Election Year or Fear!

[ramAnag]

Interesting to see on the TV news last night, two of the three people approached in the vox pop stated (I paraphrase) that there are too many immigrants in their area not prepared to contribute to the common good and just looking for what they can take. ?Bloody right wing gammons? goes the cry from some of our little band, but hang on: both were first generation immigrants, a small sample maybe but my guess is they know better than we do

I think what’s more interesting - in the context of this forum and nothing more - is that you choose to veer away completely from Swale’s more ‘heavyweight’ contributions to make a slightly silly attempt to reignite the tedious ‘gammon’ fall out before betraying your true mindset by making a vaguely racist point.

Is anyone likely to be surprised that some ‘immigrants in their area are not prepared to contribute to the common good’?
Isn’t that true of all people in virtually all walks of life?
There are those who get stuck in to help the immediate community and those who don’t. The doers…and the takers.
That, in my experience, is true in all walks of life and has nothing whatsoever to do with whether someone is an immigrant or not.

[Andy_Faber]

I think what’s more interesting - in the context of this forum and nothing more - is that you choose to veer away completely from Swale’s more ‘heavyweight’ contributions to make a slightly silly attempt to reignite the tedious ‘gammon’ fall out before betraying your true mindset by making a vaguely racist point.

Is anyone likely to be surprised that some ‘immigrants in their area are not prepared to contribute to the common good’?
Isn’t that true of all people in virtually all walks of life?
There are those who get stuck in to help the immediate community and those who don’t. The doers…and the takers.
That, in my experience, is true in all walks of life and has nothing whatsoever to do with whether someone is an immigrant or not.

I’m not interested in what Swale has to say in his (dare I say) essays, when it comes to changing hearts and minds quantity isn’t quality, and my point isn’t vaguely racist, it (tries to) make a point about the complexities of the issue, which the mere numbers as quoted by KS yesterday didn’t address in fact IMO sought to hide.

[swaledale]

Interesting to see on the TV news last night, two of the three people approached in the vox pop stated (I paraphrase) that there are too many immigrants in their area not prepared to contribute to the common good and just looking for what they can take. ?Bloody right wing gammons? goes the cry from some of our little band, but hang on: both were first generation immigrants, a small sample maybe but my guess is they know better than we do

Ah so now in addition to anecdotes, we learn your views are based on what you guess. That explains quite a lot.

Quelle surprise that SOME of those who were immigrants and benefitted from immigration are critical of SOME current immigrants. I'm sure you recall Gisella Stuart the very pro Brexit Labour MP of German origin, or indeed the Tories very own Kemi Badenoch and before that Rishi Sunak all of whom seemed very keen to be critical of immigration. never mind that well known internationalist Farage who is married to a German.

If we are going on anecdotes, in the same context I can recall a surprising number of women leaders/managers who were very anti improving matters for women at work on the basis it seemed that they had had to put up with discrimination/***ual harassment etc. and saw no reason to smooth the path of those who followed on behind!

I guess its human nature sad though it is, to a) consider oneself to be of higher worth than others similar to you and b) to want equality and fairness of opportunity when its you who is going to benefit, but to seek to deny others the opportunities you enjoyed.

One could also point out it was Turkish immigrants to Germany who were behind the creation of one of the most effective covid vaccines, or that anecdotally the last time I was in hospital for a serious operation the anaesthetist was a Indian immigrant, the nurses from Sierra Leone, Kenya and Poland and very good they all were.

[ramAnag]

I??m not interested in what Swale has to say in his (dare I say) essays, when it comes to changing hearts and minds quantity isn??t quality, and my point isn??t vaguely racist, it (tries to) make a point about the complexities of the issue, which the mere numbers as quoted by KS yesterday didn??t address in fact IMO sought to hide.

You seem to me to be as ‘obsessed’ by Swale as you claim him to be by TTR, but maybe that’s just my interpretation.

Your point is ‘vaguely racist’ imo - possibly subconsciously so - because it takes a general point and directs it solely at immigrants.

We all know that there are doers and takers. Those who allow their dogs to sh*t in the street and those who clean it up, those who worked damned hard to overcome the pandemic and those who simply sought to profit from it, those who riot and those who repair the consequent damage…but that’s just a comment on people in general. Whether or not they are immigrants is irrelevant.
Of course there are immigrants who lack community spirit…but there are plenty of others who do too.

[swaledale]

I?’m not interested in what Swale has to say in his (dare I say) essays, when it comes to changing hearts and minds quantity isn?’t quality, and my point isn?’t vaguely racist, it (tries to) make a point about the complexities of the issue, which the mere numbers as quoted by KS yesterday didn?’t address in fact IMO sought to hide.

You mean, your unable to formulate a reasoned response to the points I raise without resorting to anecdotes, clich?s, subtle racism and a rather ridiculous belief that your views are shared by the majority of people in the UK (whilst being unable to provide any evidence for this claim). I guess that's why you ahve not been able to explain what in your opinion is "good bullying" or why Equality and Diversity is a problem, why its acceptable to scrap government departments in the name of "efficiency" without actually saving costs or considering the impact on people who are vulnerable and less well off, or to deport people without due consideration of the law?

[Trickytreesreds]

Starmer isn't known for his mathematical skills, but he really does scrape the barrel thinking he can fog everyone else,

https://fb.watch/zN1wD5SNb0/

[Andy_Faber]

You seem to me to be as ‘obsessed’ by Swale as you claim him to be by TTR, but maybe that’s just my interpretation.

You?re entitled to your interpretation and events in the short and medium term show that you?re wrong. In the medium term, With the exception of exposing swales inability to be true to his edict that he would forever ignore TTR (which was pointed out by others as well as me) I haven?t responded to or commented about Swale since before mid April, probably longer than that. I can?t be bothered to go further back than that. In the same time period, and also short term (see his responses to my fairly even handed comments on the Liverpool issue), and I guess in the recent absence of TTR to bate, Swale has constantly berated me at every opportunity, even in posts where someone else is the poster he?s replying to. He?s done it today. I?ve resisted the temptation to repeat the RG jibe over the past year or so but I genuinely believe you struggle to overcome a bias, subconscious or otherwise, which colours your responses. I?ve revisited posts right back through the last month or so to check out my belief and maybe you should too

[ramAnag]

I haven?t responded to or commented about Swale since BEFORE MID APRIL, PROBABLY LONGER THAN THAT. I can?t be bothered to go further back than that. I?ve revisited posts right back through the last month or so to check out my belief and maybe you should too

Really? Apart from 27/4, 28/4, 2/5, 8/5, 10/5, 13/5 and 14/5. Or maybe that was another Andy Faber.

That’s ten minutes of my life I’ll never get back so let’s not go there again.

To be clear. It’s no secret my political allegiances lie much more closely with Swale (and MA and Sith) than you. To me he speaks much more sense about politics than you. Beyond that I know neither of you and have no bias.

[Andy_Faber]

Really? Apart from 27/4, 28/4, 2/5, 8/5, 10/5, 13/5 and 14/5. Or maybe that was another Andy Faber.

That’s ten minutes of my life I’ll never get back so let’s not go there again.

To be clear. It’s no secret my political allegiances lie much more closely with Swale (and MA and Sith) than you. To me he speaks much more sense about politics than you. Beyond that I know neither of you and have no bias.

I can?t go beyond 1st May on my phone so I?ll give you the April ones as I can?t see the content but re the others you just highlight how your desperation to defend Swales bile and get at me leads to rush out answers and, deplorable when you would rebuke pupils for the same, not read the exam question properly. I stated, and I?ll quote, that mentioning Swale was ? With the exception of exposing swales inability to be true to his edict that he would forever ignore TTR (which was pointed out by others as well as me)?. Your attempt to hide that fact iin an attempt to validate your response was either clumsy, careless or desperate, I?m not sure which. Meanwhile, you remain silent as Swale pops up and berates my every comment. Two tier Ramanag.

[ramAnag]

‘Desperation to defend Swale’s bile and get at me’. What are you talking about?
You sound obsessed again, AF, and really, really boring.
Doesn’t matter what you’re referring to in particular. I said you sound about as obsessed with Swale as you claim him to be with TTR and you’re doing a very good job of proving it.