First team squad new players

[WTF11]

Of course you are right again. You always are. You will own up when you are wrong instead of relentless justification...so you keep saying. ��

Errr....not always right and have never (NEVER) suggested otherwise, just more willing to apply some scepticism and objective analysis to new players. As to owning up when I'm wrong, already said as much regarding Rutter, and just in my last post regarding Rodon. Shame folks like you lack such humility.

[Ozwhites]

Errr....not always right and have never (NEVER) suggested otherwise, just more willing to apply some scepticism and objective analysis to new players. As to owning up when I'm wrong, already said as much regarding Rutter, and just in my last post regarding Rodon. Shame folks like you lack such humility.

Well stop denouncing some of them before they have a fair go and you more than likely won't have to backtrack on them. You will have proof in the pudding. I think that was the whole grasp of what I have been pointing out all along! Just hold off on your objective analysis until there is something to actually analyse...

[WTF11]

Well stop denouncing some of them before they have a fair go and you more than likely won't have to backtrack on them. You will have proof in the pudding. I think that was the whole grasp of what I have been pointing out all along! Just hold off on your objective analysis until there is something to actually analyse...

I don't "denounce" anyone (look up the definition of the word if you disagree). My comments, whilst public, are neither harsh, nor based on pure emotion, unlike a lot of the sh1t I have had aimed at me over the years. I don't mind all that, honestly, it happens.

I base my opinion (yes, I acknowledge it's an opinion) on as much information regarding any player that I can find, from as reputable sources as I can identify. How else do you think LUFC scouting does its job (or at least DID its job under Orta, who seemed to think that scouts were a waste of time compared to spreadsheet and the like). If it was possible for the club to arrive at a conclusion that would lead to the "investment" of many hundreds of thousands/millions of pounds, why shouldn't I do much the same, before the player(s) concerned have played a minute for the club?

Of the players acquired during the summer TW, my assessment of their potential stands reasonable examination, and over the time I have posted here, I'd suggest that had the club taken "advice" or at the very least a second look, based on my comments, we would have saved a fortune. Two very well known examples.....Casilla, unable to get game time with his parent club and responsible for costing us promotion when we made the catastrophic decision to recruit him, and JK Augustin, again unable to get game time not only with his parent club but even the club they loaned him to, and LUFC were so unbelievably incompetent not only in assessing him, but offering him terms that were stupendously stupid and cost the club a conservative £40m. I stated as much before they played a minute of game time for LUFC, although there were others who thought that both were "good bits of business" who despite the disasterous outcome in both cases (and others I have critiqued), have remaind silent on their abysmal lack of judgement.

[Ozwhites]

I don't "denounce" anyone (look up the definition of the word if you disagree). My comments, whilst public, are neither harsh, nor based on pure emotion, unlike a lot of the sh1t I have had aimed at me over the years. I don't mind all that, honestly, it happens.

I base my opinion (yes, I acknowledge it's an opinion) on as much information regarding any player that I can find, from as reputable sources as I can identify. How else do you think LUFC scouting does its job (or at least DID its job under Orta, who seemed to think that scouts were a waste of time compared to spreadsheet and the like). If it was possible for the club to arrive at a conclusion that would lead to the "investment" of many hundreds of thousands/millions of pounds, why shouldn't I do much the same, before the player(s) concerned have played a minute for the club?

Of the players acquired during the summer TW, my assessment of their potential stands reasonable examination, and over the time I have posted here, I'd suggest that had the club taken "advice" or at the very least a second look, based on my comments, we would have saved a fortune. Two very well known examples.....Casilla, unable to get game time with his parent club and responsible for costing us promotion when we made the catastrophic decision to recruit him, and JK Augustin, again unable to get game time not only with his parent club but even the club they loaned him to, and LUFC were so unbelievably incompetent not only in assessing him, but offering him terms that were stupendously stupid and cost the club a conservative £40m. I stated as much before they played a minute of game time for LUFC, although there were others who thought that both were "good bits of business" who despite the disasterous outcome in both cases (and others I have critiqued), have remaind silent on their abysmal lack of judgement.

Not sure why you have gone to all the trouble of rehashing all those you think you were right with. Just trying to improve your odds on more of them by suggesting you hold off a bit. Mate, you do whatever thrills you...but I don't want you pacing the floor waiting for someone to respond so you can spar with...instead of going to bed! So as usual, you can have the last word so you can sleep peacefully.....

P.S. You ever thought about running for PM? 👍

[WTF11]

Not sure why you have gone to all the trouble of rehashing all those you think you were right with. Just trying to improve your odds on more of them by suggesting you hold off a bit. Mate, you do whatever thrills you...but I don't want you pacing the floor waiting for someone to respond so you can spar with...instead of going to bed! So as usual, you can have the last word so you can sleep peacefully.....

P.S. You ever thought about running for PM? ��

If pointing out some examples of player acquisitions that have cost the club tens of millions of pounds when, had they been as astute as I was at the time, they could have saved themselves said millions, surely worthy of some "recanting" by some of those who post here? (I'm not holding my breath), is "re-hashing" then guilty as charged, and????

My odds of being right won't improve by "holding off", that's shown by past performance. And as for what "thrills" me, no, pointing out the flaws of the LUFC recruitment policy and its almost unparalleled ability to screw it up and waste money isn't a thrill of any kind whatsoever, i can assure you.

"Pacing the floor waiting for someone to respond........."? In your dreams. For reasons I won't dwell on I have time and more to spare, but choose not to spend too much of it here I can assure you. Putting the occasional responses together to other posters takes up very scant amounts of the vast number of hours I have available, especially when there is so little to challenge me.

As for post of PM? Nah, I favour something more of a "beneficial dictator" role, parliamentary democracy doesn't hold much appeal given all the numbnuts I'd have to deal with.

[hopelesslyoptimistic]

Think it say it stick to it (no matter what)

[spaldy]

Not defending the crazy nature of LUFC recruitment the previous 4 years but you also have to put it in context. Just pointing out the failures, without context, really doesn't tell the whole story.

1) MB dictated a lot of the recruiting, or more importantly, lack thereof. There were many players that would not have been considered by him including, Piroe, Rutter, Byram, Ampadu, Kamara and Gnonto. Once you had a spot on the team you had it. Bamford, Ayling, Cooper, Roberts and Kiko were proof of that. Pontus and Aliosky were disposed of for almost nothing.

2) Many players weren't going to come to Leeds. Primarily the training rate and game expectations as well as a remote location that had been in the lower leagues for some time and had some sketchy owners.

3) we reeked of desperation and almost no longer term planning or vision. Who knew how long Radz was going to be committed. Celino, GFH, Bates, Risdale didn't exactly inspire confidence in past behavior. Relegation and change of owner might put us right back with a similar owner.

4) we had been out of the limelight so long many players had no real understanding of the the potential.

5) we aren't based out of London.

[WTF11]

Not defending the crazy nature of LUFC recruitment the previous 4 years but you also have to put it in context. Just pointing out the failures, without context, really doesn't tell the whole story.

1) MB dictated a lot of the recruiting, or more importantly, lack thereof. There were many players that would not have been considered by him including, Piroe, Rutter, Byram, Ampadu, Kamara and Gnonto. Once you had a spot on the team you had it. Bamford, Ayling, Cooper, Roberts and Kiko were proof of that. Pontus and Aliosky were disposed of for almost nothing.

2) Many players weren't going to come to Leeds. Primarily the training rate and game expectations as well as a remote location that had been in the lower leagues for some time and had some sketchy owners.

3) we reeked of desperation and almost no longer term planning or vision. Who knew how long Radz was going to be committed. Celino, GFH, Bates, Risdale didn't exactly inspire confidence in past behavior. Relegation and change of owner might put us right back with a similar owner.

4) we had been out of the limelight so long many players had no real understanding of the the potential.

5) we aren't based out of London.

Nothing to disagree with there, but to be fair to both Ozleeds and myself, the debate isn't/wasn't about the quality of LUFC recruitment, but more a case of "When is it appropriate to critique/criticise a newcomer, before they join the club or when they have had, in Oz' words, "a fair go"?"

I'm one for prevention being better than cure, in all things. Given that "crazy nature" of LUFC recruitment you refer to (and I'd suggest it goes back a little longer than four years, Orta was appointed in May 2017 and the supermarket sweep approach was adopted shortly after, remember Sloth, Anita, Grot, Buoy etc etc?), then scepticism is the go to approach I'd be taking (and I suspect there are many others, just perhaps not as "vocal" as I am).

A more considered approach might have avoided the acquisition of many, but the two really high profile names I mention (Casilla and JKA) are by far the most expensive in waste of club funds one because he almost single-handedly costs us a chance of promotion in 2019, and the other because our management at the time didn't appear to know how to structure a commercially watertight contract.

We continue to waste money on below par players, for reasons that escape me, although my suggestion that last summers TW selection criteria would seem to be as logical as any other (are you American, have you previously been coached by Marsch, have you played for a Red Bull franchise, get all three your a slam dunk!). I suggested we were about to waste a great deal of money on such dross before a ball was kicked in the 22/23 season, and got roundly name-called as a result, and we all know how that ended don't we?

Will this years TW intake be any better, who knows. Of the list of newcomers, only Piroe, Ampadu and Rodon have played sufficiently often and for long enough to provide anything like a view of their LUFC performances, and of those, I stick by my view of all three, only Rodon (when he's not been suspended!) has been consistently good, the others sputter and spark, but theres no flame yet.

[hopelesslyoptimistic]

The key thing with MB is the meeting his is supposed to have had the summer before his last season.

He supposedly said - Either sack me or we need to replace the squad with much better players as I have taken the squad as far as I can.

Radz did neither and then we got hit by a huge amount t injuries which killed us. Suspect he would have been happy with Piroe, Anpadu and Gnonto but we will never know.

[spaldy]

I used the wrong terminology. MB would have taken them.... he just wouldn't have played them. A classic example was Nketiah. Sits the bench while Bamford misses sitter after sitter.

How many times did Roberts go in instead of Rodrigo, Shackleton or Boguz?

The only way the rotation changed was injury/suspension.

FWIW, I think the current squad is actually stronger than the mid season 2020-21 team. However, the championship is also a lot stronger than it was back then. There are some very good teams/coaches this year in the championship.