O/T 48,000 illegal immigrants housed in mainly 4 star UK hotels

[John2]

To be fair there wont be any valid link to any genuine figures, I dont think anyones counting anymore.

A hotel where I used to hold business meetings is now closed to the public, its now half full from gentlemen who came over from Calais

Gm, wendun has not only reopened this thread with a lie. It's one he has already been corrected on. At no point have I challenged his Dover figures, and he knows this. Let's have a recap.

Wendun made this post containing specific quotes and stats:

Yesterday Lucy Moreton, general secretary of the Immigration Services Union told Radio 4 that we were reaching a crisis point on illegal immigration, that (quote); "hardly any are sent back even if their claims fail", the BBC reported (ragingpup disagrees of course) ""record numbers landing at Dover", that incredibly right wing outlet The Independent mentioned that of 1839 failed asylum claims only 155 had been deported "the rest had disappeared into the Black economy." Today, former head of Immigration Services, Tony Smith, tells the BBC "we are at crisis point." But no, don't listen to these people. Listen instead to Wan and raging who would happily give their wives and daughters to these people rather than look non-PC at their dinner parties. Pathetic.

I replied:

wendun, you'll have to help me. I'm usually quite a capable and skilled Googler.

I searched for 'tony Smith BBC "we are at crisis point"' and got the message: It looks like there aren't any great matches for your search

I also tried searching 'site:independent.co.uk 1839 asylum claims 155 deported' and got zero results.

I also tried 'bbc "the rest had disappeared into the Black economy"' and got no results.

I was genuinely interested to read the links. What you describe sounds like a serious problem and believe it or not I would be in agreement and share your concern. Can you please provide the links as I'm really struggling to confirm they actually exist?

I also searched for Lucy Moreton Radio 4 and could find nothing with yesterdays date on, but obviously radio is harder for that so lets just pass on that one.

Wendun then completely ignored my questions and made this bizarre and unrelated defence about the numbers at Dover:

I don't know what planet John2 is on. Does he dispute record numbers arriving at Dover? Does he dispute that less than 10% of failed asylum seekers have been deported? Loved the BBC reports today: zeroed right in on the 8 months pregnant woman and "several children." Ignore the young guys who are after our jobs, lives and women. Well done, John.

To which I replied:

Sorry wendun, somehow you completely failed to address my post. I made no comment about the number of people arriving at Dover, nor the number of deported asylum seekers.

I was simply trying to establish where you get your information from, as you made very specific claims about articles that I cannot find. It's not unreasonable for me to ask. Can you help?

To which he angrily replied:

What I said was that Tony Smith, former head of Immigration Services had said on BBC Radio 4 we were at crisis point. You, you complete pr*ck, claimed this was entirely made up. No doubt as this link was made up?
https://www.belfasttelegraph.co.uk/n...-39416626.html

I then said:

Erm, no. Here's exactly what you said about Tony Smith:

'Today, former head of Immigration Services, Tony Smith, tells the BBC "we are at crisis point."'

This contains a very specific quote and a reference to him appearing on the BBC, none of which I could find.

The Belfast Times article does not feature the quote "we are at crisis point" - so this must be somewhere else, or invented - which is it?

Also, the article you've inked doesn't even imply we are at crisis point, it says we need to take steps to avoid getting to Crisis point. Its in the opening sentence: "A failure by the UK to reach a new agreement with France on how to deal with migrant crossings could lead to numbers reaching “crisis” levels, an ex-Border Force chief has warned."

You've also ignored the other article I looked into?


See the problem here? You have very strong views, but what you're saying doesn't add up, and you don't seem to care about facts or integrity of the information you consume as long as something confirms what you already strongly believe. This failing undermines your world view. You either have a distorted perception of reality and you misinterpret and spin articles in your own head (and forget where they came from), or you get your information from dodgy sources and are too trusting of it, or you maliciously make stuff up, or you get weirdly defensive and angry when it would be far easier to find the article you claim to have read.

All I have done is ask simple and fair questions. The fact you've got so aggressive and triggered in your response might be something for you have a think about why you're reacting in that way.

Unless you can provide evidence showing otherwise, your provided quote could well be made up - so can you please explain this rather than just calling me a "complete pr*ck"?

Wendun then made an unrelated post where he claimed 'A thread typically full of obfuscation and disingenuity from the usual suspects.'

To which I replied:

If you want to talk about obfuscation and disingenuity let me refer you back to [the first] post you made.

You make a number of very specific claims about articles here that do not appear to exist. You have been asked to provide links and have failed.

It raises the question, where do you get your information from?

Are you just incompetent at distinguishing credible sources from dodgy ones, or do you literally just make stuff up?

Case in point:
"The Independent mentioned that of 1839 failed asylum claims only 155 had been deported "the rest had disappeared into the Black economy."'

You used a very specific quote that a quick search seems to suggest does not exist.

A search for the numbers used, '1839 failed asylum claims and 155 deportations' does not seem to exist either.

Can you provide a link to the Independent article in question?

Or are you the one guilty of "obfuscation and disingenuity"? Talk us through how you come to end up sharing things like this, do you care whether the information you share and consume is correct?

Wendun then said:

Dear me, I honestly thought you'd left us roly. I have several wooden posts in my garden. The one marked roly I removed along with Mike and the Kilimanjaro Kid. Raging and John2 remain. The point to all this nonsense is that all the stuff I post is easily accessible. Raging knows it's correct, so probably does John. You're a bit thick so may actually not know. I simply refuse to go to the Advanced sh*te to post a link that the boys will ignore anyway. Integrity!!! You have to laugh when an rrsewipe B.itcoin speculator tries the "integrity" gambit.

I then pointed out that it could be proven that he had made up information:

I can prove you made it up.

Google is how.

If you type a quote (within quotation marks) into Google it will find you any articles that contain it. You can even tell it to only return results from certain sites.

For example, today an Independent article said "it was reported that at least 671 machines were removed in critical voting states".

Here's the Google search that shows how this simple method works:
https://www.google.com/search?q=site...ting+states%22


Even with an exceptionally generously vague Google search for your claim about an article on 1839 failed asylum seekers, no article mentioning that number exists:
https://www.google.com/search?q=site...1839%22+asylum

The simple fact is, at some point those numbers and quotes you provided have been made up.

I'm not even suggesting there isn't a problem or a reasonable debate to be had. We just need to establish the facts to be able to have such a discussion - you are showing yourself to be someone who shares made up facts and all I want to establish is why, or be proven wrong.

If the article existed you could so easily prove me wrong... curious that you go to all this trouble to not back up your claims. You seem to think you have nothing to prove, but I've just proven you're sharing lies.

And then.... the put the icing on the cake. He re-ignites the thread with a claim that I called him a liar about his figures on the number of arrivals at Dover, despite knowing I never have, and already having explicitly told him I hadn't:

You can't, obviously. I mention 100 immigrants coming in to Dover on one day and John2 and raging call me a liar. It was actually 200 so they have a point. Yesterday 300 sailed in but no one seems to give a f*ck so fair enough. Up here we are keeping our powder dry.

This all serves to prove that wendun is willing to just make things up and lie to make a point. It's there, proven in black and white. He repeats a lie that has already been clarified about Dover figures. I really hope he's just a message board persona, because if he's not just doing it for 'bites' I think the bloke's got various anger and integrity issues.

[KerrAvon]

The stats are probably incomplete and sometimes hard to interpret, John.

[howdydoo]

It seems Wendun isn't the only one getting angry.

Personally I'd rather help and contribute to help family or donate to causes I fully support.

To everyone who thinks we live in a dirty capitalist society and want to make the world a better place, can you stop bleating for once? Here you go. A real opportunity to make a difference.

https://www.refugeesathome.org/


Thought not. LOL

If you can help be sure to keep safe.

[rolymiller]

.talki g *******s again rolly?.if you are happy for these illegal migrants to come over why not do a Gary Lineker and take one into your home. That goes for any other arse wipes that are happy to see them invading Britain has you say.

Based on that stovic maybe I should take Monty in!

[rolymiller]

I'm dead sure that you have a line of illegality in you somewhere as well stovic. So you are welcome to stay at my house as well but as my old mum used to say " you will have to take us as you find us".

[Stovicmiller]

Roly I'm English born and bred. I'm just back from invading Scotland. Very nice country tho.

[rolymiller]

Roly I'm English born and bred. I'm just back from invading Scotland. Very nice country tho.

So am I but I'm dead sure I have some foreign blood in me. Britain has been invaded by different tribes for centuries. In fact I reckon I have many of the same genes as the folks who are coming over in boats. And so will you....

The only way to stop folks coming in to Britain is to help make their countries more stable and worth living in. Till you do that they will keep coming. Its the same argument with crime. Make peoples lives worth living by ensuring they have a decent standard of living and they wont need to turn to crime. Its the old story though int it? Equality is the key to a lot of the worlds problems. Genuinely work towards equality and a lot of social problems will improve.

We can carry on as we are and social problems will get worse to the point where we will just end kicking the shyte out of each other and the end of the human race...

I don't see much hope for the human race myself I would be surprised if we still have any form of civilisation in 200 years. I wont be here to see if I was reight though which is a shame. I would have liked to have seen how it panned out...

I'm a cheery soul but a realist as well...

[CAMiller]

So am I but I'm dead sure I have some foreign blood in me. Britain has been invaded by different tribes for centuries. In fact I reckon I have many of the same genes as the folks who are coming over in boats. And so will you....

The only way to stop folks coming in to Britain is to help make their countries more stable and worth living in. Till you do that they will keep coming. Its the same argument with crime. Make peoples lives worth living by ensuring they have a decent standard of living and they wont need to turn to crime. Its the old story though int it? Equality is the key to a lot of the worlds problems. Genuinely work towards equality and a lot of social problems will improve.

We can carry on as we are and social problems will get worse to the point where we will just end kicking the shyte out of each other and the end of the human race...

I don't see much hope for the human race myself I would be surprised if we still have any form of civilisation in 200 years. I wont be here to see if I was reight though which is a shame. I would have liked to have seen how it panned out...

I'm a cheery soul but a realist as well...

Out of interest Roly what percentage of crime would you say is related to poverty compared to lust, greed, drugs, pleasure....other possible factors?

[wendun]

Out of interest Roly what percentage of crime would you say is related to poverty compared to lust, greed, drugs, pleasure....other possible factors?

Roly is either a fantasist, dishonest or a nut job; probably all three. Apparently we have to put up with illegals floating in to the UK until we can construct a world based on John Lennon songs or Coca Cola adverts.
Roly and the boys trot out the old line about Brits being a mongrel race. Unfortunately it's simply not true. Overwhelmingly the populations of northern England and southern Scotland are frighteningly homogeneous and DNA shows they have hardly been disturbed for many centuries. The last "foreign" inputs to make much of a difference were 8th-10th century Irish, 9th-10th century Danish and 10th century Norse. But let's not let evidence get in the way of a Lefty-Liberal multicultural Utopia. As for John 2, prolix and verbosity are a turn off and I stopped reading after line two.

[Brin]

Gm, wendun has not only reopened this thread with a lie. It's one he has already been corrected on. At no point have I challenged his Dover figures, and he knows this. Let's have a recap.

Wendun made this post containing specific quotes and stats:



I replied:



Wendun then completely ignored my questions and made this bizarre and unrelated defence about the numbers at Dover:


To which I replied:



To which he angrily replied:




I then said:




Wendun then made an unrelated post where he claimed 'A thread typically full of obfuscation and disingenuity from the usual suspects.'

To which I replied:



Wendun then said:



I then pointed out that it could be proven that he had made up information:



And then.... the put the icing on the cake. He re-ignites the thread with a claim that I called him a liar about his figures on the number of arrivals at Dover, despite knowing I never have, and already having explicitly told him I hadn't:



This all serves to prove that wendun is willing to just make things up and lie to make a point. It's there, proven in black and white. He repeats a lie that has already been clarified about Dover figures. I really hope he's just a message board persona, because if he's not just doing it for 'bites' I think the bloke's got various anger and integrity issues.

You sound like a petulant kid, 'Miss, Miss, Wendun's done something wrong. No apologies it just had to be said.

Yawn zzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzzz