OT perspective/ Ukraine/Russia

[MadAmster]

Just listened to some chilling forecasts. 2 Dutch politicians on a chat show. They expect the war to deliver somewhere between 5M and 10M refugees. They also said they expect the Netherlands to have to deal with around 400K of them. Hotel rooms are being booked to house those already here/on the way. A temporary tent/hut village has been built to take 2000 immediately. They are already getting sport halls and similar buildings ready to take newcomers. There is talk of converting empty office blocks to refugee homes. Getting on 20K people have offered their spare room but most haven't yet realised that it could be for several years rather than a few months.....

On the same programme there was a Dutch farmer who has a huge farm in Ukraine and is on the committee of a farmers cooperative. He had intended to stay but his fellow farmers persuaded him to return to NL so he could get the message out as to what is a) happening right now and b) the consequences of what is (more like isn't) happening. Ukraine is one of the world's largest exporters of sunflower oil and of wheat. Both crops should be planted in the coming 2 to 3 weeks. Failure to do so will mean Ukraine will grow no wheat or sunflowers this year. The lack of sunflower oil is a problem but is nothing compared to what the lack of Ukrainian wheat will mean. Much of the Ukrainian wheat goes to North Africa and the Middle East. No wheat means no bread and that means hunger in North Africa and the Middle East and that will lead to a new refugee tsunami of people looking for food and could be as many as another 30M refugees heading to Europe.

That is, according to the farmer, is what will happen by the end of this year. Is this all part of Putin's plan? Instigate a refugee crisis so large that it totally cripples Europe?

[Trickytreesreds]

Sssssssssssssssssssssh,

where's your compassion you xenophobe

[MadAmster]

...... breaking news that McD's is to temporarily close all their Russian outlets.

[Geoff Parkstone]

You see MA, our boycott was successful after all

[ramAnag]

Sssssssssssssssssssssh,

where's your compassion you xenophobe

What does that even mean? Someone makes an intelligent and informed, if utterly chilling and depressing, point about the ever emerging consequences of this madman’s actions and all you can do is offer mockery and ridicule.
Ffs...grow up or sod off...this is not one of your point scoring little exercises.

[swaledale]

Yep, whichever party gains power, it's still the same "civil servants" as the previous week. They might tweak things a little depending on whether it's the blue or the red Toraidhe in power...........

True MA, but they are generally there to provide information and implement the policies of whatever political party is in government. A wee bit different in the US, where appointments are much more political, as indeed are judges to the supreme court, not quite the separation between the executive and government that we have. But I was more referring to the associated advisers and policy wonks which each party employs, plus of course the input of other ministers - Biden has capable people at both political and administrative government level. Johnson has a load of yes men and women and has purged goverment and indeed a lot of MP's who were even vaguely sensible and replaced them with people who are "loyal" to him!

[Trickytreesreds]

What does that even mean? Someone makes an intelligent and informed, if utterly chilling and depressing, point about the ever emerging consequences of this madman’s actions and all you can do is offer mockery and ridicule.
Ffs...grow up or sod off...this is not one of your point scoring little exercises.

calm down yer jessie.

It is very depressing but the actual fact is, this has been going on for over 7 years now.
Since Merkel threw the gates open to all, the influx has been never ending. Now when a real crisis hits on our doorstep, things are really about to go tits up and the flexability in the system has already been used up,

Its like using up the spare electricity card, then the power actually goes off at 11 pm. OOOOOOOOPS.

You never saw a problem with un controlled migration. Well you do now.

[MadAmster]

Who with even an ounce of compassion and human decency could take a serious post about a looming WAR REFUGEE crisis and turn it into an uncontrolled migration issue? Utterly reprehensible in its callousness.

Just to be on the safe side, the question is a rhetorical one......

[ramAnag]

calm down yer jessie.

It is very depressing but the actual fact is, this has been going on for over 7 years now.
Since Merkel threw the gates open to all, the influx has been never ending. Now when a real crisis hits on our doorstep, things are really about to go tits up and the flexability in the system has already been used up,

Its like using up the spare electricity card, then the power actually goes off at 11 pm. OOOOOOOOPS.

You never saw a problem with un controlled migration. Well you do now.

‘Jessie’...‘big girl’s blouse’....wow, you’re a real wit aren’t you.

You’ve betrayed your prejudice so many times recently that I really can’t be bothered to argue any more. Just try telling the Syrians, particularly those in Aleppo, that their crisis wasn’t ‘real’.

Perhaps the biggest mistake Merkel, and a number of other EU leaders, seems to have made was to allow themselves to become so heavily dependent on Russian oil and gas, but it’s all very well being wise after the event.

I can’t put it better than MA...‘who with even an ounce of compassion and human decency could take a serious post about a looming WAR REFUGEE crisis and turn it into an uncontrolled migration issue?’

And that’s the point isn’t it? You are devoid of compassion and human decency. Just like Putin you’ve been revealed in your true colours. Someone who’ll stop at nothing to bang your drum of monotonous divisiveness and callousness. In short Tricky...you should feel ashamed...you’re a disgrace who really isn’t worth talking to further.

[Trickytreesreds]

If only it was that simple. People from Alleppo needing shelter. But it isn't .
Merkel changed the demographics of Europe permanently and opened up the flood gates. The irony here is, that those who didn't fall for it- Poland/Hungary/Romania/Moldova are the very ones now going above the call of duty to help the Ukraine.
But I suppose they have a lot more room to adapt than the rest of us.

This country currently has 100 000 awaiting the INTITIAL asylum decision. There technically is no where to put them, thus £5 Million a day in hotel bills.
Why does it take so long? Well when you've tossed your ID into the sea doesn't help much.

You see compassion is all about judgment. I'll reserve mine thanks for those I can observe who genuinely need it.
The Ukraine people, are one such situation. they aren't looking for a better life, just help. They don't want to burden anyone else, they want their home back and will/are fighting to retain it.
You RA, seem to think everyone who cries, should be accomodated without question. the country is a bottomless pit of giveaways and acres of free room.

Stenson has quite politely pointed out twice, that this is a small island that has limits. You seem to not comprehend that.

You brain is stuck in the old conundrum of, how many beans in a bake bin tin?

I'll tell you what, you think you're the expert.
Tell me your answer to it all.

How many
costs
Revenue raising
services

No I don't feel ashamed except that we've been so dumb, as to allow the UK and Europe to be taken for a ride and now it really needs to step up to the plate, it is going to struggle.
But it's ok RA's warm glowing heart will solve it all
Get basket of loaves and fish out, that will sort it.