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Good post CherOriginally Posted by cher1
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Simple fact of the matter is;
1. We aren’t good enough
2. We play 5th tier so will always have 5th tier officials as long as we stay 5th tier
3. If he played positive tactics and realised 1 up front wasn’t working he wouldn’t have to rely on penalties for 3 points
4. Burton have sacked there manager can they please take ardley
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Refs are on good money at this level £200 for 90 mins plus expenses.
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That's good money?!
You do realise they often have to travel long distances to and from the match they are officiating? A little longer than 90 mins work.
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Has it always been this way Cher? Or has the abuse increased over recent years?
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Add this to the end of Cher's post - all the abuse they have gone through (and still get from players, not to mention every dodgy decision being discussed on social media) to get to £200! Then they are expected to be perfect while players who are paid many times more (I realise refs have other jobs) make mistake after mistake.
Not sure I would think it is worth all the hassle.
I still think though that we lost at least a point because of them!
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It is a difficult pill to swallow, and it's not like we've not had our share of refereeing injustices. The League Two play-offs under Kevin Nolan against Coventry being a prime example if memory serves me correctly.
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Have just asked Matlock - he thinks for the young children's games, abuse has improved slightly. Older kids and adults is roughly similar in his experience. It's been going on for years.
Apparently there was a huge recruitment drive some years ago, but so many refs have left since because of the abuse and occasional violence. Yes you might get £200 at our level, but most refs have left long long before then, which is the root of the quality problem.
In th NL, refs will need to get somewhere else in the country so might drive 2+ hours (and certainly in the FL, the officials all have to drive separately), refs must be there 2 hours before the game, HAVE to stay for hospitality afterwards, if they've been assessed there's a meeting with the assessor, then a potentially long drive home. So there's a whole Saturday gone, and if it's an evening game you're likely to need to take time off work. And that's without the abuse during the game. Suddenly £200 doesn't seem much. That's why Matlock gave up progressing up the leagues, the time demands were too much for family life.
He's a decent ref, got good scores from the teams most weeks, and gets given the local derby games. Despite this, the shoving, death threats, being squared up to by a bloke with no shirt on etc all happened to him. Imagine what happens to younger or less experienced refs. Or someone who isn't 6'2". So many walk away, including one of our children,who packed up after having to attend an FA tribunal - at which his decision stood - but was still an unpleasant experience for a ****ager.
It's no different to when you are recruiting for a job. It's always good to have decent sized pool of good calibre applicants who really want the role, rather than a small number of potentially less able candidates.
I completely agree with everyone who says there are some poor refs at this level, and above for that matter. But players and club official changing their behaviour could help improve things.
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This is a very good post Cher and offers some insight as to the sad indictment of the culture within football in this country towards referees from grassroots upwards. I do think that at grassroots level there needs to be more protection afforded to referees particularly in terms of verbal abuse and threats of physical abuse. In many areas of work the kind of examples you state would be met with security or police intervention. It seems that on the football field all laws go out the window.
For example threatening or abusive behavior by parents towards referees should be met with a zero tolerance and the parents should be banned and even risk their child being banned as well. I know it might not be fair on the child but sometimes a hard line is required. Imagine if you were walking down the street and were subjected to some of the things you mention? What difference should it make that it's on a football field.
At the professional level football could learn a lot of lessons from Rugby in terms of referee and player engagement. I also think this surrounding the referee should be outlawed and only players that the referee wants to speak to and the captain are allowed. Likewise managers and players going to the referee at half time or after a game when emotions are running high. They should have a designate cooling down period before being allowed to go and consult with the referee after the game in an office. The referees should also be receptive to this method as well.
Education, help and assistance for referees is desperately important. Alot of referees may have not played the game at the level they officiate at so that is where current and ex-players should be brought in to help. If the players and managers don't respect the referees because of the mistakes or them not having played the game at that level, then the only way to gain the mutual respect is through engagement and education. We talk about when referees lose the game and it's basically when the respect for them has gone because of poor decisions made.
I'm not advocating that referees should not be questioned on decisions, or immune from implications from mistakes but it needs to be done professionally through the correct channels.
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A sensible thread.
I personally felt it was a mistake when they went to 'elite' refs who only do the top games. It was good for the refs to do some lower league games -but I remember when we had Mike Riley, him strutting about as if he was the number 1 attraction that day.
Not only do they have the top games, they know now that if they do make a mistake, VAR will save them. All the talk when a mistake is made is about VAR - 'top' refs don't seem to be accountable.
One thing is for sure - much as I love football, if I were younger I wouldn't be looking to become a ref, and would advise my children not to. But then - without them, there wouldn't be any football! I agree that at the lower levels, from kids games, there should be zero tolerance - and much as it seems wrong, if parents can't control themselves, then should the kids be allowed to play? Zero tolerance right through. Sadly, when there's such huge consequences from their decisions at the top level, it's easy to see why managers etc act as they do (doesn't make it right) when a defeat can mean the sack, and financially the clubs can lose millions. What a state we're in as society.
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