O/T Frack me

[gm_gm]

You can own panels if you have capital and plan to stay long enough

You can but most people cant afford it, you would need insurance and maintenance contracts

[millmoormagic]

‘A bit cloudy’ and ‘a bit noisy’. I see that you are squeezing your eyes tightly shut, whilst sticking your fingers in your ears and going ‘la la la’ rather than facing up to the issues here.

You say the technology is there for us all to have batteries in our house, whereas I say it doesn’t… It seems to me that chasing around in circles on the issue is a bit pointless, so, for the sake of argument, let’s accept that you are right. That surely immediately raises three questions, doesn’t it?

1. If the technology for home battery storage exists, why isn’t it being installed across the country as we speak?

2. Guessing for a moment that you will have some corporate conspiracy theory to explain question 1 away, why have neither the Green Party nor the Labour Party in its recent environmental pronouncement proposed your battery in the home solution?

3. Assuming that you answer to question 3 is that the politicians lack your insight into the issue, why have you not set up a business - you could call it the Millmoor Magic Battery Company (that works on more than one level) to carry out installation of the technology you say exists? You could be first into the market and make your millions (but don’t take your company public and allow it to employ more than 249 people or you would risk a future Labour government seizing 10% of it).

Nobody is proposing a future use for coal for electricity generation. It’s dirty and clunky. But even the Green Party - who are rather more committed to renewables than any other party - accept that they would have to retain the capacity to use gas for electricity generation on days when renewables don’t cut it, which takes us back to the OP.

You couldn't be more condescending if you tried, but heyho, can't really do owt about rude folk can yer...

Anyway, you know the battery technology that you say isn't there, re-read my post, why not use the battery in the electric car as a power source??? Or can't you get your head around that idea??

No conspiracy theory from me, to be honest with your reply I'm chuckling because you really don't like being proved wrong do you, straight on the offensive with smart arris replies, I get under your skin don't i, and I love that to be honest.

Tell you what, why don't you form a company for highbrowed condes ending media posts, you're brilliant at it.

Nobody is proposing using coal, hmmmm, I didn't propose charging batteries at night using solar power bit that didn't stop your smart comment back did it??

You really do need to accept that sometimes you're wrong fella.

[millmoormagic]

Anyone seen the news today, 12 years to make an impact to stop global warming, keep believing the bull**** about fossil fuels, fracking is not the answer, you're just feeding the greed for cheap energy without a thought for the local, and national, and international environment..

We really do need to accept that we need the alternative right now.

[great_fire]

Is that like "3 months to save the NHS"?

You don't believe that nonsense surely?

Just Soros and his band of globalists trying to control us.

[John2]

You say the technology is there for us all to have batteries in our house, whereas I say it doesn’t… It seems to me that chasing around in circles on the issue is a bit pointless, so, for the sake of argument, let’s accept that you are right. That surely immediately raises three questions, doesn’t it?

1. If the technology for home battery storage exists, why isn’t it being installed across the country as we speak?

I agree about the current limitations of renewables and the need for non renewable supplemental supply, I'm yet to even be convinced fracking is that bad, but I think the technological breakthroughs are a lot closer than you realise.

I converted a campervan and put 530w of solar panels on the roof and bought 2x130ah AGM leisure batteries (about 2.5kw usable capacity) and a 2.5kw inverter to give me mains voltage. I'm so impressed by solar technology. I've got so much solar in the summer that I can run an air conditioner unit and power tools, but even living in it while skiing in the winter I never got the batteries below 80% - I was so impressed by what they were generating, that was running a diesel heater with electric fan and glow plugs a lot, lights, laptop, fridge, speakers, etc. For next winter skiing I've added a microwave grill and electric water heater for showers and will be taking a PS4, screen and sound system such is my confidence in the solar.

Solar has become so cheap these days, my 265w panels were less than £100 each.

The average household uses 3940kw per year, 1kw of panel will yield 700 to 900kw per year. That means an average home needs 4.37kw to 5.63kw worth of panels to be self sufficient if storage wasn't an issue.

Bimble solar right now are selling 250w panels for £85 each, that means you can get 5.75kw of panels for £1,955, the main cost beyond that is probably 2 or 3 days of labour for fitting if you have the space.

The rate at which the cost of solar panels has fallen is staggering, but what it means is that the biggest barrier to generating solar for a household isn't what they cost, it's how much space they take. Enough surplus of panels and you can power an entire household even on the bleakest days of winter and just have an incredible excess the rest of the time (handy for things like air conditioning). Solar farms are the answer where there isn't enough space on someone's roof.

Battery technology is on the cusp of becoming viable to complement the solar panels. Tesla have invested in building one of the biggest buildings in the world, bringing economies of scale to battery technology, with good reason to think a new generation of home battery technologies is just around the corner.

Batteries aren't the only way of storing that energy, with enough solar you could also heat a household or water tank during the day when the sun is shining and have them switch off when the grid isn't generating that surplus.

That said, right now you can buy a Tesla Powerwall which has a 13.5kw capacity. It's £6,000 but that should come down a lot.
https://www.tesla.com/en_GB/powerwall

The solar in my van has given me such a taste of the future, because it made me realise the answer is just having lots and lots of low cost solar panels, they last for decades with such little maintenance too.

Once you have that surplus, you just need households to have enough battery power to be topped up during the day time, and keep going to the next day with just a little cushion.

We already have the technology to do that, less than £1,000 worth of the batteries I use in my van would suffice as long as the household wasn't using electricity for any sort of heating.

I can honestly say if I was building a house right now or lived in a suitable property I'd have the roof covered with solar, maybe some in the garden, and I'd have a bank of leisure batteries and I'd run the electrics entirely off grid with a mains switch for if ever it was needed as a backup.

I'm really optimistic we're heading to an exciting future of surplus electricity from various renewable resources, but my position isn't an environmental one, its a purely economic one. I quite like nuclear, but I'm starting to think building a new one now will be obsolete by the time it's finished.

[millmoormagic]

Is that like "3 months to save the NHS"?

You don't believe that nonsense surely?

Just Soros and his band of globalists trying to control us.

Keep the blinkers on, as ever, always wanting to turn things into a political mash up, plainly many experts and scientists who are much more qualified than you or me believe this as fact.

[rolymiller]

Only one person lives on planet greatfire so there is no problem for him. The problem that a lot of people don't realise is that there is a tipping point at which there is no return for human beings to sort the problem out. At a certain earth temperature there is no way back. I can't remember what this is but it is only a matter of a few degrees c away from what it is now. What happens at the tipping point is that temps start to sp iral out of control in a short space of time meaning nothing can be do ne to reverse them. Scientists thunk this happened onvenus where temps are far t oo got for life and gases don't support life. Some scientists like lovelock think it is already too late which is pretty scary

It's ok for the likes of crashbang to say I don't care about the future and gfir e to say it's all a con. Some of us have family and grand kids who are gonna have to try their best to sort this messout. It dunt look as though it will be pretty even if they can.

As usual one of remain reasons whynowt is seriouslybeen d one is because money talks for the wealthy. Gfires pal Mr trump, the US being the biggest contributor to greenhouse gases, won't even attend summits on the problem now.

[rolymiller]

Soz about the typos on the last post by the way, it's our lasses tablet i used with its daft predictive text!

[great_fire]

So you just read a newspaper and take it all as absolute fact?

That's not very smart is it?

[millmoormagic]

So you just read a newspaper and take it all as absolute fact?

That's not very smart is it?

Once again a whoosh moment from the right wing nutjobs, plainly a report from scientists from the UN is gunna get publicity in newspapers, what medium the report is published in makes no difference to the actual report, does it?? Gf, still thinks the world is flat.....it's pathetic and I'm constantly shaking my head at these folk who quite happily ignore the truth when it doesn't suit their politics.