League 1 it is then

[Geoff Parkstone]

Don't understand, or just seethe with indignant jealousy? The more you go on about it, the more it sounds like the latter. That green eyed look does you no favours!

[ramAnag]

Don't understand, or just seethe with indignant jealousy? The more you go on about it, the more it sounds like the latter. That green eyed look does you no favours!

I’m not really ‘going on about it’, and I’m certainly not jealous. We all make our choices and I understand that...but as you and Andy seem to have adopted the roles of the ‘accountancy twins’ I’m just asking for some justification of the fees charged by accountants if Quantuma’s £350 per hour is in any way indicative. That’s all.

[Andy_Faber]

I’m not really ‘going on about it’, and I’m certainly not jealous. We all make our choices and I understand that...but as you and Andy seem to have adopted the roles of the ‘accountancy twins’ I’m just asking for some justification of the fees charged by accountants if Quantuma’s £350 per hour is in any way indicative. That’s all.

Because that's what the market will stand, pure and simple. If these fellahs are seen (by those who are in the market, not we mere plebs) to have done a bad job, their market value may well fall. Capitalism in action.

Edit: I was going to make some of the same points as GP but I'm watching the snooker so CBA. However, not only was my number 2 the same as GP's number 2 by was going to use the same 'player' in my narrative...

[DCFCArmy]

As for the administrators scum of the ****ing earth

It should be the fans who get to sort this out not some money grabbing pieces of dung sh*t in a suit

[MadAmster]

It should be the fans who get to sort this out not some money grabbing pieces of dung sh*t in a suit

What? To use the vernacular..... give yer head a wobble!!

To pay off the football debts fully and also 35% of the non-football debts is going to cost Kirchner around £45M. That avoids a 15 point penalty.

Please explain where you think the fans are going to get £45M from.

On top of that there's the £20M MM wants for the stadium so he can clear the loan on that. A further £3.5M Admin has had from MSD to keep the club afloat also needs paying back. Then there's whatever buying Moor Farm back would cost to be found as well.

Then there's going to be possible extra costs to cover any losses over the next 2 years.

At the end of all that there will still be something like £20M creditors just aren't going to get back. We currently owe HMRC £36M. Will they accept 35% (£12.6m)?

I await, with baited breath, your detailed explanation of how the fans can "sort this out"

[Geoff Parkstone]

I'm going to have to bore you with repetition then.

1. It's a rate set by the market. If customers weren't happy, then the price would fall. If beer was £50 a pint, you wouldn't buy it, if it was £3 you would.
2. In the context of football it's cheap. As noted above, at its extreme of £4m it will cost less than the transfer fee for Buttercup (let alone his wages)
3. If it saves the football club from a date with the grim reaper, do you care about the cost? You're not paying it. You have spoken at length about the massive community value of the club - are you now saying it's not worth saving because a few blokes get paid a lot to do it? How is that different to player wages....equally disproportionate to the wage of the core supporter.
4. Compare it to the quantum of money spunked away to get the Rams in this mess...a couple of percentage points.
5. I could go on, but I doubt it will do any good. Your sense of fair days pay for a fair job seems to have been put out of joint. I doubt I can fix that for you.
6. Basically can someone justify the rate - let me answer a question with a question: does anyone need to?

[DCFCArmy]

Tricky

I don’t care all I wanted was Morris gone and he’s gone

As for your lot (granted you’ve come on here when we were chasing promotion) they only surfaced once we were in the doo doo

Can’t get ****ing shot of them now but they’ll soon disappear if and when it turns around the other way

Tw@ts

[ramAnag]

With respect...neither of you have actually answered, or even attempted to answer, the question of how do you justify such wages/fees.
Essentially you’re both saying...because that’s how it is...and because, as accountants, it suits you both to maintain the status quo you seem happy for that to be the case.

You’re right, GP...I do broadly believe in a ‘fair days pay for a fair job’, but I’ve no idea how you ultimately define it.

Maybe I’m naive but I was genuinely shocked at your quoting of Quantuma’s £350 per hour charges and it seems to have opened something of a ‘can of worms’.
You accept that Q’s (imo exorbitant) charges have actually made the situation worse at DCFC and yet there seems to me little evidence of any great progress being made over the last eight incredibly expensive months.

Maybe what I’m saying then is that...along with the likes of lawyers and estate agents...accountants have created a system - a mystique even - which allows them to be considered as far more important than they actually are.
Perhaps also, over the last two years of crisis, we may have been given a different perspective in terms of which jobs are most crucial and again, with respect, it is the hospital workers, health and care workers, shop workers, teachers, refuse collectors, delivery drivers etc who have kept society functioning during the pandemic. No mention there of accountants.

Even in more normal times, should they ever return, it will be the same group of workers together with those in manufacturing and those who maintain the country’s infrastructure who, I’d suggest, will be the most crucial so I ask again...what is it that makes accountants so special and so, apparently, well rewarded?

[Ramshank72]

I can't tell if this thread is about Derby's next season in League One, DCFCArmy's conversation with himself and anyone who gets hooked into it, or the theory of economics and capitalism.
DCFCArmy: If you're going to write a rant, at least please keep it to a single post rather than several, that way it's only 1 ignored post that some of us need to scroll past.
ramAnag: If you're going to keep asking questions about economics when you don't want to accept or try to understand the answers, please consider making a relevant thread rather than plastering over a football matter.

[ramAnag]

I can't tell if this thread is about Derby's next season in League One, DCFCArmy's conversation with himself and anyone who gets hooked into it, or the theory of economics and capitalism.
DCFCArmy: If you're going to write a rant, at least please keep it to a single post rather than several, that way it's only 1 ignored post that some of us need to scroll past.
ramAnag: If you're going to keep asking questions about economics when you don't want to accept or try to understand the answers, please consider making a relevant thread rather than plastering over a football matter.

Hang on a moment, Ramshank. My comments have stemmed entirely from GP’s revelation (to me at least) that Quantuma are - and apparently have been for the last eight months - charging £350 per hour. Yes, I’ve broadened the topic to question why those involved in such ‘professions’ are allowed/encouraged to charge such rates but my comments are very relevant to the mess that DCFC currently find themselves in and I was ‘talking’ to two accountants...hence the emphasis on accountancy practices. Given the circumstances I suggest you wind your neck in on this occasion.

GP...if you look back over our exchange I have been unfailingly polite.
As ever when you feel threatened you resort to rudeness, evasion and exaggeration, however I don’t feel I’ve been ‘demeaning’, I don’t ‘clearly despise’ professionals, teachers actually get 13 weeks ‘holiday’ a year (not 20) and I have no idea how my life takes the form of ‘castles in the air’. Perhaps you’d like to explain...but then that doesn’t seem to have been your strong point during this exchange.