O/T Democracy

[great_fire]

They don't have to adopt such a policy Fire , lack of social mobility opportunity sees to that .

The system is rigged anyone can see that .

I'll give you an example , would Tony Blair have won a landslide victory in 1997 with the very same policies , team around him with a broad Barnsley accent ?

Yes or No .

Closing down grammar schools is what reduced social mobility, a Labour idea, most of the few remaining MPs who come from working class backgrounds went to grammar schools.

[BigLadonOS]

Just for you pup. Please watch and listen. Thanks

[BigLadonOS]

Closing down grammar schools is what reduced social mobility, a Labour idea, most of the few remaining MPs who come from working class backgrounds went to grammar schools.

100% Correct fire. It is in Labours best interest to keep people just about happy but not too happy.

[animallittle3]

100% Correct fire. It is in Labours best interest to keep people just about happy but not too happy.

Absolute b@llax biglad .

The very idea of grammar schools is to seperate the bright from the rest at an early age and give them a huge advantage from 11 years old .

Attitudes such as yours and Fire also fails to understand that not everyone starts from the same position in life .

Critics of Labour have always jumped on this bandwagon because it suits their purpose to do so which is to keep the working class down and pull one or two bright apples off the estate who are willing to change who they are to move upwards .

I have a cousin who is a very succesful fashion designer and went down to London over twenty years of ago , fair play except she's had to turn herself in to someone else to succeed .

The accents gone so much she may as well have come from Epsom , according to her facebook she was born in Yorkshire not Barnsley .

There's no link to the daughter of a postman from a Monk Bretton council estate in Barnsley .

Thats the english way isn't it when your class has to be hidden to get on in life .

America is a funny place at the best of times but New York lawyers talk with New York accents and coming from the streets is a badge of honour not a career ender .

Put the same brain in the present PM's head or his sidekick JRM and start them off on a Barnsley council estate and then tell me they'd make it leading the country or whatever promotion JRM received when Johnson took over .

As I said why do think Blair was so appealing to middle england ?

Totally fine to leave the estate behind but just remember to become someone else to do so .

The systems rigged .

[BigLadonOS]

Absolute b@llax biglad .

The very idea of grammar schools is to seperate the bright from the rest at an early age and give them a huge advantage from 11 years old .

Attitudes such as yours and Fire also fails to understand that not everyone starts from the same position in life .

Critics of Labour have always jumped on this bandwagon because it suits their purpose to do so which is to keep the working class down and pull one or two bright apples off the estate who are willing to change who they are to move upwards .

I have a cousin who is a very succesful fashion designer and went down to London over twenty years of ago , fair play except she's had to turn herself in to someone else to succeed .

The accents gone so much she may as well have come from Epsom , according to her facebook she was born in Yorkshire not Barnsley .

There's no link to the daughter of a postman from a Monk Bretton council estate in Barnsley .

Thats the english way isn't it when your class has to be hidden to get on in life .

America is a funny place at the best of times but New York lawyers talk with New York accents and coming from the streets is a badge of honour not a career ender .

Put the same brain in the present PM's head or his sidekick JRM and start them off on a Barnsley council estate and then tell me they'd make it leading the country or whatever promotion JRM received when Johnson took over .

As I said why do think Blair was so appealing to middle england ?

Totally fine to leave the estate behind but just remember to become someone else to do so .

The systems rigged .

I was agreeing with the point about keeping people happy but not too happy and not about grammar schools. If the working classes did not feel undervalued there would be no need for a Labour Party.

[animallittle3]

I was agreeing with the point about keeping people happy but not too happy and not about grammar schools. If the working classes did not feel undervalued there would be no need for a Labour Party.

Biglad the system makes the working class feel undervalued and has absolutely nothing to do with the Labour Party , I will criticise the party when I see fit but I aint having that .

When does anyone ever trumpet the people who do the tough jobs for minimum wage ?

No fecker .

Who speaks for the people who do the hard jobs and can barely make ends meet .

No fecker .

I remember the time when real people with Glasgow and Barnsley accents spoke up for the working class and had some clout , they made it their lifes work to improve the lifes in our communities .

Which isn't to say they got it right but the sentiment was always there .

The low wage and foodbank users have nobody and that's the truth , Corbyn sees it despite my personal differences with him on Brexit he's bang right about the injustices in UK society .

Why the feck should we have paid for the bankers fecking up the country in 2008 ? , did they forward their bonuses to the NHS post crash ? , did they feck .

The neoliberal concept of individualism is a flawed concept because human beings prosper within communities and support vehicles and especially so when they start from an economically challenged start in life .

Shut down their links to any form of solidarity and you get the politics of today which clearly isn't good for anyone no matter who they are .

Even the fecking EU need solidarity under a neoliberal umbrella or they can't operate but will do anything to deny it to anyone else , they even throw in some socialist concepts to bind them together the very thing policy wise they are against .

What's fecking wrong with the people of today ?

Can't they see they are getting played .

[BigLadonOS]

Biglad the system makes the working class feel undervalued and has absolutely nothing to do with the Labour Party , I will criticise the party when I see fit but I aint having that .

When does anyone ever trumpet the people who do the tough jobs for minimum wage ?

No fecker .

Who speaks for the people who do the hard jobs and can barely make ends meet .

No fecker .

I remember the time when real people with Glasgow and Barnsley accents spoke up for the working class and had some clout , they made it their lifes work to improve the lifes in our communities .

Which isn't to say they got it right but the sentiment was always there .

The low wage and foodbank users have nobody and that's the truth , Corbyn sees it despite my personal differences with him on Brexit he's bang right about the injustices in UK society .

Why the feck should we have paid for the bankers fecking up the country in 2008 ? , did they forward their bonuses to the NHS post crash ? , did they feck .

The neoliberal concept of individualism is a flawed concept because human beings prosper within communities and support vehicles and especially so when they start from an economically challenged start in life .

Shut down their links to any form of solidarity and you get the politics of today which clearly isn't good for anyone no matter who they are .

Even the fecking EU need solidarity under a neoliberal umbrella or they can't operate but will do anything to deny it to anyone else , they even throw in some socialist concepts to bind them together the very thing policy wise they are against .

What's fecking wrong with the people of today ?

Can't they see they are getting played .

Animal mate, I am not arguing with you about the history of the Labour party i am talking about them NOW, the Labour party is nothing more than a middle class stronghold and the days of fighting for the working classes ended with our Tony. the labour party as it is now is not the labour party of old where working class people were their number one priority.

[ragingpup]

I do not need to answer the question because that is what the PM at the time said. Now run along little boy and pick your dummy up on your way out.

I understand what he said at the time but you are the first person I have come across, anywhere that has taken Cameron's attempt to negotiate an improved deal, as "the negotiation" itself. That completely ignores the fact that the EU, when they spoke to Cameron, had no idea that we were going to vote to leave the EU, and upon doing so, actually need to re-negotiate a whole new deal. It was this 're-negotiation' that is the deal that the rest of the country have been talking about as "the deal".

Except you

[ragingpup]

If Labour lose the heartlands then they can never win an election with a majority Raging and so the society we'd like to see won't ever happen .

Remaining in the EU only favours the neoliberal policies we've endured since the 80's , austerity , tax breaks for the wealthy and the shrinking of the state are all policies rubber stamped by the EU .

I'm appalled by the left who hide behind the EU as a means of protecting workers rights when in fact it's just a bunch of opt outs and mere crumbs thrown from Brussels .

What have the left become ? , slaves to the EU project perhaps ? .

I remember a time when we were led by real people who won us rights that still stand today and didn't accept crumbs from a neoliberal project , Bob Crow will be turning in his grave .

If we want a fairer society the first thing to go is the EU followed by the Tories .

Otherwise it's never going to happen .

I respect your points animal, but do you not worry at all that the Tory right, the historical Eurosceptics, simply want to be able to break from the EU in order to cut workers conditions, consumer standards and environmental policies that we are obliged to follow? If not, in your opinion, why are these people so obsessed with breaking free from the EU?

And, in your opinion, what are the fundamental things that EU restrictions on us are that you want to get rid of, and how will it benefit us everyday Joes?

[howdydoo]

Bit of cut and paste. About right

My father's generation only voted to be part of a trading market .. politicians stole there country's and identity and moulded it into a super state.. without ever asking the people if that's what they wanted.. they never gave my father another chance to put things right with another vote.. because they knew they would vote to leave. They realized what we have lost and given away to unelected beauracrats.. the votes of 17.4 million leavers must not be allowed to be stolen.. and if they do ... France riots will look like a tea party in comparison here.. why.. because that's all the people will be left to resort too, if they are robbed of the biggest Democratic vote of our history.. politicians becarful of what you unleash.. !!!