O/T:- Vaccines: Pro/Anti & Conspiracy Theories [Originally Covid Pass and Meadow Ln.]

[cher1]

Vaccinated pass on the virus as well.

But not to the same extent, and they become less ill. That's been proven.

The number of vaccinated hospitalisations have only increased as immunity wanes. As booster rates increase, the difference will become stark once again.

[magpie_mania]

Vaccinated pass on the virus as well.

Is there any correlation between the numbers hospitalized and dying falling at the same time that the numbers of people vaccinated increased? Or was it just coincidence?

Referencing your comment earlier that vaccinations may or may not work. For me, that's the clearest indication that they do.

[sinophile]

And, until the whole World is protected variants will continue to arrive, and, sooner or later, one will be even more deadly and will be able to evade current vaccines

[magpie_mania]

Agree with this. The only way out of this mess without many more deaths - and long term covid-related disease - is vaccination. It's the unvaccinated who are driving mutations, not the vaccinated. Viruses mutate when they replicate, and that's much more likely in an unvaccinated person. Hence mutations originating in places where vaccination rates are low.

I'm a bit puzzled by the analogy with Nazism, and any suggestion that the unvaccinated could be compared in any way to the plight of persecuted Jews. Those who aren't vaccinated risk their own health, their own lives, but also the health and lives of others by facilitating an increased risk of spread and mutation of the disease, along with all the resulting pressure on the NHS, which in itself causes others to suffer. People who choose not to be vaccinated aren't victims, those who suffer and/or die are the victims. I do however believe that everyone should have the right to choose whether to be vaccinated.

I was in hospital earlier this year (post-covid related) and chatted to some of the registrars about what it had been like for them working during the peak in the pre-vaccine days. It was absolutely heartbreaking listening. We can't kid ourselves that actually, we're wildly overcounting because we're including people who die 'with' covid. We ahad poor reporting structures in place at the outset of the pandemic, so many earlier covid deaths have never even been included.

However it's counted, it's not going to be perfect, but it's unlikely to be practical, or possible, to ascertain the exact cause of every single death, particularly in the sick and elderly. It's so fraught with difficulty. Yes, counting those dying with covid, rather than of covid is a blunt instrument, but it's about as good as it'll get. The excess death data bears out the horror of what's going on.

Anyway, it's booster time for me in the morning..

The best post on this thread by a mile.

[sinophile]

Absolutely, vaccination is the only route out. This is why intellectual property rights should be waived on vaccines, so that poorer countries can produce their own vaccines instead of being priced out the market. The EU, UK and US have blocked this.

[ncfcog]

I haven't looked into this properly yet but instead of forcing vaccines on people is it better to set up an antibody testing programme and if you are positive, like UTM with his Sars-1 infection you don't have to have the vaccine? I have no idea how the antibody tests work but I'm sure there are a few well educated people on here who could explain if antibody testing is an alternative? Seems it might solve a few problems if it worked? Like I said, not something I've researched so could be way off track here

[magpie_mania]

I haven't looked into this properly yet but instead of forcing vaccines on people is it better to set up an antibody testing programme and if you are positive, like UTM with his Sars-1 infection you don't have to have the vaccine? I have no idea how the antibody tests work but I'm sure there are a few well educated people on here who could explain if antibody testing is an alternative? Seems it might solve a few problems if it worked? Like I said, not something I've researched so could be way off track here

How effective are antibodies after you have had it, and how long do they last for? I guess it might be too early yet to know that. If it is certain that once you have had it you can't get it again that would be a good way forward. But if the effect does wain, then the only booster would be to get it again.

[SwalePie]

How effective are antibodies after you have had it, and how long do they last for? I guess it might be too early yet to know that. If it is certain that once you have had it you can't get it again that would be a good way forward. But if the effect does wain, then the only booster would be to get it again.

On the subject of getting Covid multiple times, according to the data from South Africa, Omicron re-infection rates are notably higher than the other variants.

[SaltySeaDog]

On the subject of getting Covid multiple times, according to the data from South Africa, Omicron re-infection rates are notably higher than the other variants.

But also (at the moment at least), the data shows it to be much less deadly. Hopefully it stays that way

[BigFatPie]

Updated Covid guidance from Notts. Proof of vaccination not needed tomorrow.

https://www.nottscountyfc.co.uk/news...h-info-101221/