O/T:- Election

[SmiffyPie]

VAT should be levied on non-essentials only. Food (I know it isn't now), water, electricity, gas etc should be VAT free.

[Lullapie]

VAT should be levied on non-essentials only. Food (I know it isn't now), water, electricity, gas etc should be VAT free.

Why? Do you know how much VAT evasion happens because of the zero-rated items?

[jackal2]

3 questions present themselves.

The tone of your reply perhaps answers a few questions too. Regardless of whether we're talking about the public sector or the private sector, I don't think the notion that employees should be rewarded for good performance and penalised for bad performance would touch such a nerve with the majority of people.

What evidence do you have to support your assertions?

My own experience and the anecdotes of many other people I've spoken with over the years, relaying examples of good and bad practice/service. I suspect the vast majority of people on here would also have their own experiences, if they are being open and honest...

Does the private sector suffer similar HR difficulties(are professional leadswingers the reason we get such terrible service from the water companies for example)?

Yes, private sector companies can in theory be as poor at appointing or disposing of bad staff as public sector ones, but if they have competitors in the market then there's at least an opportunity for customers to switch to a better provider, so there's more likely to be a 'reckoning' for providers who suffer poor/incompetent employees gladly.

Regarding purchasing running water (as opposed to bottled), where you live will often restrict you to one provider, so although water companies are private and technically 'charge' you rather than 'tax' you, perhaps the knowledge that they have a captive audience does indeed breed a similar arrogance to those elements in the public sector who think the customer just has to like it or lump it.

Have the issues you describe got much worse since 2010, when by almost every measure public services were in much better shape than now?

If your argument is that more people were employed in the public sector pre-2010, you will find that the more employees an organisation of any type has, the more it can hide its weaknesses, because you'll have more 'good' employees around to pick up the slack of the 'bad' ones, but that doesn't equate to providing better value for the taxpayer or customer. Value for money lies not in the number of people you employ, but in the quality, and that's why the public sector (and yes, private sector too) needs to be effective in separating the wheat from the chaff. One effective employee will provide more value than multiple bad ones.

[i961pie]

I honestly couldn't pick a best government. Right back to the Heath v Wilson era most of them merge into the 'meh' category so only the bad ones stand out. The worst two do happen to be Tory governments however, starting with Thatcher. She governed solely for her supporters, and they undoubtedly did very well under her. But if you didn't support her you didn't count, you were left to rot. I didn't ever think I'd see worse, but this bunch have proved me wrong. The level of lies, cronyism and corruption has gone off the scale. I blame Johnson for that more than Sunak, but Sunak was happy to be part of it. I can't wait to see them binned.

Don't you class the Labour government of sunny Jim Callaghan in that bracket that caused Thatcher to get elected in the first place. I remember the end of the Wilson/ Callaghan era when the country was almost bankcrupt, the union's ruled the roost. Rubbish was piled high in the streets along with bodies in the morgues. I worked at a place where I wasn't allowed to move a pallet because it wasn't my job and often stood for hours until someone whose job it was came to move it. I was a trade union member all my working life and still am and they have served me well but that era was the worse I remember.

[jackal2]

I worked at a place where I wasn't allowed to move a pallet because it wasn't my job and often stood for hours until someone whose job it was came to move it.

Reminds me of Carry On At Your Convenience: "Union rules says a tap fitter can't do a waste pipe fitter's job."

[Davy500]

Who cares - the only good thing is that we can look forward to a Labour Goverment - so glad sunak and the rest of those greedy tories will be gone on July 4th and good riddance

[slack_pie]

Who cares - the only good thing is that we can look forward to a Labour Goverment - so glad sunak and the rest of those greedy tories will be gone on July 4th and good riddance

The only positive about this is that Labour probably can't do much worse than the Tories. I mean, you'd have to really try hard to do worse.

[Old_pie]

The only positive about this is that Labour probably can't do much worse than the Tories. I mean, you'd have to really try hard to do worse.

I see Starmer has been coached out of looking as though he's about to cry at any moment.

[Lullapie]

I think the movie 'Carry On At Your Convenience" portrays what work life was like in the last 60s, early 70's, as earlier stated, very well (although I wasn't working then). However, history has been re-written and for those of you that are easily offended we can't talk about Carry On films and their statement on society, because you'll all think that Talbot Rothwell was a racist and a ***ist - RIP satirical humour.

I mean, how many of you could watch Love Thy Neighbour without thinking it is racist against the Reynolds family?

[maddogslater]

Don't you class the Labour government of sunny Jim Callaghan in that bracket that caused Thatcher to get elected in the first place. I remember the end of the Wilson/ Callaghan era when the country was almost bankcrupt, the union's ruled the roost. Rubbish was piled high in the streets along with bodies in the morgues. I worked at a place where I wasn't allowed to move a pallet because it wasn't my job and often stood for hours until someone whose job it was came to move it. I was a trade union member all my working life and still am and they have served me well but that era was the worse I remember.

Good post, the reasons I voted for Mrs T in 79, last time I was in a union as well.
Since then I've voted Labour and Green, now the only alternative for working class voters (they're all looked upon as gamon scum by the Tories Labour lib dems and Green) are the popularist party's, though they're not to my tastes .