O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[Andy_Faber]

Factually wrong? About the Covid figures in relation to elsewhere in Europe...the Brexit negotiations...Kent...the countries we are not welcome to travel to?

I ask again...what ‘achievements’ and ‘brave thinking’? I used to think the Nightingale Hospitals were an ‘achievement’ and acknowledged them as such. Whatever happened to them?

And I’m not sure what point you’re making about Covid cases and deaths, nothing to be proud of in any country IMO

[ramAnag]

And I’m not sure what point you’re making about Covid cases and deaths, nothing to be proud of in any country IMO

My point is that you’re continually talking about ‘achievements’ and ‘brave decisions’, although for the second time you’ve provided no examples, and yet the evidence suggests otherwise.

Believe it or not, and I’m past caring with those who continually seek to defend the indefensible on here, it gives me no satisfaction to draw attention to how dreadful our figures are. We have the second highest number of cases and the second highest number of deaths in Europe.
I totally accept they are difficult comparisons but probably the most realistic one, in terms of climate and population, is Germany. The situation has worsened there recently as Ram59 was only too pleased to point out the other day, but look at the figures and ask who’s is the greater achievement?

It’s not a ‘woe is me’ response...it’s a ‘wake up and smell the coffee’ response, AF...and as for being ‘ashamed’ of our country. I’m sorry GP, but amongst the things I’m proud of, yes...I am ashamed that this country could allow itself to be dragged onto the periphery of international decision making and into the gutter by the likes of Farage, could choose to vote for such a rotten leader as Johnson, and is now actually unwelcome in so many other parts of the world - from Canada to India - because of our record of dealing with Covid.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Some facts for you Andy.
‘Big 5’ Covid cases. France 2,376, 852. UK 1,849,403. Italy 1,843,712. Spain 1,751,884. Germany. 1,337,078.
‘Big 5’ Covid deaths. Italy 64,520. UK 64,170. France 57,911. Spain 48,013. Germany 21,975.

UK visitors are currently banned from France, Germany, Italy, Belgium, Austria, Finland, Poland, Denmark, Bulgaria, Holland, Turkey, Morocco, Canada and India.

The £ is in free fall. Kent is a car park and the ‘easiest ever/oven ready’ Brexit negotiations appear shambolic and, like everything else, ridiculously last minute when anyone with even a modicum of intelligence knows, and has known for some time, it makes no sense to be attempting such complex negotiations in the midst of a pandemic.

That’s the reality...so these ‘achievements’ and this ‘brave thinking’ of yours. Can we have some examples please? All I currently see and feel is sadness and shame.

It's sad that you can see no positives and feel ashamed of our country, just a good job that the man in the street is, broadly speaking, and based on my limited circle of acquaintances, not so negative. **** happens...

I'm no Tigger bouncing with excitement, but so pleased not to be Eeyore. Perhaps I'm Piglet, happily going to the Barbekew blissfully unaware that I'm the main course.

[Andy_Faber]

‘brave decisions’.

Achievements include the Oxford vaccine, the nightingale hospitals, the economic and financial measures (in a finance guy and they literally took my breath away), vaccine approval

Note if you think I’m including you in my U.K. shaming I’m not, I think we’ve had that discussion elsewhere

[ramAnag]

Achievements include the Oxford vaccine, the nightingale hospitals, the economic and financial measures (in a finance guy and they literally took my breath away), vaccine approval

Note if you think I’m including you in my U.K. shaming I’m not, I think we’ve had that discussion elsewhere

Well yes, I agree...the Oxford vaccine will be a great achievement if and when it becomes available.
I’d love to agree about the Nightingale Hospitals and, back in the Spring I did think so...but they haven’t been ‘built’...they’re spaces that have been acquired and furnished but which we seemingly don’t have the staff to use.
The financial measures? I don’t feel equipped to comment. The amount of money must be truly staggering...incomprehensible. Was there any choice? I don’t know. Will it have to be paid back? Of course.
Vaccine approval? I have my doubts. The only vaccine that’s been approved is of Turkish, German and Belgian origin. Quite why the EU hasn’t been so approving yet is a concern, as is Hancock’s childlike enthusiasm to shout ‘we were first’, and that is a concern two medics of my acquaintance share.

[Andy_Faber]

Well yes, I agree...the Oxford vaccine will be a great achievement if and when it becomes available.
I’d love to agree about the Nightingale Hospitals and, back in the Spring I did think so...but they haven’t been ‘built’...they’re spaces that have been acquired and furnished but which we seemingly don’t have the staff to use.
The financial measures? I don’t feel equipped to comment. The amount of money must be truly staggering...incomprehensible. Was there any choice? I don’t know. Will it have to be paid back? Of course.
Vaccine approval? I have my doubts. The only vaccine that’s been approved is of Turkish, German and Belgian origin. Quite why the EU hasn’t been so approving yet is a concern, as is Hancock’s childlike enthusiasm to shout ‘we were first’, and that is a concern two medics of my acquaintance share.

I’m not going to pick holes in this, I think we are collectively getting too it picky about stuff, but your response shows that there’s been some good and some bad, and I’ll bend a bit to your POV and say some decisions have been clearly bonkers, but HMG are not being helped by the soothsayers. I’ve decided that the most constructive I personally can be to help the cause is do as I’ve been asked and persuade people I can influence to do the same. That’s so far resulted in one person not travelling out of tier 4 against the rules and one not travelling into tier 4 against the rules and I consider that far more constructive than criticism of the macro performance of the govt

[Andy_Faber]

But he does, repeatedly, ‘overpromise’ and ‘underdeliver’ - just as Trump did. They’re two of a kind, so maybe the ‘journalist community’ are just telling the truth. Personally I’ll believe Fergus Walsh over any Cabinet member every time.

Ram...I think your post simply betrays your anti European bias, but I certainly wish Boris was in Hungary.

Yes you are right about Fergus Walsh but for every Fergus Walsh there’s a Hugh Pym, who adds no true journalism to the piece, I’m listening to him now just trotting out stuff I’ve heard 100 times already. Waste of license fee

[Geoff Parkstone]

I can relate to that. Aim low and become a teacher, aim high and if you get halfway you still look down on the crowd.

I'm joking....................

My point being that its just been announced that the EMA / EU have finally approved the Pfizer vaccine

[MadAmster]

Some EU countries are starting their vaccination programmes today. Others will be starting in the next few days. For reasons unknown, we Dutch start on January 8th....... Doesn't affect me though, not yet anyway. Care home staff are first, care home residents 2nd, docs, nurses and other health care staff 3rd. Followed by over 80s, 70s, 60s and those with underlying health issues and healthy adults with Over 16s at the bottom of the list. Thus far there are no plans to vaccinate pregnant women or those breast feeding. Idem ditto U16s.

[ramAnag]

Some EU countries are starting their vaccination programmes today. Others will be starting in the next few days. For reasons unknown, we Dutch start on January 8th....... Doesn't affect me though, not yet anyway. Care home staff are first, care home residents 2nd, docs, nurses and other health care staff 3rd. Followed by over 80s, 70s, 60s and those with underlying health issues and healthy adults with Over 16s at the bottom of the list. Thus far there are no plans to vaccinate pregnant women or those breast feeding. Idem ditto U16s.

Cheers, MA. Always helpful to know what is happening elsewhere.

There are rumours, don’t know how well founded, that the new ‘variant’ is much more readily transmitted by children. If that is the case, and I know this will inspire yet more anti teacher poppycock from G (I was only joking) P, then surely vaccinating teachers is as important as health care staff.