A New Political Force?

[WBA123]

As I like I said in a earlier post remainers who do not except a democratic vote stinks of desperation,by god who really are desperate.and to say to someone your ignorant,you sound like your up your own apologies might be in order.but dought it very much.ivoted out I’m neither ignorant or thick,not the cleverest of people but I knew what I was voting for as did you.

So all 17m people voted for a no deal Brexit then....right, of course they did.

The referendum was flawed. There is no mandate in parliament for any type of Brexit plan.

We need another vote.

[WBA123]

What I find strange is that no-one- the media , the political elite looks at the current realities of Europe

Here's a few- Italian banks on the verge of collapse, French & Italian budgets which break the rules, rise of right wing parties in France Germany& Hungary. 25% youth unemployment in Spain, printing of Euros in their trillions, Greece impoverished. Germany with a new order post-Merkel. Immigration crisis leading to walls in Hungary NIGHTLY riots in the suburbs of Paris.
Whatever you think of Brexit the EU is in a bad way.

Personally I don't think May & Co were ever serious about a positive new deal- the negotiations have been pathetic.

Put that aside .... I think staying in the EU is like ROWING TOWARDS THE TITANIC!!!!

Ah yes, but in the UK its going swimmingly.

Only 3500 job losses this week for Honda. Alongside 4500 for JLR. Along with Nissan pulling out of making the X-Trail. Along with Sony and Panosonic leaving their head office for Europe. Along with the EMA moving to Amsterdam. At least Dyson is fully supporting Brexit though eh... by moving to Singapore. Airbus about to move. Thousands of jobs lost, thousands more under threat.

But on the positive we get blue passports. Brilliant.

[WBA123]

So true Boingy.
The question that should’ve been put to the people around 1990 was.....”Are you willing to be a part of a federal state ( losing individual sovereignty ) and being ruled by a non elected elite?

We have been stitched up by career politicians of both sides signing up to treaties that had no withdrawal terms written into them.

Interesting. What was article 50 then?

'Ruled by non-elected elite'...you need to lay off the RW press pal. Do you elect judges? Do you think you are you going to elect WTO members when we leave without a deal....?

You are more intelligent than this.

[WBA123]

Its such a shame that so many people on here and generally in life are willing to impoverish themselves and the future of their children and grandchildren.

All I will say is, read impartial news sources. Forget the sound bytes and slogans, there is no substance to them - they mean nothing.

Look at the business, jobs and taxation revenue that is streaming out of our country, and we haven't even left yet.

Hold to account the politicians who have lied to you.

This was meant to be the 'easiest deal'. We were told Single Market membership wouldn't be affected. We were told we could have our cake and eat it. We were told leaving would make us better off. We were told the NHS would have more money. Hold these people to account.

We will be poorer for this decision for generations, without any tangible benefits.

OPEN YOUR EYES.

[boingy]

Its such a shame that so many people on here and generally in life are willing to impoverish themselves and the future of their children and grandchildren.


All I will say is, read impartial news sources. Forget the sound bytes and slogans, there is no substance to them - they mean nothing.

Look at the business, jobs and taxation revenue that is streaming out of our country, and we haven't even left yet.

Hold to account the politicians who have lied to you.

This was meant to be the 'easiest deal'. We were told Single Market membership wouldn't be affected. We were told we could have our cake and eat it. We were told leaving would make us better off. We were told the NHS would have more money. Hold these people to account.

We will be poorer for this decision for generations, without any tangible benefits.

OPEN YOUR EYES.

Wow, you've been really took in with all the anti Brexit rhetoric. Eyes were wide open years ago. Trade yes. Total control NO! How would you like me to tell you that you can only do whats best for your family IF 27 other countries agree? No one in the EU is happy with it because its wrong. We NEVER had a referendum on surrendering powers to an unelectable elite in Brussels. No one including you would have agreed to it. If you did then I will say the same to you. You are much more intelligent than this. We want the best for our kids too by the way and surrendering to a federal block giving them no choices is one of the reasons for leaving.

[WBA123]

Wow, you've been really took in with all the anti Brexit rhetoric. Eyes were wide open years ago. Trade yes. Total control NO! How would you like me to tell you that you can only do whats best for your family IF 27 other countries agree? No one in the EU is happy with it because its wrong. We NEVER had a referendum on surrendering powers to an unelectable elite in Brussels. No one including you would have agreed to it. If you did then I will say the same to you. You are much more intelligent than this. We want the best for our kids too by the way and surrendering to a federal block giving them no choices is one of the reasons for leaving.

'Federal'
'Elite'
'Surrendering'
'Unelectable'

Your rhetoric is just full of the words that have been used to manipulate you into your thought process.

We don't elect the head of the civil service, or judges, or UK trade negotiators. We don't elect who is head of the police or security services. Are they unelected bureaucrats? Its impossible to elect every position. These positions are appointed, trade negotiators who you've been told are 'unelected'...are appointed.

All we're doing is losing our influence in the largest trading bloc in the world.

Its the equivalent to the West Midlands fencing themselves off from the UK and saying that we want to 'take back control' from Westminster. Its small minded and unbelievably economically damaging.

[albion68]

Ah yes, but in the UK its going swimmingly.

Only 3500 job losses this week for Honda. Alongside 4500 for JLR. Along with Nissan pulling out of making the X-Trail. Along with Sony and Panosonic leaving their head office for Europe. Along with the EMA moving to Amsterdam. At least Dyson is fully supporting Brexit though eh... by moving to Singapore. Airbus about to move. Thousands of jobs lost, thousands more under threat.

But on the positive we get blue passports. Brilliant.

airbus have been threatening to leave the uk,for the last 10 years.honda are on a downward spiral because they failed on the up take on electric cars and have been left behind.jlr a renowned for hireing and fireing eggs in one basket the Chinese market.dyson in Singapore that’s were his biggest market is,xtrail wont be made anywhere can’t compete with the Korean made Kia models,I see you fail to mention the new trade deal between the EU and the Japanese government on the new tariffs or should that read no tariffs which will effect all the EU countries.as for Sony and panosonic moving do they actually manufacture anything in the uk.as for passports who gives two f#ucks what colour they are.

[stripes39]

Ah yes, but in the UK its going swimmingly.

Only 3500 job losses this week for Honda. Alongside 4500 for JLR. Along with Nissan pulling out of making the X-Trail. Along with Sony and Panosonic leaving their head office for Europe. Along with the EMA moving to Amsterdam. At least Dyson is fully supporting Brexit though eh... by moving to Singapore. Airbus about to move. Thousands of jobs lost, thousands more under threat.

But on the positive we get blue passports. Brilliant.

As a country, we aren’t quite the basket case you would imply and neither are several of our EU neighbors shining examples of economic excellence either. Despite several of the examples you give being entirely down to Brexit, how about a little bit of balance?

UK employment is at a record high of 32.6million. Falling unemployment, at four per cent, is the lowest since 1975. Wages up 3.4 per cent, their fastest since 2008 with inflation down to 1.8 per cent so despite all of this uncertainty over the mess aka Brexit (which there is) we are in a better place than many of our neighbors if you care to examine their respective records.

I recently spent a period at Dyson HQ on an assignment where this was a hot topic. At no point was Brexit ever considered a factor in jobs being lost at the HQ. The move to Singapore is primarily due to an increasing majority of Dyson’s customer base and the manufacturing operations that support this now being in Asia. This has been on the cards pre-Brexit. It’s all about cost of manufacture and the logistics to ship stock out from the UK. Why would you not manufacture in the region half way across the globe where you are seeing your highest growth in revenues?

Oh, and you also neglected to mention that Dyson moving forwards will still employ double the number of staff that it did 4 years ago and that they are well in to a £200 Million investment program to support the R&D and testing facility in Wiltshire. I wouldn’t say that was a company pulling out would you?

Regarding the Japanese car industry, Honda itself does not blame Brexit as a factor. They acknowledge that the plant has struggled for a long time and that the car industry is going through unprecedented times. Sales of diesel cars are not only in free-fall in the UK, where demand fell by almost 30%, but also on mainland Europe. The only plant in the EU outside of Japan where they manufacture is Swindon. They are not switching to another EU location due to Brexit. You neglected to mention that they are also closing a large plant in Turkey and I don’t believe Turkey are involved in Brexit.

The facts, though, are that Japan no longer needs to make cars in Europe because the EU trade deal it has finally signed will cut its export tariffs to zero meaning its cheaper to manufacture in Japan than in the EU - even more so now the Japanese government is offering large incentives to manufacturers to relocate manufacturing.

Nissan is a company in crisis which has just had its chairman arrested and is under investigation so lots going on there. The X-Trail is diesel powered and it has been suggested that Nissan was struggling to ensure the engines with which the new vehicle was to have been powered complied with the EU's new emissions regulations. It has also been suggested that, with diesel falling in demand, it would have been prohibitively expensive for Nissan to ship petrol engines from Japan to fuel the new line.

It simply means that the estimated 700 or so jobs that would have been created as a result of production of the X-Trail will now not be. It does not mean any of the existing 7,000 or so workers at Sunderland will lose their jobs. The company has no plans to remove production of the zero-emission Leaf, the world's best-selling electric vehicle either.

I’m not pretending that the uncertainty and dithering by useless politicians over Brexit hasn’t caused the jitters in many quarters and caused several businesses to up sticks because it has. It’s far from ideal but I just wish remainer's like yourself would retain a degree of balance. In between sneering at fellow posters for reading in to what you cite as biased reporting of facts, you might well add a bit more balance to your own arguments rather than seeking to blame everything on Brexit when it is clearly not the case.

[WBA123]

airbus have been threatening to leave the uk,for the last 10 years.honda are on a downward spiral because they failed on the up take on electric cars and have been left behind.jlr a renowned for hireing and fireing eggs in one basket the Chinese market.dyson in Singapore that’s were his biggest market is,xtrail wont be made anywhere can’t compete with the Korean made Kia models,I see you fail to mention the new trade deal between the EU and the Japanese government on the new tariffs or should that read no tariffs which will effect all the EU countries.as for Sony and panosonic moving do they actually manufacture anything in the uk.as for passports who gives two f#ucks what colour they are.

Yes, Brexit obviously has not contributed at all to this then.

Your head is well and firmly buried in the sand.

[9goals2hattricks3pen]

Haven't we just annouced record employment for us Brits and wage rises ahead of inflation for the first time since 2008 despite the looming 'threat' of Brexit?

The main reason given was the number of EU workers leaving.Something else we can pin on Brexit? If as the 5th biggest economy in the World we can't make a go of it then we may as well all leave anyway?