O/T:- ⚠️Impressed with the leadership [The UK Party Politics Thread]

[Med Pie]

Yes. Peak cynicism and hypocrisy from Israel.

Hopefully on the flip side you will give credit for this government being strong if they don't join in. Pretty sure they will be under a lot of pressure to do so.

We know that won't happen, they will let the USAF use our base at Akrotiri whether we provide our own aircraft or not and that will be sufficient for the Iranians to call it 'support'.

I've said before, the SBA's (sovereign base areas) on Cyprus were negotiated for use by us as far as I'm aware and I don't think we twist the Yanks arms enough for continued use. The threat of tariffs was a prime example, 'ok Mr President, 50% tariffs it is, find yourself another airbase in the Middle East'.

I do wonder why they don't use Israel?

[MarcusCole]

Wouldn't it useful if the Americans had an Airbase somewhere in the Indian Ocean.

[Old_pie]

This is wandering slightly however, if our government supports an American attack on Iran, it shows how weak they are. They will be allowing the Americans to make a target of innocent people in the mediterannean region. Israel has already been allowed to murderously, flout international law and now this move is touted by some as 'illegal' too as would be Americas involvement if they attacked Iran. I can't help thinking that Iran's nuclear program is a convenient excuse and that regime change (supposedly illegal under international law) is the sole, intention.

Meanwhile, the outrageously, hypocritical Israelis say

We're now hearing from Israel's president, Isaac Herzog.

Speaking about the hospital in Beersheba hit by Iranian strikes, Herzog says: "A baby in intensive care. A mother by their bedside. A doctor rushing between beds. An elderly resident in a nursing home. These were some of the targets of Iran?s missile attacks on Israeli civilians this morning."

Anyone seen Gaza for the last three years and this after another fifty off civilians were killed by Israel the other day as they gathered at a food truck..also, an Iranian missile which caused damage to a hospital, was aimed at an IDF installation, purposefully positioned near a hospital, who else did Israel accuse of that!

I saw a thing on the internet, listing the various countries which the UK had invaded over it two thousand year history. It made me wonder, as a percentage of it's time in existence, which one of the UK / US has spent most time at war or been the main aggressor in attacking other nations? The US has attacked or invaded so many countries, including a British oversees territory (Grenada).

Apart from a short period of time after the war of independence, America has been in an almost perpetual, state of war with someone or other.

Has anyone got an explanation how Hamas built the tunnels under Gaza? I was astounded at their sophistication. This from last year: https://www.reuters.com/graphics/ISR...S/gkvldmzorvb/

Where did the money come from? How come with so many international aid bodies working in Palestine could they have been built? Seemingly under hospitals, schools and other civilian infrastructure. That's a lot of earth to move, a lot of equipment and infrastructure over decades. Since Hamas's raison d'etre is to destroy Israel how would you go about safeguarding yourself from them? I don't have an answer but they are clearly still there causing harm. All they have to do is declare peace, release the hostages and disband and the Israelis will have no choice but to stop and hopefully be pressured more so to quit creating new settlements.

[dovp]

Has anyone got an explanation how Hamas built the tunnels under Gaza? I was astounded at their sophistication. This from last year: https://www.reuters.com/graphics/ISR...S/gkvldmzorvb/

Where did the money come from? How come with so many international aid bodies working in Palestine could they have been built? Seemingly under hospitals, schools and other civilian infrastructure. That's a lot of earth to move, a lot of equipment and infrastructure over decades. Since Hamas's raison d'etre is to destroy Israel how would you go about safeguarding yourself from them? I don't have an answer but they are clearly still there causing harm. All they have to do is declare peace, release the hostages and disband and the Israelis will have no choice but to stop and hopefully be pressured more so to quit creating new settlements.

At last some common sense.

[irishpete]

At last some common sense.

Common sense doesn't exist in the real world. You can't do owt, cos if you do, u get labelled & shot down because your normal

[Med Pie]

Test

[Med Pie]

Has anyone got an explanation how Hamas built the tunnels under Gaza? I was astounded at their sophistication. This from last year: https://www.reuters.com/graphics/ISR...S/gkvldmzorvb/

Where did the money come from? How come with so many international aid bodies working in Palestine could they have been built? Seemingly under hospitals, schools and other civilian infrastructure. That's a lot of earth to move, a lot of equipment and infrastructure over decades. Since Hamas's raison d'etre is to destroy Israel how would you go about safeguarding yourself from them? I don't have an answer but they are clearly still there causing harm. All they have to do is declare peace, release the hostages and disband and the Israelis will have no choice but to stop and hopefully be pressured more so to quit creating new settlements.

Don't mean to be insulting but that is a very naive statement.

The HAMAS attack, aside from being an atrocity, was a massive error in judgement, it gave the Israelis the excuse they've waited twenty five years for. Israel has and will continue to, find every excuse to keep the aggression going until Gaza is empty of Arabs and occupied by Jews. Israel will also find any excuse to continue bombing Iran, WMD anybody?

An American politician recently suggested that Arab nations, collectively, give up land to create a Palestinian state. How about, instead, as Israel was pretty much an American construct, give up some American land in say, the 'bible belt' , that would end the middle East issue decisively and forever.

[Old_pie]

Don't mean to be insulting but that is a very naive statement.

The HAMAS attack, aside from being an atrocity, was a massive error in judgement, it gave the Israelis the excuse they've waited twenty five years for. Israel has and will continue to, find every excuse to keep the aggression going until Gaza is empty of Arabs and occupied by Jews. Israel will also find any excuse to continue bombing Iran, WMD anybody?

An American politician recently suggested that Arab nations, collectively, give up land to create a Palestinian state. How about, instead, as Israel was pretty much an American construct, give up some American land in say, the 'bible belt' , that would end the middle East issue decisively and forever.

You've skirted the question of how that infrastructure was put in place presumably under the noses of aid organisations. Iran, as opposed to the Persia that was once, is equally commited to the destruction of Israel. I can't speak for the benefits or otherwise of the creation of the state but the Jews seem to have done a lot more with the barren land than the Palestinians have. I don't understand the lack of pressure for the creation of a Palestinian state - perhaps this list of atrocities has made the powers that be cautious:

https://medium.com/@sigmaxavi/the-li...y-0ff1a8eb0ad0

Do you not think that Jews have a right to a peaceful homeland in the area that is there spiritual home even if you don't necessarily believe that it is their "god given right"?

[Med Pie]

You've skirted the question of how that infrastructure was put in place presumably under the noses of aid organisations. Iran, as opposed to the Persia that was once, is equally commited to the destruction of Israel. I can't speak for the benefits or otherwise of the creation of the state but the Jews seem to have done a lot more with the barren land than the Palestinians have. I don't understand the lack of pressure for the creation of a Palestinian state - perhaps this list of atrocities has made the powers that be cautious:

https://medium.com/@sigmaxavi/the-li...y-0ff1a8eb0ad0

Do you not think that Jews have a right to a peaceful homeland in the area that is there spiritual home even if you don't necessarily believe that it is their "god given right"?

I have no idea how the tunnels were built or funded or where all the soil went. the multiple Israeli observation posts missed it too it seems. Israel have done more with the land due to foreign investment and the influx of wealthy Jews from around the World whilst the Palestinians are still dirt poor.

Regarding a homeland for Jews, whilst Israel is located where it is, there will never be peace in the area. The Israelis are the aggressors in the main, committing atrocity after atrocity, just yesterday, settlers attacked Palestinians and three were killed as the World looks on and does nothing for the fear of being called antisemitic.

Israel has bullied the entire World, to the point that nobody dare criticise them and even if they do, Israel brushes it off as they know they have the Americans unconditional support.

What will happen in say a years time when Israel again tells us that Iran is on the verge of creating a bomb, will they attack again? Between them, the US and Israel seem to have redrawn international law where civilians are now cannon fodder, preemptive attacks on other states and targeted assassinations are ok and due to the protection from Trump, no war crimes will ever be prosecuted.

Trump is so corrupt, all he sees is reconstruction contracts for Yanks in Gaza, probably the same in Ukraine.

[Old_pie]

Between them, the US and Israel seem to have redrawn international law where civilians are now cannon fodder, preemptive attacks on other states and targeted assassinations are ok and due to the protection from Trump, no war crimes will ever be prosecuted.

Hamas seem to also be prepared to sacrifice as many as it takes to fight their unwinnable war.