State Pension

[mickd1961]

Totally agree 123. I am over 60 but feel for your generation and the one below with everything including getting on the housing ladder and education plus costly bills. My mother in law who is getting on even agrees on this one.

Rishi has paid into his state pension - does he need it? I have never had a day off in my life and paid into my pension - do I need it? No!

Do the elderly and less well off need help? Yes!

Never had a day off in your life!!? 🤣🤣🤣

You’ve been telling us all you’ve been “retired” for months and you’ve only recently hit 60!

You’re in Florida every few weeks! 🤣🤣

[baggiematt]

Never had a day off in your life!!? 🤣🤣🤣

You’ve been telling us all you’ve been “retired” for months and you’ve only recently hit 60!

You’re in Florida every few weeks! 🤣🤣

He must be getting paid for moaning about illegals, and Karlan Grant 😆

[kettering_baggie]

You are right about properties 123. The younger generation have got it so much harder getting on the property ladder and funding education. It was easy for me in the 80’s as was many things.

I do agree though the elderly should be looked after better - free tv licences - priority for operations - discounted heating and council tax all means tested. Many elderly only have one person per property but pay the same council
tax as a family of four!

Are advocating the resurrection of the Poll Tax?

[kettering_baggie]

Don’t forget the worst Chancellor this country has ever had, the wretched Gordon Brown, who f****d up the pensions industry, as well as the aforementioned gold giveaway.

[DaveP67 is back!]

Interesting Dave, I didn’t know this.

I started work on July 3rd 1978, I’ve never had a single day of unemployment.

Link below Mick

https://www.gov.uk/check-state-pension

[WBA123]

Gordon Brown sold off our gold reserves for peanuts and presided over a sh it show economically so let’s not go down that route.

I want my pension and I want it in full, I distribute my wealth around my own family to help them, I trust me more than I trust any government.

I will use my pension to help fund university for my grandchildren should they decide to go.

I agree, I want my pension in full too. But something has to give somewhere, we have a massive black hole in the finances in this country due to Government waste, Brexit and an ageing population. So what gives? Do we just leave this mess for the next generation to inherit?

By the way, the value of Gold loss is a drop in the ocean in comparison to Covid and Brexit losses.

[baggieal]

I agree, I want my pension in full too. But something has to give somewhere, we have a massive black hole in the finances in this country due to Government waste, Brexit and an ageing population. So what gives? Do we just leave this mess for the next generation to inherit?

By the way, the value of Gold loss is a drop in the ocean in comparison to Covid and Brexit losses.

I want mine too but in situations like mean testing it’s always - do you/they need it! Wanting it and needing it are two different things!

I bet Rishi wants it too! Where do you draw the line when there’s a black hole! Why would many demand something when they don’t need it?

[wbaliquidator]

So, the funding for our Pensions has always been basically based on a Ponzi or Pyramid scheme.
Well let’s encourage the youth to breed like crazy then.
Oh, I forgot that most of the births are with the socially dependant. Oh well.
Hang on what about all the various contributions a pensioner has made during their working life. NI Both Employer and Employee then the income Tax, Vat and Business Taxes then other stealth Taxes like moving home etc etc.
Recipients of the state pension appear to be labelled similar to those who collect government handouts via unemployment and other benefits and this is very unfair.
Means test ok but let’s make it for those who have assets over 5 million.

[Omegstrat6]

Both state pensions and the NHS are no longer "fit for purpose" in terms of being able to now achieve their aims. In both cases this is primarily driven by a change in the country's demographics where we now have a far higher population than we did in 1948 and one with a far higher proportion of people over working age. In addition, since the creation of the NHS there have been massive advancements in medicine whether in drugs or medical procedures which all come at ever increasing costs. With a smaller working age population (including a percentage of which never seen before who are not deemed fit enough to work ) having to support an increasingly older age group, the finances simply do not add up and are unsustainable going forward.

I get that, having worked all their lives and having paid their "stamp" people might expect their full state pension regardless of how well off they are but I think we have to remind ourselves as to the reasons why pensions for "ordinary" working people and the Welfare State were brought into being in the first place-to help provide a safety net for the poorest in society. That, surely, remains the key aim?

Both the state pension and NHS are largely funded through National Insurance. The clue is in the name-insurance. It is to help provide a service for when you need it. We insure our cars, houses, pets-do we expect to get all the money we pay into these back if we haven't made a claim?

I do not subscribe to the Tory lie that if you simply work hard then the financial rewards will be there. Whilst I doubt very much that (unless you come from a monied family with inherited wealth) those who now have a relatively prosperous life style in retirement have not worked hard to achieve it, remember that circumstances can lead to financial changes for all of us. You may be quite well off at one point but by the time you get to retirement age things may be quite different.

Given the unsustainability of the current systems that fund both the State pension and NHS, I can see no other option than a form of means testing in order to be able to continue both. The important thing should be that this is a graded system however to make things as fair as possible. I get that those who have worked hard and are now comfortable will be angry that they may then get a much reduced state pension in order to help fund some who have never worked into their old age but the latter would surely be a minority and current data clearly indicates that those who work in poorly paid jobs are the worst off. I would also, of course, remove the gold plated pensions that the public services get. So many pension schemes have been greatly eroded in the private sector so why should these same tax payers enable the continuation of final salary schemes for public service workers?

As Al says, there is a big difference between wanting and needing. If people are comfortable in their retirement, have paid their mortgage off on a nice house, can afford to run a nice car and have a holiday or two each year thanks to a decent private pension then do they really need the state one on top of this when the money could go towards those in far more need?

Ideally, it would be nice for anyone, regardless of how well off they are, who have paid their wack into NI to get their full state pension back in return but I think that this is simply not financially viable now if the very idea of a state pension can continue.

[WBA123]

So, the funding for our Pensions has always been basically based on a Ponzi or Pyramid scheme.
Well let’s encourage the youth to breed like crazy then.
Oh, I forgot that most of the births are with the socially dependant. Oh well.
Hang on what about all the various contributions a pensioner has made during their working life. NI Both Employer and Employee then the income Tax, Vat and Business Taxes then other stealth Taxes like moving home etc etc.
Recipients of the state pension appear to be labelled similar to those who collect government handouts via unemployment and other benefits and this is very unfair.
Means test ok but let’s make it for those who have assets over 5 million.

Your first sentence hit the issue square on, it is like a Ponzi scheme.

If you have paid in your whole life, you haven't put that towards your own pension, you've put it towards those who are current pensioners when you were working. When you receive your pension, that is coming from people who are working today - there is no pot you've built up, that has already been taken.

And the major problem with this, is that people are living longer and birth rates are not increasing.