13 Morecambe FC Badge Morecambe FC 10 4 1 5 16 22 -6 13
WWLLLLWWDL
1.30 10% 10% 80% 80%
14 Forest Green Rovers FC Badge Forest Green Rovers FC 10 4 1 5 9 10 -1 13
WLLLWWLDWL
1.30 40% 50% 10% 20%
15 AFC Wimbledon Badge AFC Wimbledon 10 3 3 4 7 7 0 12
LDDLWWDWLL
1.20 40% 50% 20% 0%
16 Crewe Alexandra FC Badge Crewe Alexandra FC 10 3 3 4 11 14 -3 12
LDDLWLLWDW
1.20 30% 40% 50% 50%
17 Newport County AFC Badge Newport County AFC 10 4 0 6 13 16 -3 12
LLLWWLLWLW
1.20 20% 50% 30% 50%
18 Harrogate Town FC Badge Harrogate Town FC 10 2 5 3 12 11 1 11
WDWDDLDLLD
1.10 40% 40% 50% 40%
19 Salford City FC Badge Salford City FC 10 3 2 5 17 22 -5 11
LLWWDLLDLW
1.10 0% 10% 90% 80%
20 Grimsby Town FC Badge Grimsby Town FC 10 2 5 3 9 15 -6 11
DLLDWDDWDL
1.10 30% 10% 70% 30%
21 Colchester United FC Badge Colchester United FC 10 1 7 2 11 13 -2 10
DWDDLDDDLD
1.00 0% 20% 80% 20%
22 Swindon Town FC Badge Swindon Town FC 10 2 3 5 14 17 -3 9
LWLLLDWDLD
0.90 10% 10% 90% 80%
23 Accrington Stanley FC Badge Accrington Stanley FC 10 2 2 6 10 19 -9 8
LLDWLLLLDW
0.80 10% 30% 60% 70%
24 Notts County FC Badge Notts County FC 10 1 2 7 15 21 -6 5
DLLWDLLLLL
0.50 10% 20% 70% 80%

[Davy500]

** this original reply was lost as my login timed out as I wrote it - I see others have made sensible comments since but I'll re-post it anyway **

Trew and Hardy wanted a vanity project, noting that Hardy already had the Cotgrave Golf Club which he cheekily renamed "The Nottinghamshire".

The Bros believe they can take underperforming and undervalued assets, based on their statistical information, and turn them into successful and profitable assets. Notts, especially once relegation was confirmed, met their price valuation. They would have made profits from Burchnall Rodrigues and Williams. There are a number of our players who will make a tidy sum if sold at the right time. The Bros have no inherent interest in Notts in the way that most of us here have. They are playing a numbers game based on their strategy. By all accounts they are intent on playing that game long term and they will accept ups and downs. Success will not come with the expectation of being a smooth straight line upwards the same as no financial investor will expect the value of their stocks to go up linearly every day/week/month or even year.

They will be learning as they go along, absorbing, discussing with competent people. I'm sure they realise that they've underestimated League Two. Was it someone on the Magpie Circle who was taken aback at how different League Two is now to when we were last there?

It sounds very much, listening to Mace, that Stuart is here for next season and I'd assume that there will be a ramping up of the defensive recruitment to give him half a chance and if he fails with that, and a full close season, then the axe will fall.

Look, let's hope he's learnt from this lean spell and we knock out 3 or 4 wins from our remaining games. mmm - do pigs fly at night?

League 2 is exactly the same as when we were last there- its because we were away for 54 years we forgot how we are not guaranteed a play off place like in the NL All mistakes and weaknesses will be punished every time at this level as we have seen recently

[Davy500]

League 2 is exactly the same as when we were last there- its because we were away for 54 years we forgot how we are not guaranteed a play off place like in the NL All mistakes and weaknesses will be punished every time at this level as we have seen recently

In fact we have struggled at L2 level for around 20 years accross several owners.

[Lullapie]

We are not mid table though are we since LW left - we are 17th masked by a good start , in fact we are bottom - 24th from the last 10 matches let that sink in
Last 10 Form Table (EFL League Two)
# Team MP W D L GF GA GD Pts Last 10 PPG CS FTS BTTS Over 2.5
1 Doncaster Rovers FC Badge Doncaster Rovers FC 10 7 2 1 19 8 11 23
WWWWWDLWWD
2.30 50% 0% 50% 40%
2 Crawley Town FC Badge Crawley Town FC 10 7 1 2 16 7 9 22
WLWDWWLWWW
2.20 40% 20% 40% 40%
3 Walsall FC Badge Walsall FC 10 6 2 2 16 13 3 20
WLDDLWWWWW
2.00 20% 20% 60% 60%
4 Milton Keynes Dons FC Badge Milton Keynes Dons FC 10 5 2 3 20 14 6 17
DWLWLWWLWD
1.70 20% 30% 50% 70%
5 Sutton United FC Badge Sutton United FC 10 5 2 3 15 11 4 17
WWWWLDLWDL
1.70 10% 30% 60% 40%
6 Stockport County FC Badge Stockport County FC 10 4 4 2 14 10 4 16
WWWDDWDDLL
1.60 60% 30% 30% 50%
7 Mansfield Town FC Badge Mansfield Town FC 10 5 1 4 27 15 12 16
LDWLWLWWLW
1.60 10% 10% 80% 70%
8 Wrexham FC Badge Wrexham FC 10 4 3 3 14 7 7 15
LWWLDWWDLD
1.50 30% 40% 40% 30%
9 Bradford City AFC Badge Bradford City AFC 10 4 2 4 13 15 -2 14
DWLLLLWDWW
1.40 40% 30% 30% 50%
10 Tranmere Rovers FC Badge Tranmere Rovers FC 10 4 2 4 12 12 0 14
DLLWWDWLLW
1.40 30% 20% 50% 40%
11 Barrow AFC Badge Barrow AFC 10 4 2 4 14 13 1 14
LWWDDWWLLL
1.40 40% 20% 50% 40%
12 Gillingham FC Badge Gillingham FC 10 3 4 3 9 13 -4 13
LDWDLDLWWD
1.30 40% 40% 40% 20%
13 Morecambe FC Badge Morecambe FC 10 4 1 5 16 22 -6 13
WWLLLLWWDL
1.30 10% 10% 80% 80%
14 Forest Green Rovers FC Badge Forest Green Rovers FC 10 4 1 5 9 10 -1 13
WLLLWWLDWL
1.30 40% 50% 10% 20%
15 AFC Wimbledon Badge AFC Wimbledon 10 3 3 4 7 7 0 12
LDDLWWDWLL
1.20 40% 50% 20% 0%
16 Crewe Alexandra FC Badge Crewe Alexandra FC 10 3 3 4 11 14 -3 12
LDDLWLLWDW
1.20 30% 40% 50% 50%
17 Newport County AFC Badge Newport County AFC 10 4 0 6 13 16 -3 12
LLLWWLLWLW
1.20 20% 50% 30% 50%
18 Harrogate Town FC Badge Harrogate Town FC 10 2 5 3 12 11 1 11
WDWDDLDLLD
1.10 40% 40% 50% 40%
19 Salford City FC Badge Salford City FC 10 3 2 5 17 22 -5 11
LLWWDLLDLW
1.10 0% 10% 90% 80%
20 Grimsby Town FC Badge Grimsby Town FC 10 2 5 3 9 15 -6 11
DLLDWDDWDL
1.10 30% 10% 70% 30%
21 Colchester United FC Badge Colchester United FC 10 1 7 2 11 13 -2 10
DWDDLDDDLD
1.00 0% 20% 80% 20%
22 Swindon Town FC Badge Swindon Town FC 10 2 3 5 14 17 -3 9
LWLLLDWDLD
0.90 10% 10% 90% 80%
23 Accrington Stanley FC Badge Accrington Stanley FC 10 2 2 6 10 19 -9 8
LLDWLLLLDW
0.80 10% 30% 60% 70%
24 Notts County FC Badge Notts County FC 10 1 2 7 15 21 -6 5
DLLWDLLLLL
0.50 10% 20% 70% 80%

Wow, did you even read what I wrote? I'm not defending SM as manager. In fact from the start I believed it was a terrible appointment. He is as much to blame though for accepting the role.

Read my post again and then calm down....

[Davy500]

Wow, did you even read what I wrote? I'm not defending SM as manager. In fact from the start I believed it was a terrible appointment. He is as much to blame though for accepting the role.

Read my post again and then calm down....

Interesting i do not blame SM for taking the job, its a big step up in terms of money and the oppurtunities it might bring. The same as i didnt bleme LW. Its called life everybody wants to play at the highest level
having said that SM was taking a risk, due to Notts being a big club expecting to be pushing for promotion, and following a good coach in LW, so he was upagainst it from the start

[ThaiPie]

Interesting i do not blame SM for taking the job, its a big step up in terms of money and the oppurtunities it might bring. The same as i didnt bleme LW. Its called life everybody wants to play at the highest level
having said that SM was taking a risk, due to Notts being a big club expecting to be pushing for promotion, and following a good coach in LW, so he was upagainst it from the start

LW said in his December 2023 interview that the squad were working hard to eliminate the calamitous errors costing Notts points. That obviously didn't work. SM has also worked on the same problem, but has also been unable to fix the problem - to date.

So is it the Managers or the players?

If I'm to apportion blame, it would be something like:

Recruitment 50%*, Players 30% and Management 20%

And against MKD, Notts put in a competitive performance against one of the better teams.

I believe, If you put a good goalkeeper and two dominant center backs in this team, ......we're challengers again.


*Only caveat, I'm blaming recruitment, but we don't know what limits the recruitment team are operating under. It's possible there were no suitable players available, given necessary financial restrictions.