Steve McClaren, Comes Out

[roger_ramjet]

There is going to be financial loss wether you like it or not. Unless you want to keep the whole of the current squad as it is and hope for the best and we don't continue down the same route, of managerial changes but with this squad morale that is highly likely.

Once more you display a disturbingly simplistic grasp of financial matters (although why that should surprise me is a mystery!). Whatever downsizing solution is adopted, there is a financial penalty via compensation for loss of wages and capital losses on contract terminations or transfer fee losses. Now you can argue that, had we kept those players, then those costs would have been incurred anyway over the rump of the player contracts, but its a matter of when those losses are crystallised.

A wholesale dumping of players forces all those losses into one financial year, rather than across perhaps 3 years. That creates a bigger financial loss in the year when you do it, which in turn stresses the FFP model that the club will have been working to. Even though that model is averaged across 3 years, the shifting of higher losses into earlier periods (which the rapid downsizing puts into effect) can easily create an FFP failure where there previously wasnt one.

Then of course if you bring new players in at a cost in excess of the dross you jettison, you again jack up your payroll costs and player depreciation on those players which in turn impacts FFP adversely.

I do not know how much headroom there is in the current FFP model (but I don't suppose there is that much given recent spending) and so the implementation of any "step back, reload and go forward" is fraught with financial issues.

Its not a question of whether I like it or not, its a question of how much is permitted within FFP framework and perhaps more importantly the timeframe in which it can be achieved. I for one do not expect an immediate radical overhaul but this could take over 2-3 years: during which time hopefully some of the young talent we hear so much of can step up and fill the gaps.

it aint going to be a quick fix unless some of the underperformers can produce significantly better performances in the remaining games of the season and prove themselves worthy of keeping (or commanding better open market prices).

[ramAnag]

So, supposing you identify the three already mentioned plus, again hypothetically, Thorne (for fitness rather than ability reasons), Shackell and Camara as players you want out and amongst those who 'have to go', are you seriously suggesting that the contracts of around £20,000,000 worth of 'talent' with wages of around £2m per week can simply be cancelled with no further consequences? I'm no economist - ask Roger - but I'm pretty sure it doesn't work like that.

[Rams4Justice]

Of course it won't be a quick fix, nothing is but there will be a limit on how many players, we release and bring in to fit around FFP purposes. Look at Man Utd for instance, Fergie knew his team was declining and knew that there was a big overhaul needed to take Man Utd onto the next step and he wasn't the man to do it so he retired at the right time. It has taken Moyes, Van Gaal and Mourinho to rebuild there squad and is still currently ongoing, to get back to their best and the same will be put in place for us.

[Rams4Justice]

Whose say we are going to release those player's you mentioned. It could be any player,on the squad list that goes this summer and that comes down to Rowett,who he want's to stay or go.

[roger_ramjet]

Dont you read what other people post? He said "supposing" those are the ones to go. It was an example, a speculation, an idea - what if....

Didnt take long to become Colonel Obvious again after a reasonably sensible post re Man Utd.

[Rams4Justice]

Oh! No ****, Sherlock of course I read what he put. He was talking about the problems of cancelling player's with high budgets and what the consequences would be. I gave my reply and that reply was "whose say we are going to release those player's ramAnag mentioned, it could be any player on the squad list that goes this summer and that it comes down to Rowett,to who goes and who stays" whatever the consequences may be,I'm sure we will be prepared for anything that comes our way because we have been in far worse case scenarios in our history to stop our progression now.

[ramAnag]

Oh! No ****, Sherlock of course I read what he put. He was talking about the problems of cancelling player's with high budgets and what the consequences would be. I gave my reply and that reply was "whose say we are going to release those player's ramAnag mentioned, it could be any player on the squad list that goes this summer and that it comes down to Rowett,to who goes and who stays" whatever the consequences may be,I'm sure we will be prepared for anything that comes our way because we have been in far worse case scenarios in our history to stop our progression now.

But the point surely is that some of the most disappointing performances have come from some of the most expensive signings and highest earners. I said 'supposing' because I'm not trying to second guess you but let's be honest, if you're talking about getting rid...which you are...then Butterfield, Blackman and Johnson are not exactly on the 'must keep' list are they? You started the talk of getting rid...tell us who is on your list and then add up the cost implications. I'm not having a go at you, I simply don't know how we we go about your 'master plan'.

[swaledale]

Looks like Derby appointed the wrong guy as Director of Football as R4J with his decisive insight, cutting remarks, pithy wit and unique financial skills would resolve the issue by the end of the season and no doubt land Bale on loan with Madrid paying all his wages!!

[Rams4Justice]

Let's look at it this way, there are player's who were brought from 3 previous manager's and they each build around a certain system, which we no longer have and has become quite a predicament seeing that player's don't gel well together. We need to restore balance and find certain player's, that fit into the current system and get out the one's that don't fit under Rowett. The player's that need to be shifted on are Blackman, Bent, Butterfield, Camara, Olsson, Russell, Bryson and Keogh to name the few. Those are my views but like I said before,it comes down to Rowett who gets shifted on.

[ramAnag]

Let's look at it this way, there are player's who were brought from 3 previous manager's and they each build around a certain system, which we no longer have and has become quite a predicament seeing that player's don't gel well together. We need to restore balance and find certain player's, that fit into the current system and get out the one's that don't fit under Rowett. The player's that need to be shifted on are Blackman, Bent, Butterfield, Camara, Olsson, Russell, Bryson and Keogh to name the few. Those are my views but like I said before,it comes down to Rowett who gets shifted on.

Don't agree with your choice but that's just opinion. Bent isn't a problem because I think his contract is up at the end of the season. The rest represent at least £12m worth of investment/assets and, imo, only Keogh has regularly proved himself as saleable for a decent price. Of course it should be up to Rowett who he wants to keep, who he feels he can motivate and who will fit his systems, but you started out suggesting it was an easy and straightforward task and as far as the money men are concerned it is anything but...unless you think discarding 'assets' and possibly paying a percentage of the wages of players who join rival clubs is a good way to go.