O/T:- ⚠️Impressed with the leadership [The UK Party Politics Thread]

[Kent Magpie]

I think it will eventually get passed with more amendments marginalising the ECHR and other international treaties. I think it will be simply because the hard right of the party are more willing to bring the government down than the 'One Nation' group. Sunak knows that the centrists will cave in at the end but the loons will happily hole the shop and then watch it sink... and then we can send the 100 - 200 refuges to Rwanda and accept their immigrants in return.

[i961pie]

So despite many Tory MPs publicly criticising the bill, not a single one of them voted against it!

A big win for the Abstention and Self Preservation Party.

No surprise there it would have been a bit like Turkeys voting for Xmas.

[Elite_Pie]

No surprise there it would have been a bit like Turkeys voting for Xmas.

The sad thing is that MPs voting for what's best for them rather than what's best for the people who elected them seems to be accepted, because "it's what they all do, they're all the same".

[Woodypie]

All BFP had to do was make it clear he thought the grooming gangs were a disgrace.
The way I have been replied to by two or three on here would make you think I have support for the gangs and that I am racist.
EP you are right I do inhabit a strange and disturbing world, and it is getting worse, thanks to people with differing views to mine and others being silenced, on a growing scale, and laughingly being labelled far right.

Unfortunately many people are happy to share disparaging things about grooming young girls for ***ual abuse. Even the most respected of posters on here has posted his amusing thoughts about the grooming process. No laughing matter in my experience.

[magpie_mania]

A minister flew back from Cop 28 in Dubai to vote, then flew back!

[Ex_Southwell_Magpie]

Would be nice to have a credible opposition rather than the vote for us we’re not Tory option.
I think most people are just genuinely fed up with politics now and looking at the local mayoral turnout, it seems that we have a mayor that nobody really wants or think necessary.

[jackal2]

Good to see the Greens and LibDems make significant gains, we need to get away from two-party domination.

The funniest thing is 'honest' Lee Anderson predicting Reform UK will produce "a political earthquake", when they only managed a pathetic two council seats. The best comment I read was from someone who replied "Earthquake Lee???? More of a wet fart".

It won't surprise you that I've got no political liking for the Lib Dems and the Greens, and obviously I know you've got no liking for Reform UK, but I agree with your point that we need to get away from two-party domination because both of the two 'major' parties are now so hopelessly compromised that neither comes close to representing the core right or left-wing ideologies they're supposed to represent.

The Conservatives are no longer conservative and Labour are no longer socialist. Neither offer the public any real choice or any prospect of genuine change. That's not to say there aren't still politicians within those two parties who remain consistent and true to their principles, but they're getting fewer, increasingly overrun by young, ambitious, but vacuous career politicians who have no real life experience or core values. They're happy to play within the ever more narrow tram lines of mainstream political debate, changing their shape and message in a heartbeat if they think it will move them more quickly up the political ladder.

We have an electoral system designed to make it almost impossible for any party other than the Conservatives or Labour to make serious inroads, and that's why, to use George Galloway's phrase, the public are currently being asked to choose between two cheeks of the same backside. At the next General Election the pendulum (such as it is!) will swing again and the public will no doubt make the 'prescribed' switch - with no particular enthusiasm - to something masquerading as the left cheek, but it won't materially change or improves their lives to any significant degree.

For anything to really change, something needs to break the mainstream political cycle, and I'm (almost) past the point of caring whether that disruption comes from an authentic right or left-wing party, as long as it comes from somewhere. The real political battle now isn't the fake choice between Conservatives and Labour, but the one to break the the current political control system in its entirety and give power and genuine choice back to the people.

Various smaller parties have attempted to challenge the Conservative/Labour hegemony before and ultimately fallen victim to the electoral system, but given that the public will inevitably continue to be offered no real choice at all by the 'big two', the hope must be that what is currently manifesting as public apathy will eventually turn to realisation and then anger, sufficient to create a situation where the two parties, and the electoral system that protects them, are replaced.

[keldsyke]

In the interests of balance, I have to say I'm NOT impressed with the leadership. Starmer & Co grabbing freebies with both hands is something I hoped wouldn't happen, so maybe those who said "they're all the same" are right after all. Why does Starmer need free tickets, free clothes and free glasses? I'm sure he could afford to pay himself. What's worse is that he initially tried to justify it before quite rightly being forced to backtrack. I still think he offers a better future than the Tories, but the gap between them isn't as wide as I hoped it would be.

Great, unexpected and brave post to come on and acknowledge the situation, by the sounds of it it’s been going on for years in the Labour Party which really doesn’t surprise me that they are all (all parties) at it. Really interested how this whole situation with Starmer and the rest will pan out in the next few weeks. IMO Starmer, Lammy, Rayner, Reeves. Gray etc are the worst officials ever in power and that’s saying something. God knows what the budget will bring.

[Elite_Pie]

Great, unexpected and brave post to come on and acknowledge the situation.

Just like with Notts games, I try and say what I see whatever I may have thought before.

I once made David Vaughan MOM as proof of that!

[Notsohumblepie]

Great, unexpected and brave post to come on and acknowledge the situation, by the sounds of it it’s been going on for years in the Labour Party which really doesn’t surprise me that they are all (all parties) at it. Really interested how this whole situation with Starmer and the rest will pan out in the next few weeks. IMO Starmer, Lammy, Rayner, Reeves. Gray etc are the worst officials ever in power and that’s saying something. God knows what the budget will bring.

In view of the David Lammy " Mastermind" answer that Henry the Eighth was succeeded by Henry the Seventh , I suppose we should be grateful that the chancellorship went elsewhere.