OT - Manchester again.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Ootenorn (Wooten Wawen to those unnfamiliar with local dialect) or Henley??

Was in Brum for 6 years at Uni and first job. Mostly used to live in Hall Green and when going to see my parents (ie to get washing done) used to get the Oxford bus via Stratford and get off at Shipston on Stour

many concerts at the odeon too - Santana, Mahavishnu stand out in memory and I think saw Gong there although may have been elsewhere in town.

barbarellas was **** though - as you say too expensive for a student budget so very rarely visited

[Andy_Faber]

I imagine you’re talking of Lucy Connolly (not Collins) and we’ve been down this road before. It’s my opinion that someone who actively encourages what she did deserves what she got. Nothing remotely like ‘1984’.

Are you suggesting that her behaviour and what she advocated/incited was acceptable? Are you suggesting there was no ‘black hole’ inherited by Labour last year or that, following the banking crisis there wasn’t 14 years of Government incompetence? Five PM’s in that period might suggest otherwise.

If you are we disagree, but I’m really not sure of your point and I’m sorry but I don’t really understand your Row Z/mosh pit analogy regarding religion either.

You totally missed my point(s) here rA and I?m only replying out of politeness as I?ve not been around to reply, there?s no point putting you right as the conversation has moved on

[Geoff Parkstone]

responding to rA and TTR debate on stats for arrests, the pro Palestine Action march seems to have surpassed belief / all records. Approximatley 1000 protestors and so far "at least 355" arrests (per BBC website). The authorities requested they respect the dead by cancelling - they seem to have found their own very special way to disrespect them all on their own. Bunch of c****. it also questions Starmer's authority that noone has taken any notice of his, perfectly reasonable, request.

[Andy_Faber]

responding to rA and TTR debate on stats for arrests, the pro Palestine Action march seems to have surpassed belief / all records. Approximatley 1000 protestors and so far "at least 355" arrests (per BBC website). The authorities requested they respect the dead by cancelling - they seem to have found their own very special way to disrespect them all on their own. Bunch of c****. it also questions Starmer's authority that noone has taken any notice of his, perfectly reasonable, request.

Looking across the pond, lack of respect for the dead is having its consequences - many thousands have expressed various levels of delight at the death of Charlie Kirk, as is their free-speech right, and those same people are feeling the consequences in being removed from office / employment / collapse of their businesses as a result, in fact I?m aware that there are websites set up to achieve such a purpose. Not sure that will spread to UK, but surely, as someone who repeatedly lists the wrongdoing of folk, rA would approve of wrt the pro Palestine protestors

[swaledale]

Looking across the pond, lack of respect for the dead is having its consequences - many thousands have expressed various levels of delight at the death of Charlie Kirk, as is their free-speech right, and those same people are feeling the consequences in being removed from office / employment / collapse of their businesses as a result, in fact I?m aware that there are websites set up to achieve such a purpose. Not sure that will spread to UK, but surely, as someone who repeatedly lists the wrongdoing of folk, rA would approve of wrt the pro Palestine protestors

Wow! For someone who has often moaned on here about "cancel culture", that's some hypocritical about turn. Seems you are further to the right and in tune with Trump and the Maga movement than I thought!

Firstly, why in your mind does someone who died deserve respect? If their life consisted of being a thoroughly unpleasant agitator, spreading fascist. xenophobic, and other falsehoods, rather than being a positive contributor to society why should they command respect? There is a difference between celebrating a persons death, that merely lowers one to that persons level and a tacit admission that using violence is an acceptable way of resolving disputes and not respecting them in death. An important one for any one who values free speech.

But only a fool, would consider the message Kirk was pushing, was acceptable because of the manner in which he did it. He is owed no respect personally by those who saw him for what he was and its laughable that

Unlike in many other countries, hate speech is protected by US law unless it incites imminent violence or constitutes a true threat. Trump and some Republicans have framed Kirk’s death as the consequence of what they claim is unchecked and violent rhetoric, which they blame on the left wing alone! That is completely false and an absolute reverse on their claims that they uphold "free speech" irrespective of if it offends some people.

That much is obvious, I mean it wasn't long ago that certain Maga republicans were claiming that the UK was clamping down on "free speech"!

Any reasonable person looking at what's been pushed by the Trump government would see that for the utter lies and hypocrisy, it is is! It wasn't the Democrats or those on the left who stormed the capitol and repeatedly claimed an election was stolen for example. It wasn't a Democrat or other so called "lefty" who called for the violent overthrow of a democratically elected government in the UK recently!

You seem to approve of the fact that in the US, many conservatives are now championing a public campaign to get fired from their jobs any Americans who made light of Kirk’s death or disparaged him or his politics in death. To me thats typical of the mentality of people who like to "dish out insults and attacks but aren't so keen on it being returned by the other side.

Mind you why should I be surprised, when you accused me (wrongly) of using "hate speech" for describing some people as Gammons!!

This so called consequences for what people say is an example of the kind of ‘cancel culture’ that major figures on the right have been criticizing for so many years. Now they’re just doing a complete about-face and engaging in it themselves.”

There is absolutely no reason, a person should be respected in death, if they garnered no respect in life.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Wow! For someone who has often moaned on here about "cancel culture", that's some hypocritical about turn. Seems you are further to the right and in tune with Trump and the Maga movement than I thought!

Firstly, why in your mind does someone who died deserve respect? If their life consisted of being a thoroughly unpleasant agitator, spreading fascist. xenophobic, and other falsehoods, rather than being a positive contributor to society why should they command respect? There is a difference between celebrating a persons death, that merely lowers one to that persons level and a tacit admission that using violence is an acceptable way of resolving disputes and not respecting them in death. An important one for any one who values free speech.

But only a fool, would consider the message Kirk was pushing, was acceptable because of the manner in which he did it. He is owed no respect personally by those who saw him for what he was and its laughable that

Unlike in many other countries, hate speech is protected by US law unless it incites imminent violence or constitutes a true threat. Trump and some Republicans have framed Kirk’s death as the consequence of what they claim is unchecked and violent rhetoric, which they blame on the left wing alone! That is completely false and an absolute reverse on their claims that they uphold "free speech" irrespective of if it offends some people.

That much is obvious, I mean it wasn't long ago that certain Maga republicans were claiming that the UK was clamping down on "free speech"!

Any reasonable person looking at what's been pushed by the Trump government would see that for the utter lies and hypocrisy, it is is! It wasn't the Democrats or those on the left who stormed the capitol and repeatedly claimed an election was stolen for example. It wasn't a Democrat or other so called "lefty" who called for the violent overthrow of a democratically elected government in the UK recently!

You seem to approve of the fact that in the US, many conservatives are now championing a public campaign to get fired from their jobs any Americans who made light of Kirk’s death or disparaged him or his politics in death. To me thats typical of the mentality of people who like to "dish out insults and attacks but aren't so keen on it being returned by the other side.

Mind you why should I be surprised, when you accused me (wrongly) of using "hate speech" for describing some people as Gammons!!

This so called consequences for what people say is an example of the kind of ‘cancel culture’ that major figures on the right have been criticizing for so many years. Now they’re just doing a complete about-face and engaging in it themselves.”

There is absolutely no reason, a person should be respected in death, if they garnered no respect in life.

And then there was George Floyd, A poor innocent individual of impeccable behaviour lionised after death by police officer.....

[swaledale]

responding to rA and TTR debate on stats for arrests, the pro Palestine Action march seems to have surpassed belief / all records. Approximatley 1000 protestors and so far "at least 355" arrests (per BBC website). The authorities requested they respect the dead by cancelling - they seem to have found their own very special way to disrespect them all on their own. Bunch of c****. it also questions Starmer's authority that noone has taken any notice of his, perfectly reasonable, request.

I'll respectfully disagree with you GP. It is after all a "free country" and in whether one agrees with the protest or not, the principle that an act of terrorism should not disrupt a peaceful protest is one thats valid.

As for the arrests, well if a Government acts foolishly and in a disproportionate way, to ban a group that says things it doesn't like, then inevitably the police will finish up as the fall guys arresting harmless people who are holding up signs with words the government have foolishly decided to ban.

Not sure any Prime Minister has the "authority" to stop people doing or saying something because they would rather not! Well unless one lives in an authoritarian regime that is, but then those prime ministers or presidents tend to use force to assert their authority.

[swaledale]

Ootenorn (Wooten Wawen to those unnfamiliar with local dialect) or Henley??

Was in Brum for 6 years at Uni and first job. Mostly used to live in Hall Green and when going to see my parents (ie to get washing done) used to get the Oxford bus via Stratford and get off at Shipston on Stour

many concerts at the odeon too - Santana, Mahavishnu stand out in memory and I think saw Gong there although may have been elsewhere in town.

barbarellas was **** though - as you say too expensive for a student budget so very rarely visited

Wootton Wawen indeed, spent my first 20 years there in a Council House, Navigation Inn a regular haunt, used to have good folk nights back in the day. Catch the 150 Midland Red bus into Brum.

I've a whole list of ticket stubs from gigs at the Odeon, I remember Santana, because they did two shows on the same night due to demand and mine was the later show which meant some fleet footwork to catch the last train out of Moor Street. Also saw, Robin Trower, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Tull, Be Bop Delux, Hawkwind, and so on. There was also a hippy hang out called Bogarts I remember.

How then did I end up a derby fan? Well my Dad was from derby and fairly keen so used to take me to games, either at local midlands clubs or on occasion the baseball ground. So my affiliation stemmed from there and then later on I moved to Derbyshire near Bakewell and one was either a Rams or a Blades fan, no contest!!

[Andy_Faber]

And then there was George Floyd, A poor innocent individual of impeccable behaviour lionised after death by police officer.....

Please don?t post things that make Swale look silly or ill have to cancel you

[Geoff Parkstone]

Wootton Wawen indeed, spent my first 20 years there in a Council House, Navigation Inn a regular haunt, used to have good folk nights back in the day. Catch the 150 Midland Red bus into Brum.

I've a whole list of ticket stubs from gigs at the Odeon, I remember Santana, because they did two shows on the same night due to demand and mine was the later show which meant some fleet footwork to catch the last train out of Moor Street. Also saw, Robin Trower, Lynyrd Skynyrd, Tull, Be Bop Delux, Hawkwind, and so on. There was also a hippy hang out called Bogarts I remember.

How then did I end up a derby fan? Well my Dad was from derby and fairly keen so used to take me to games, either at local midlands clubs or on occasion the baseball ground. So my affiliation stemmed from there and then later on I moved to Derbyshire near Bakewell and one was either a Rams or a Blades fan, no contest!!

Ah Bogarts, another haunt in common. On New Street I believe. Bands upstairs and a purveyor of evil lager in a bier Keller downstairs that I always eschewed as a CAMRA member

Local heavy metal bands rather than hippy is more how I remember it and I think the Pistols played there once but I didn't go