Election Year or Fear!

[Trickytreesreds]

The problem with that assertion is that there is no way of proving it - essentially you are making an assumption, yet because it fits in with, let?s say, rA and Swale?s narrative, you?ll be getting support no doubt. That?s a reflection of their entrenched states of mind more than your opinion but it sort of makes discussion pointless. Note in a post above that In almost the same breath Swale warns me off offering my own anecdotes then offers some of his own to support his stance.

Yearh but you're a closet racist and thick and not allowed to use un substantiated anecdotes

[ramAnag]

The problem with that assertion is that there is no way of proving it - essentially you are making an assumption, yet because it fits in with, let?s say, rA and Swale?s narrative, you?ll be getting support no doubt. That?s a reflection of their entrenched states of mind more than your opinion but it sort of makes discussion pointless. Note in a post above that In almost the same breath Swale warns me off offering my own anecdotes then offers some of his own to support his stance.

You’ve perhaps missed the point that it was Trump’s unproven assumption and politically motivated assertion that started this part of the argument. Maybe we should stick with that?

‘Entrenched states of mind’, that just translates - in AF speak - as hold a different opinion to you, while ‘makes discussion pointless’ simply translates as you not getting your own way.

Even you have to admit that, without going back there if I don’t have to, your anecdotes and accusations have been more than a little flawed of late and it never ceases to amaze me that, even though I tend to agree with others (eg MA, Sith and mac) just as much as Swale, it’s only when Swale and I publicly agree that you get all agitated and Tricky predictably reaches for his ridiculous pilot imagery.

I’m sure Sith is more than capable of maintaining his argument without any of the support you seem so irritated by and I suggest we stay on topic - that’s Trump and the issue of positive discrimination - while cutting out the nonsense.

[Trickytreesreds]

I said before I think people are more likely to be overlooked for a job because of their race, religion , *** or disability, even if they are the best person for the job. BUT, let's assume someone offers a role to someone to meet a quota, I genuinely believe that no one is going to make that offer and compromise safety, or put someone in a dangerous position.

It's just not going to happen.

I disagree . Have a look at police ethnic fast track promotions, only to have them caught out for corruption and criminal activity.
What do you class a dangerous position?

https://www.itv.com/news/2019-09-03/...warns-watchdog

Loads of them on line. One asian fast tracked to Inspector, was found guilty of running an extortion racket on his patch

[MadAmster]

Post #2557. Totally unbelievable. Someone getting hired above Swale? Never happened

Post #2551, an independent view on the content. The guy feels a less qualified person got a job he believes he should have got and, it seems, the person who got the job wasn't a white Caucasian male. There is a court case going on. We, not even you TTR, know what the outcome of the case will be. Is he right in his accusation or is he wrong? As yet, we do not know, do we TTR?

The chopper/plane crash. People, Trump for one and, if I'm correct in understanding why the Brigida case was brought up, TTR seem to think air traffic control made a mistake. We don't know that they did. Even accepting that there was just the one ATC'er present when there should have been two, does not automatically mean that the ATC'er present made a mistake. Wouldn't it be much wiser to wait for the results of the investigation before pointing a finger?

[Trickytreesreds]

Post #2557. Totally unbelievable. Someone getting hired above Swale? Never happened

Post #2551, an independent view on the content. The guy feels a less qualified person got a job he believes he should have got and, it seems, the person who got the job wasn't a white Caucasian male. There is a court case going on. We, not even you TTR, know what the outcome of the case will be. Is he right in his accusation or is he wrong? As yet, we do not know, do we TTR?

The chopper/plane crash. People, Trump for one and, if I'm correct in understanding why the Brigida case was brought up, TTR seem to think air traffic control made a mistake. We don't know that they did. Even accepting that there was just the one ATC'er present when there should have been two, does not automatically mean that the ATC'er present made a mistake. Wouldn't it be much wiser to wait for the results of the investigation before pointing a finger?

of course we don't know. He isn't on his own thought either is he? 900 have claims in. I never said, it was the whole truth and nothing but the truth. I suggested hold your horses on dismissing Trumps claims, no matter how crass they were.

The absense of staff, I'm sure be a factor here, though how badly it was handled remains to be seen.
So again to reiterate, you are correct, but so is the other side of the story in the fact there are a lot of accusations about that role and it shouldn't be ignored.

[SithHappens]

I think this is an argument that could go round and round. I still stand by my "view" that people aren't put in to dangerous or unsafe jobs to meet quotas.

Ok, I am willing to accept that there will be examples where someone has got a job to fill a quota and it's not worked out. But i still believe when it comes to jobs like air traffic control with lives at risk every day, its just not going to happen

Yes we have some examples and well done, I don't think it goes anywhere close to exonerating Trump for his hideous assumption that people tragically died because the ATC was being run by the Ewok cast from the Return of the Jedi.

As I said before while yes I am making my comments based on my beliefs, I have never genuinely seen someone promoted or given a job just to meet a quota, I have seen people overlooked because of Race.

So the question is this, does anyone on this forum genuinely support or believe Trumps comments that this tragedy is the result of a failed diversity employment program?

I think there are two discussions, one that talks about the fairness of employment processes, and one that talks about Trump and his (in my view) abhorrent comments.

There is no 'yeah he was wrong BUT hes got a point' in my opinion.

There is a time and a place for asking questions, in the immediate aftermath of a tragedy when people are mourning is not the time.

[Andy_Faber]

I think this is an argument that could go round and round. I still stand by my "view" that people aren't put in to dangerous or unsafe jobs to meet quotas.

Ok, I am willing to accept that there will be examples where someone has got a job to fill a quota and it's not worked out. But i still believe when it comes to jobs like air traffic control with lives at risk every day, its just not going to happen

Yes we have some examples and well done, I don't think it goes anywhere close to exonerating Trump for his hideous assumption that people tragically died because the ATC was being run by the Ewok cast from the Return of the Jedi.

As I said before while yes I am making my comments based on my beliefs, I have never genuinely seen someone promoted or given a job just to meet a quota, I have seen people overlooked because of Race.

So the question is this, does anyone on this forum genuinely support or believe Trumps comments that this tragedy is the result of a failed diversity employment program?

I think there are two discussions, one that talks about the fairness of employment processes, and one that talks about Trump and his (in my view) abhorrent comments.

There is no 'yeah he was wrong BUT hes got a point' in my opinion.

There is a time and a place for asking questions, in the immediate aftermath of a tragedy when people are mourning is not the time.

As I said, no-one here (even tricky) excuses Trumps crassness, but regarding your ‘view’, only a follow on enquiry (if allowed to be independent) will confirm or otherwise whether DEI (or any other factor) contributed to the incident and (if its remit is widened) whether DEI is a factor in safety in general. I respect your view although mine is more sceptical

My wider point above regarding discussion is that there continues to be a habit/tactic of discrediting opinions/anecdotes that lean towards certain points of view, rather than a constructive retort. It predates your joining here and is particularly irritating.

[ramAnag]

As I said, no-one here (even tricky) excuses Trumps crassness, but regarding your ?‘view?’, only a follow on enquiry (if allowed to be independent) will confirm or otherwise whether DEI (or any other factor) contributed to the incident and (if its remit is widened) whether DEI is a factor in safety in general. I respect your view although mine is more sceptical

My wider point above regarding discussion is that there continues to be a habit/tactic of discrediting opinions/anecdotes that lean towards certain points of view, rather than a constructive retort. It predates your joining here and is particularly irritating.

…and it’s a habit/tactic that you are at least as guilty of as anyone else on here. Physicians and glass houses spring to mind but you won’t recognise it so we’ll just have to agree to differ…again!

[Geoff Parkstone]

One for Tricky

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DFh-s...Q3dmR1MTM5eQ==

[Trickytreesreds]

One for Tricky

https://www.instagram.com/reel/DFh-s...Q3dmR1MTM5eQ==

thatguy3361 and 26 others

I deployed to Iraq in 06, I can assure you they touch that too.
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