Richard Montague

[ncfcog]

Think people need to stop focusing on the Radar data and model. It?s not the dark art any more that people might believe it to be.

There is plenty of data available in the game now that is accessible to anyone and it?s not hard to use simple formulas to highlight players with particular traits. Once you have those metrics you then watch them, a lot, like a traditional scout would and if the eye test matches the data ? bingo!

That said, some people have a better eye for a player than others and the same remains for analysing the data, maybe that could be RM?s strength?

[OP67]

Sorry if this has already been linked
https://www.fansnetwork.co.uk/footba...s-us-%E2%80%A6
An expanded version of the early posts

I doubt Williams will be at Swansea come March when Montague is suppose to be joining them I hope Montague is used to working with no money.

[jackal2]

Think people need to stop focusing on the Radar data and model. It?s not the dark art any more that people might believe it to be.

There is plenty of data available in the game now that is accessible to anyone and it?s not hard to use simple formulas to highlight players with particular traits. Once you have those metrics you then watch them, a lot, like a traditional scout would and if the eye test matches the data ? bingo!

That said, some people have a better eye for a player than others and the same remains for analysing the data, maybe that could be RM?s strength?

Difficult to say from outside the club where the balance lies between Richard Montague's own skills and the knowledge that exists within the wider Football Radar operation. What I do know is that our recruitment over the past four years has been vastly superior to just about any time in the 30+ years I've been watching Notts, aside maybe from the Munto 'moment' when cash was seemingly no object and we were bringing in virtually guaranteed hits like Schmeichel and Hughes.

It's striking that a company of data analysts (boffins if you like) have comprehensively outperformed a whole host of experienced 'football people', and it suggests that aside from the very occasional Peter Taylor type, most of the so-called trained eyes and scouts are just chancers going on gut feelings, or bringing in mates and players they've known from before, or relying on particular agents and contacts whose primary motive might not necessarily be to find you the best player. Football's a very ruthless business where most people are opportunists out for themselves.

We'll only know how much we've relied on Richard Montague if he goes, but there seems to be a bit of a pattern emerging, both with players and staff, that individuals who appear to shine brightly within our structure look noticeably less confident and assured and perform less well when they leave that structure and try to recreate the magic elsewhere.

Looking at that press conference from Luke Williams, he looks a shell of the Head Coach/Manager he was for us. Yes he was always one to go into great detail with his explanations, but with us he seemed assured and very protective of team of his team off and on the field, whereas here he seems to be rambling incoherently at times, and it never comes over well when a senior figure is washing dirty linen in public and hanging unnamed individuals out to dry. Even if his criticisms are correct, these are things you keep in house. It just sounds like someone trying too hard to stay onside with fans and deflect blame.

I must say, if I was Richard Montague I'd see the red flags from a mile off and stay within the structure and model that has allowed me to be successful to date. The grass ain't always greener, even if it's in soggy Wales.

[matt_magpie]

Difficult to say from outside the club where the balance lies between Richard Montague's own skills and the knowledge that exists within the wider Football Radar operation. What I do know is that our recruitment over the past four years has been vastly superior to just about any time in the 30+ years I've been watching Notts, aside maybe from the Munto 'moment' when cash was seemingly no object and we were bringing in virtually guaranteed hits like Schmeichel and Hughes.

It's striking that a company of data analysts (boffins if you like) have comprehensively outperformed a whole host of experienced 'football people', and it suggests that aside from the very occasional Peter Taylor type, most of the so-called trained eyes and scouts are just chancers going on gut feelings, or bringing in mates and players they've known from before, or relying on particular agents and contacts whose primary motive might not necessarily be to find you the best player. Football's a very ruthless business where most people are opportunists out for themselves.

We'll only know how much we've relied on Richard Montague if he goes, but there seems to be a bit of a pattern emerging, both with players and staff, that individuals who appear to shine brightly within our structure look noticeably less confident and assured and perform less well when they leave that structure and try to recreate the magic elsewhere.

Looking at that press conference from Luke Williams, he looks a shell of the Head Coach/Manager he was for us. Yes he was always one to go into great detail with his explanations, but with us he seemed assured and very protective of team of his team off and on the field, whereas here he seems to be rambling incoherently at times, and it never comes over well when a senior figure is washing dirty linen in public and hanging unnamed individuals out to dry. Even if his criticisms are correct, these are things you keep in house. It just sounds like someone trying too hard to stay onside with fans and deflect blame.

I must say, if I was Richard Montague I'd see the red flags from a mile off and stay within the structure and model that has allowed me to be successful to date. The grass ain't always greener, even if it's in soggy Wales.

I think Wooton and Ruben have done pretty well on the whole and Roberts just got crocked yet again.
Maccas gone a level too high and with the wrong club, IB went to a club that was always going to struggle so they were always risky moves.
As for LW, it?s the pressure of top level management, he?s had good periods there but decided to flirt with WBA and that?s effectively finished him.

[jackal2]

I think Wooton and Ruben have done pretty well on the whole and Roberts just got crocked yet again.
Maccas gone a level too high and with the wrong club, IB went to a club that was always going to struggle so they were always risky moves.
As for LW, it?s the pressure of top level management, he?s had good periods there but decided to flirt with WBA and that?s effectively finished him.

Wootton and Ruben of course moved into clubs on the up and stable structures that were already succeeding for a while like ours, so they perhaps chose well. Swansea doesn't look like a structure that's succeeding. In fact if RM went, he might find the most familiar faces to him are not around long at this rate.

It's easy to forget, but I'm reminded of times not so many years ago when we at Notts County thought that brining in people who had been successful elsewhere would lift us up, but generally it dragged those people down. The moral of the story is that there are no short-cuts to building the right foundations, and those foundations are about a good team of people working together for a long time, not individual 'stars' arriving and transforming things overnight.

[bule1]

Money will always talk but is not everything, question is "IF" RM left do they have a replacement "in house" or do we have to fish for one

[matt_magpie]

Wootton and Ruben of course moved into clubs on the up and stable structures that were already succeeding for a while like ours, so they perhaps chose well. Swansea doesn't look like a structure that's succeeding. In fact if RM went, he might find the most familiar faces to him are not around long at this rate.

It's easy to forget, but I'm reminded of times not so many years ago when we at Notts County thought that brining in people who had been successful elsewhere would lift us up, but generally it dragged those people down. The moral of the story is that there are no short-cuts to building the right foundations, and those foundations are about a good team of people working together for a long time, not individual 'stars' arriving and transforming things overnight.

I agree, our owners seem to be getting everything right on the whole, they?re almost making it look easy at times compared to some of their seasoned counterparts.
There?s too many egos in football ownership and too much emotion in football fans which is totally understandable for the latter.
Using SM for example he?d be long gone by now at most clubs due to some fans pressure and owners not being brave enough.
It seems so simple really, create a football identity, recruit players yourself for that identity and bring in a guy you believe can coach them or vice versa keep hiring managers with different styles, let them bring in their own players every time and rinse and repeat yearly at a huge cost.

[the_anticlough]

I doubt Williams will be at Swansea come March when Montague is suppose to be joining them I hope Montague is used to working with no money.

4 straight losses, 1pt from the last 18, next up Bristol City (A), Sheff Weds (H) Stoke (A)

[queenslandpie]

4 straight losses, 1pt from the last 18, next up Bristol City (A), Sheff Weds (H) Stoke (A)

from what I read on social media just now most Swansea fans are pointing the finger at lack of investment in players and selling off the better ones not Williams. Williams is simply asking Swansea to do things the way Notts seem to be when it comes to planning player departures, i.e. some are inevitable as they will be able to get an improved salary etc. unavailable at their club, the club can make a good profit but a good proportion needs to be invested in the infrastructure of the playing squad rather than simply asking the manager to get a silk purse out of a sows ear and sacking him if he can't achieve it. Which is basically what has happened at Swansea for some time. We are so fortunate to have the structure at Notts which we have now and I think there will definitely be a a bit of schadenfreude for Notts fans when they see Williams situation now.

[1955pie]

Difficult to say from outside the club where the balance lies between Richard Montague's own skills and the knowledge that exists within the wider Football Radar operation. What I do know is that our recruitment over the past four years has been vastly superior to just about any time in the 30+ years I've been watching Notts, aside maybe from the Munto 'moment' when cash was seemingly no object and we were bringing in virtually guaranteed hits like Schmeichel and Hughes.

It's striking that a company of data analysts (boffins if you like) have comprehensively outperformed a whole host of experienced 'football people', and it suggests that aside from the very occasional Peter Taylor type, most of the so-called trained eyes and scouts are just chancers going on gut feelings, or bringing in mates and players they've known from before, or relying on particular agents and contacts whose primary motive might not necessarily be to find you the best player. Football's a very ruthless business where most people are opportunists out for themselves.

We'll only know how much we've relied on Richard Montague if he goes, but there seems to be a bit of a pattern emerging, both with players and staff, that individuals who appear to shine brightly within our structure look noticeably less confident and assured and perform less well when they leave that structure and try to recreate the magic elsewhere.

Looking at that press conference from Luke Williams, he looks a shell of the Head Coach/Manager he was for us. Yes he was always one to go into great detail with his explanations, but with us he seemed assured and very protective of team of his team off and on the field, whereas here he seems to be rambling incoherently at times, and it never comes over well when a senior figure is washing dirty linen in public and hanging unnamed individuals out to dry. Even if his criticisms are correct, these are things you keep in house. It just sounds like someone trying too hard to stay onside with fans and deflect blame.

I must say, if I was Richard Montague I'd see the red flags from a mile off and stay within the structure and model that has allowed me to be successful to date. The grass ain't always greener, even if it's in soggy Wales.

What a brilliant and very insightful post Jackal.
Your line of ? and it never comes over well when a senior figure is washing dirty linen in public and hanging unnamed individuals out to dry. ? is so cutting and true.
If that performance doesn?t put RM off from joining Swansea then nothing will. LW seemed like a different person to the one I thought we had as a manager.
Mind you that ?fishing trip? by their fans group was probably was probably just that. A clever but ham-fisted attempt to put ?flesh on the bones?.
Does anybody know how that press conference went down with the Swansea fans?