O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[swaledale]

Wasn’t me. The only reference I’ve made to ‘compliance’ that I can think of was questioning the accuracy of Ram59’s suggestion that perhaps the UK figures were so high because we were less ‘compliant’ than other nations.
I still don’t know how you’d reach that conclusion, and pointed out that recent scenes from the US, along with MA’s accounts of behaviour in the NL, would suggest otherwise.

P.S. Perhaps we should all move on from grammatical nit picking. Much missed mista’s written English wasn’t up to much but he still spoke more sense than most.

When they can't challenge the facts they nit pick in other ways - though incorrectly calling me racist perhaps wasn't the brightest comment

[Ram59]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;39690142]Wasn’t me. The only reference I’ve made to ‘compliance’ that I can think of was questioning the accuracy of Ram59’s suggestion that perhaps the UK figures were so high because we were less ‘compliant’ than other nations.

RA, if you're going make a statement about what I've said, please don't continue to twist it, as it's getting annoying now. Spot the difference between the following;

we are less compliant than other nations.
we are less compliant than SOME other nations.

I first implies that we're less compliant than all other nations, whereas the second clearly states that we're less compliant than SOME nations.

Just like you claim that I deny the existence of the British variant of the virus.

[ramAnag]

[QUOTE=Ram59;39690207]

Wasn’t me. The only reference I’ve made to ‘compliance’ that I can think of was questioning the accuracy of Ram59’s suggestion that perhaps the UK figures were so high because we were less ‘compliant’ than other nations.

RA, if you're going make a statement about what I've said, please don't continue to twist it, as it's getting annoying now. Spot the difference between the following;

we are less compliant than other nations.
we are less compliant than SOME other nations.

I first implies that we're less compliant than all other nations, whereas the second clearly states that we're less compliant than SOME nations.

Just like you claim that I deny the existence of the British variant of the virus.

Hmmm...actually if I’d quoted you as saying ‘we’re the LEAST compliant of nations’ or ‘we’re less compliant than ALL other nations’ you’d have a point, but the difference between the two examples you’ve taken exception to is so negligible as to be not worth concerning yourself with.

When you were defending the Government’s record did you or did you not suggest that our national lack of compliance was one of a number of factors that may have led to our very poor Covid case/death figures?

As regards the similar semantic trivialities regarding the virus/variant argument. Did you or did you not question whether the so called ‘British variant’ had actually originated in Britain?

[Andy_Faber]

...meanwhile good for the Ruskies, their Sputnik vaccine is almost 100% effective at two dose level. Mrs F’s workmate Anna in Moscow bravely volunteered for a shot way back in the Wild West (east) days of October 2020 when the soothsayers were predicting it would grow her a second head, and although she was declined her reward is to massively jump the queue for a genuine dose - another friend getting her reward for stepping forward.

[ramAnag]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;39690247]

Hmmm...actually if I’d quoted you as saying ‘we’re the LEAST compliant of nations’ or ‘we’re less compliant than ALL other nations’ you’d have a point, but the difference between the two examples you’ve taken exception to is so negligible as to be not worth concerning yourself with.

When you were defending the Government’s record did you or did you not suggest that our national lack of compliance was one of a number of factors that may have led to our very poor Covid case/death figures?

As regards the similar semantic trivialities regarding the virus/variant argument. Did you or did you not question whether the so called ‘British variant’ had actually originated in Britain?

Well it’s over 24 hours since you gave me that ticking off in post #1052 for twisting your words, Ram.

You’ve gone untypically quiet since I asked for clarification with those two questions above. Maybe you’ve reconsidered and concluded you were in the wrong after all.

I fully accept that it’s ‘annoying’ to have one’s words ‘twisted’, but that’s not what I did, so perhaps an apology is in order.

[Ram59]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;39690247]

Hmmm...actually if I’d quoted you as saying ‘we’re the LEAST compliant of nations’ or ‘we’re less compliant than ALL other nations’ you’d have a point, but the difference between the two examples you’ve taken exception to is so negligible as to be not worth concerning yourself with.

When you were defending the Government’s record did you or did you not suggest that our national lack of compliance was one of a number of factors that may have led to our very poor Covid case/death figures?

As regards the similar semantic trivialities regarding the virus/variant argument. Did you or did you not question whether the so called ‘British variant’ had actually originated in Britain?

You're not that stupid to come out with a total lie, RA, when a more subtle change can suggest a different meaning. I would just appreciate it if you attribute remarks made by me, then at least give me the curtesy of posting what I have actually written.

Yes, I did suggest that the national lack of compliance was a contributing factor, there are son many incidences of stupid non-compliance, that it beggers belief. Only the foolish would disagree, are you really one of those?

Yes, I did question whether the British variant originated in Britain, there is no conclusive proof that it did, only a fool would claim otherwise. There's evidence to suggest that it did, the fact that it was first diagnosed here and it is in larger quantities here. But, set against this is the fact that the UK is the world's leading country on the sequencing of variants and would be more likely to discover something first. To give you an idea of our capacity, the UK is 10,000, Denmark is the highest EU member on 1,200, over 50% of the EU is below 100, 10 of which are below 10. Then we look at the location of the first cases, Kent, which just happens to have the busy ports of Dover and Folkestone and the Eurotunnel. Is it a coincidence that this variant first occured in this county as opposed to any other county in the UK?

I left the argument as it was because I didn't want it to carry on. You think that you're right and I know that I'm right, so we'll leave it there.

[ramAnag]

[QUOTE=Ram59;39691781]

You're not that stupid to come out with a total lie, RA, when a more subtle change can suggest a different meaning. I would just appreciate it if you attribute remarks made by me, then at least give me the curtesy of posting what I have actually written.

Yes, I did suggest that the national lack of compliance was a contributing factor, there are son many incidences of stupid non-compliance, that it beggers belief. Only the foolish would disagree, are you really one of those?

Yes, I did question whether the British variant originated in Britain, there is no conclusive proof that it did, only a fool would claim otherwise. There's evidence to suggest that it did, the fact that it was first diagnosed here and it is in larger quantities here. But, set against this is the fact that the UK is the world's leading country on the sequencing of variants and would be more likely to discover something first. To give you an idea of our capacity, the UK is 10,000, Denmark is the highest EU member on 1,200, over 50% of the EU is below 100, 10 of which are below 10. Then we look at the location of the first cases, Kent, which just happens to have the busy ports of Dover and Folkestone and the Eurotunnel. Is it a coincidence that this variant first occured in this county as opposed to any other county in the UK?

I left the argument as it was because I didn't want it to carry on. You think that you're right and I know that I'm right, so we'll leave it there.

I’m neither ‘stupid’ nor a liar, Ram.

You took exception to me referencing your comment on compliance and suggested I’d twisted your words.

Your words at 7.00pm on the 31st Jan...on the subject of ‘why our figures are so bad’ were, ‘Ignorance or just plain disobedience of some of the population’ before adding, ‘Our nature is not always to be as compliant as some other nations.’

As regards your questioning of the British virus/variant...call it what you will, you said, at 6.10pm on the 13th January on the ‘A Frightening Thought’ thread...

‘The thing is it’s not the British virus, it’s a strain of virus which probably arrived in Britain from Italy, which originated in China, but because of our superior laboratories, was first discovered in Britain.’

I don’t really want to carry the argument on either, but I don’t like being accused of dishonestly twisting anyone’s words.
I didn’t and I’m quite happy to ‘leave it there’, but I really do hope you’d no longer describe your position as ‘I know that I’m right’...that really would be a little worrying.

[Ram59]

[QUOTE=ramAnag;39691958]

I’m neither ‘stupid’ nor a liar, Ram.

You took exception to me referencing your comment on compliance and suggested I’d twisted your words.

Your words at 7.00pm on the 31st Jan...on the subject of ‘why our figures are so bad’ were, ‘Ignorance or just plain disobedience of some of the population’ before adding, ‘Our nature is not always to be as compliant as some other nations.’

As regards your questioning of the British virus/variant...call it what you will, you said, at 6.10pm on the 13th January on the ‘A Frightening Thought’ thread...

‘The thing is it’s not the British virus, it’s a strain of virus which probably arrived in Britain from Italy, which originated in China, but because of our superior laboratories, was first discovered in Britain.’

I don’t really want to carry the argument on either, but I don’t like being accused of dishonestly twisting anyone’s words.
I didn’t and I’m quite happy to ‘leave it there’, but I really do hope you’d no longer describe your position as ‘I know that I’m right’...that really would be a little worrying.

Can you not comprehend that virus and variant are two different things. The virus is the thing that we understand to have originated in China. This virus has since mutated into 1,000s of different variants of the original virus.

The original virus appears to have originated in China and then appears to have first surfaced in Europe in Italy and the evidence indicates that is where the early UK patients seemed to have contracted the virus before bringing it into this country. The virus found in Italy may well have been a variant of the original, but we didn't have the sequencing then, to find out.

The UK one, is a variant of the main virus, first identified in the UK, but possibly originating elsewhere.

If you can't understand the difference, then I'm crap at trying to explain it or you're thick, probably the former.

If you don't wish to be accused of twisting somebody's words, why did you miss out the word 'some' when posting a comment on my post? 'Some other nations' has a different context to just 'other nations', well it does in my interpretation.

[ramAnag]

Never had the slightest difficulty differentiating between virus and variant, Ram...but that’s not really the point is it?

As regards the ‘compliance’ issue. I was originally simply making a point to Andy that it wasn’t me who’d referred to BAME communities and compliance. My reference to you wasn’t a quote at all...I simply pointed out that the only time I’d referred to compliance was in relation to your post.

You do tend to become a little abusive when challenged. All I’m trying to do is show that I haven’t misrepresented you. I hadn’t and have no intention of doing so, I’ve even used your exact words as requested. It’s okay to be wrong.

[MadAmster]

Let's take a step back and look at this.

This virus first went rampant in Wuhan, China. It may or may ot have originated there. A 14 man WHO group of experts arrived in China, went into 14 days of quarantine which ended on Monday Feb 1st. They have now started their research. I think it's 50/50 whether they can come up with a definitive answer.

Since then, there have been many mutations, most of which are weakened versions of Covid-19. There are 3 which appear to have gone in the other direction. They were first spotted in, in no particular order, Britain, Brazil and South Africa. They are referred to, here in the Netherlands in any case, as the British, Brazilian and South African VARIANTS. I don't believe that many people think that they started there. Just that those places are where they were first spotted. The British variant has at least 2 known variants of its own, one of which is known in medical circles as "E484K", which don't yet have "nicknames". Are people really upset by having the adjective "British" used?