May loses again by 149

[WBA123]

The vote said “Remain” or “Leave”.

We’re leaving.

If only it were that simple...

Problem is that you are so hung up on 'leaving' you don't even care about the terms of how we leave.

As I say, there is no mandate for a no deal Brexit. I expect Art 50 will be extended.

Fingers crossed it will be revoked all together.

There must be some Leavers reading this who hold leading Brexiteers to account?? Anyone?

[stripes39]

If only it were that simple...

Problem is that you are so hung up on 'leaving' you don't even care about the terms of how we leave.

As I say, there is no mandate for a no deal Brexit. I expect Art 50 will be extended.

Fingers crossed it will be revoked all together.

There must be some Leavers reading this who hold leading Brexiteers to account?? Anyone?

Errr..no. The majority of those involved in negotiating our withdrawal were not Brexiteers.

May's done an appalling job of negotiating Brexit starting off with running secret parallel negotiations through Remainers like civil servants Olly Robbins who was woeful in his dealings with Europe and blindsiding her own EU Minister David Davis and Steve Baker.

Remainers have undermined the process throughout and directly led to the situation of such an awful deal being offered.

Remain MPs who are the big majority along with people like Blair holding blindsided talks in parallel with Europe is what has encouraged the EU to posture as they have done. Ultimately though the EU need our money and access to our market. It just shows the ineptitude of so many of our useless career politicians that they would consider taking the no deal option off the table. Anyone who has negotiated anything significant knows full well that you do not remove your strongest options off the table even if you do not plan to use them as it severely weakens your position. Sadly, so many MP's do not understand his never having held jobs in the real world.

It just shows how disingenuous so many of our political classes are with the constant mud slinging when the fact is that 90% of MP's voted to have a referendum having debated the process that would be put to the country. They knew what they were voting for. So ALL parties are culpable for this mess we are in. It was also the same MP's who twice voted legislation in that included leaving on March 29 with no deal and now they look likely to do a U-Turn and demand we don't leave without a deal. Corbyn in the meantime can only talk about a general election at the first opportunity. You could not make it up.

[WBA123]

Errr..no. The majority of those involved in negotiating our withdrawal were not Brexiteers.

May's done an appalling job of negotiating Brexit starting off with running secret parallel negotiations through Remainers like civil servants Olly Robbins who was woeful in his dealings with Europe and blindsiding her own EU Minister David Davis and Steve Baker.

Remainers have undermined the process throughout and directly led to the situation of such an awful deal being offered.

Remain MPs who are the big majority along with people like Blair holding blindsided talks in parallel with Europe is what has encouraged the EU to posture as they have done. Ultimately though the EU need our money and access to our market. It just shows the ineptitude of so many of our useless career politicians that they would consider taking the no deal option off the table. Anyone who has negotiated anything significant knows full well that you do not remove your strongest options off the table even if you do not plan to use them as it severely weakens your position. Sadly, so many MP's do not understand his never having held jobs in the real world.

It just shows how disingenuous so many of our political classes are with the constant mud slinging when the fact is that 90% of MP's voted to have a referendum having debated the process that would be put to the country. They knew what they were voting for. So ALL parties are culpable for this mess we are in. It was also the same MP's who twice voted legislation in that included leaving on March 29 with no deal and now they look likely to do a U-Turn and demand we don't leave without a deal. Corbyn in the meantime can only talk about a general election at the first opportunity. You could not make it up.

'Political Class'
You must mean people like Rees-Mogg and Farage right?

The problem I have, is that Brexit is a sh1tshow and was always likely to be one. All that Brexiteers are doing now are blaming remainers. There is no plan. They have come up with nothing.

You wanted to leave the EU, May's deal does that. So I'm confused why it has so much opposition. Its time to look in the mirror for all Leave voters, you have been lied to on a mass scale by charlatans like Johnson and Farage. Who still have nothing better to offer the country than what May did.

Truthfully, if there was a leave option available that was better than the option of remaining in the EU, why haven't parliament voted for it?

The answer is quite simple, there isn't one.

[TipperaryBaggie]

I fear that if the referendum result got overturned then the anarchy on the streets would make Macron's yellow vest protests look like a childrens tea party! Lets hope that this is avoided and common sense prevails and the Parliamentarians do not betray the people.

[Leicesterbaggie]

I fear that if the referendum result got overturned then the anarchy on the streets would make Macron's yellow vest protests look like a childrens tea party! Lets hope that this is avoided and common sense prevails and the Parliamentarians do not betray the people.

I fear that you could well be correct but again these politicians with 'pint sized' brains haven't got the foresight to understand this, or choose not to.

[Leicesterbaggie]

Emily Thornbury was interviewed on 5 Live this morning and stated that the country was split on Brexit 50-50. God help us when we 've got politicians with the brain of gnat. No, you silly woman, it was 52% to 48% in favour of leaving. Can't your 'pea size' brain understand that! It's like saying that the pass mark for an exam is 52% and you got 48% so you've passed. I give up!

[mickd1961]

If only it were that simple...

Problem is that you are so hung up on 'leaving' you don't even care about the terms of how we leave.

As I say, there is no mandate for a no deal Brexit. I expect Art 50 will be extended.

Fingers crossed it will be revoked all together.

There must be some Leavers reading this who hold leading Brexiteers to account?? Anyone?

It seems obvious from your comments that you’ve never been involved in a business meeting.

The two cards you don’t give up are the ability to walk away and the threat of not paying an amicable severance payment ( £39 Billion )

I’d love to know what field it is you’re employed in and how old you are?

Just for transparency I’m 57 and I’ve run my own business for 22 years and 50% of my trade is with Europe.

I’ve been at work for 41 years almost and every one of my working days has involved being involved in the commercial world where I’ve had to negotiate with people.

A small amount of background about you would be appreciated?

[WBA123]

It seems obvious from your comments that you’ve never been involved in a business meeting.

The two cards you don’t give up are the ability to walk away and the threat of not paying an amicable severance payment ( £39 Billion )

I’d love to know what field it is you’re employed in and how old you are?

Just for transparency I’m 57 and I’ve run my own business for 22 years and 50% of my trade is with Europe.

I’ve been at work for 41 years almost and every one of my working days has involved being involved in the commercial world where I’ve had to negotiate with people.

A small amount of background about you would be appreciated?

Okay, I don't tend to shout it about because we all have opinions on here and I don't want it to seem like I'm any kind of expert, because I'm not. But some viewpoints on here are misinformed IMO.

I'm mid-late 30's. I went to a fairly good university where I studied Law and Economics.

I've been working in international trade and supply chain for 15+ years, since I have left University. I've negotiated with large multi-national businesses, at home and abroad, including pharmaceutical and automotive manufacturers. The information I am receiving from both sectors is that Brexit has so far been very damaging to them and will be to the UK.

I'm London based, but I've travelled with work to the United States, Middle East, Far East and across most of Europe.

I'm no expert on Brexit, but I believe I've got a fairly good amount of knowledge on EU Law, the Customs Union, the Single Market, global and domestic economics. I've got a great knowledge of supply chain and international trade.

My angle is that negotiation is about understanding each others point of view and coming to an agreement for which both sides are happy. Its not about threatening to do something which would be nonsensical. Leaving with no deal is nonsensical, but then that is what politics is right now.

It baffles me that 50% of your trade is with the EU, yet you want to make it more difficult to trade with them? Do you mind me asking if your business is reliant on JIT manufacturing? Or if you are a customer of or supplier to the EU (or both)?

Also, I'd be keen to know if you felt that your business wouldn't be affected before the vote? And now that it has been, whether you place any responsibility for this on Leave supporting politicians?

I tend to be neutral in my UK business meetings but the vast majority of the feedback I get is that business uncertainty is crippling us right now. Most Europeans (Or non Europeans even) who I'm dealing with believe Brexit is a case of self-harm, I can't help but agree...

[stripes39]

'Political Class'
You must mean people like Rees-Mogg and Farage right?

Wrong. By political class I meant politicians across the board if you read what I wrote. The mess we are in is not down to one or two or a few individuals. Sometimes it pays to try and look at things objectively without political bias. I’ve already said that Mays handling of this has been woeful but so has Labours. They’ve no clear policy, just a raft of contradictions and sound bites with most of their own supporters not knowing what their policy is on Brexit. If ever we needed strong credible opposition it is now but sadly Jezza, McDonnel, Thornbury and Abbott et al are none of these. My point was a vast majority across the board collectively voted for a referendum and twice to have a no deal option included for deadline day. They are all culpable for creating this mess

[WBA123]

Wrong. By political class I meant politicians across the board if you read what I wrote. The mess we are in is not down to one or two or a few individuals. Sometimes it pays to try and look at things objectively without political bias. I’ve already said that Mays handling of this has been woeful but so has Labours. They’ve no clear policy, just a raft of contradictions and sound bites with most of their own supporters not knowing what their policy is on Brexit. If ever we needed strong credible opposition it is now but sadly Jezza, McDonnel, Thornbury and Abbott et al are none of these. My point was a vast majority across the board collectively voted for a referendum and twice to have a no deal option included for deadline day. They are all culpable for creating this mess

Agree with you that the opposition has been terrible.

Agree with you that majority of the government are incompetent.

Disagree with you that remain supporting MPs are responsible for this mess.