OT another terrorist attack.

[ragingpup]

Of course I noticed the satire, I know that was the whole point you were making. But what I am saying is, if someone else on here was making a point and jokingly used the phrase 'dirty Muslim' people would go mental, regardless of the point. Double standards.

The whole point of satire is to exaggerate and heighten a political pov for ridicule. Doesn't matter if GF actually says the word "dirty", it's implicit in his repeated posts in the eye of this satirist! And I think you get that but are clutching at a few straws to try and defend the...the ...the very hard to defend!

[ragingpup]

What general statements do you mean If you would care to clarify I will try to answer your rather obscure comment
Many Catholics follow the principle of no contraception [artificial] & go through a lifetime of poverty with too many children for them to support but I presume you will accuse me of further racism
Another friend of mine is a pretty serious Catholic but uses artificial contraception but justifies is non adherance as "a matter between him & God" so there you go
BTW Muslims are followers of the faith of Islam & not a race just as Catholics are not a race

Discrimination on race and religion is pretty much the same thing in law. Try it at work. But let's not go there. If you have A Muslim friend, doesn't she have an issue with you implying that she doesn't care about humans,implying a generally barbaric approach to others in your comparison to animal slaughter?? You're 'friendly discussions' must be pretty frosty!

[Exiletyke]

Discrimination on race and religion is pretty much the same thing in law. Try it at work. But let's not go there. If you have A Muslim friend, doesn't she have an issue with you implying that she doesn't care about humans,implying a generally barbaric approach to others in your comparison to animal slaughter?? You're 'friendly discussions' must be pretty frosty!

Where do you get "friendly discussions" from
Never mentioned "friendly discussions"
but I await your conversion to Islam

[ragingpup]

Where do you get "friendly discussions" from
Never mentioned "friendly discussions"
but I await your conversion to Islam

I'm talking about when you talk to your Muslim friend, as friends do. I'm assuming you have friendly discussions when you see her, as she is a friend? I'm interested in how she takes your viewpoint that all Muslims having no respect for human life as you said in your earlier post? It's not a challenge, I'm genuinely interested in how people with extreme views like that form and keep friendships with people of the same kind that they hold in contempt? Seems a head f*ck to me but interested to learn.

Conversion to Islam? What are you on about man?! Keep calm! I'm with Dawkins, fundamentally dislike religion and like to see education challenge all, religion and science. It's really not for me, but I live in a multi faith society and there is nothing we can do to change that except educate, challenge and stimulate curiosity. Much more healthy than generalising and hating, as that's what some on here seem to get off on.

[Ellis_D]

My schools source from suppliers where animals are stunned. Yes you take it on trust, as you do with fairtrade and any other ethical supplier. Before I was vegan I bought eggs from an ethical farm supplier. How did I know that they were ethical and not buying battery eggs and putting them in their boxes? Always an element of trust and RSPCA do random inspections on anything that they certify. I'm guessing that you trust a range of products that have various claims - but strangely you aren't willing to trust meat suppliers of hal al food? What does that tell us about your attitude towards them?

If you are saying that you are angry at the other 10% of meat that is not stunned then I tend to agree with you - as far as I'm aware the practice is illegal (may be wrong) and if it isn't then it should be. I agree with you here. However, don't flatter yourself that the difference is that big - many debate whether stunning an animal actually reduces pain and whether it makes any difference to the animal at all. I think there is enough evidence for me to back outlawing it personally, but even I wouldn't say that not stunning is barbaric. I think the whole practice is barbaric but that's where I have to accept the consensus. But no high horse to climb on over hal al and kosher death for you I'm afraid.

I guess if you genuinely think, as many do in this strange recent outburst of thought/paranoia on the far right, that there is a conspiracy of take over of our land coming from the Muslim population, that it is part of a master plan of sorts to absorb 'our way of doing things' then this is probably a waste of words anyway. Life must be very stressful and angry for you and others who feel this.

Trying to twist what I am saying, doesn't bother me, I am used to it with the likes of roly, Kerr and others on here. I'm not saying I don't trust the supplier of the halal food, and I thought that was quite clear. I am saying you can't trust the hospital or school that they are telling the truth that the animals were stunned before slaughter. The canteen staff are unlikely to know. If I ask the head at my children's schools they could quite easily lie so as not to create a fuss. They might not even know themselves. How would you find out in a hospital? I am sure asking the lady who comes round with the menu in the morning wouldn't have a clue. I am sure it would take up a considerable amount of people's time relaying the message to others until you find out the answer. And even then the person at the top might not tell the truth.

First line: "You must stun all animals before you slaughter them unless an animal is being religiously slaughtered for halal or kosher meat."

https://www.gov.uk/guidance/halal-and-kosher-slaughter

"However, don't flatter yourself that the difference is that big - many debate whether stunning an animal actually reduces pain and whether it makes any difference to the animal at all." - Well, the RSPCA and several other organisations believe it makes a huge difference.

https://www.rspca.org.uk/getinvolved/campaign/slaughter

[Ellis_D]

The reality of the situation is that the child wouldn't make the choice - his or her parent would.

I see that your objection has switched from Halal per se to becoming one about humane slaughter. Is that part of a wider animal welfare agenda or is it the Islamic connection that does it for you?

As raging points out, the whole livestock industry has plenty of rough and inhumane edges and, if you can't accept that, vegetarianism is really your only option.

What you see as appeasement and the path to a civil war, I see as business decisions for the individuals, businesses and public bodies concerned.

My argument about halal has always been what halal slaughter is supposed to be - the slaughter without stunning. I've never given a toss about whether the people of any religion want to say a few words before the slaughter, and I made that quite clear. Absolutely nothing to do with an Islamic connection.

Funny though, that I just mentioned you in my last post as being one who tries to twist another's words.

[Turfmoorspirit]

I also dislike religion and like id to move consensually as far from all religious practice in the long term future. But it's here and we deal with it.

I much more hate racism which is what you do when you make general statements like that. What does your Muslim friend make of such a statement that includes her and all Muslims?

So you are calling Exile a racist for making a general statement ? What statement would that be please ?

[millmoormagic]

My argument about halal has always been what halal slaughter is supposed to be - the slaughter without stunning. I've never given a toss about whether the people of any religion want to say a few words before the slaughter, and I made that quite clear. Absolutely nothing to do with an Islamic connection.

Funny though, that I just mentioned you in my last post as being one who tries to twist another's words.

Here's the crux of it though Ellis, just like your explanations of extremism in the koran, you take it to the Nth degree, which, while that may well be what it says 'on the tin', doesn't ever, ever mean what actually happens in reality, and you can't distnguish between the two, you need to learn the difference.

[Ellis_D]

Further thought Ellis, if you're concerned with animal welfare - my mate up in Rotherham used to work in a slaughter house and based on what he used to tell me about how some workers sought 'recreation' in their line of work, I would SERIOUSLY advice you to check your food supplier. A slaughter house that is RSPCA certified, takes animal welfare seriously is far more important that worrying about whether some bloke said blessings to the poor thing before it bid us farewell...

Incredible, despite me already replying to you on this subject yesterday and making it clear that I'm not interested one way or another whether someone wants to say a blessing to an animal before slaughtering it, for religious purpose or otherwise, and that that would make NO DIFFERENCE to me whether I would buy it or eat it, you are still going on about it as though I have an issue with it.

After a promising start on here you seem to have fallen into the category of leftist tosser who rather than reading what someone says, just makes things up to make them fit into their view of what a far right Nazi would really think, and twists other things to suit the agenda. Which is a shame.

Oh, and by the way, I haven't lived in Rotherham since I was about one and a half years old.

[Ellis_D]

What general statements do you mean If you would care to clarify I will try to answer your rather obscure comment
Many Catholics follow the principle of no contraception [artificial] & go through a lifetime of poverty with too many children for them to support but I presume you will accuse me of further racism
Another friend of mine is a pretty serious Catholic but uses artificial contraception but justifies is non adherance as "a matter between him & God" so there you go
BTW Muslims are followers of the faith of Islam & not a race just as Catholics follow the Catholic faith are not a race

Yes but it makes the left feel better about themselves if they can call anyone who criticises Islam 'racists.'