OT. The futures Bright, the Futures Brexit!!!

[swaledale]

I despair.. I really do.. Maybe sometime in the future you will come back to this thread and review it, hold your head in your hands, redden a little and then kick the cat. I dunno wtf you are on about anymore.
I feel I have been consistent in my views on the exit vote. I don't believe I have contractdicted myself but I will let others judge, is this just another Swaley read what you want to read bollx. In fact I hope someone does if I have been all over the place. If I have, I will happily post an apology. Yourself, Anag and now (to an extent) Baalocks are pretty much In aminority of 3ish. My frustration is that two of you just don't seem to read what we post.... The wall is up and it ain't coming down. Perhaps this thread is coming to an end and had run its course.. I have no more to add really, I cannot keep saying the same ****ing thing over and over again.

So you cannot simply list the factual benefits of Leaving the EU/

Enough said i think!

[swaledale]

So Swale, in amongst your pro EU facts I find the following:

"stronger economy, cheaper cost of living higher tax take"

I am unsure that you know what a fact is, but all of those 3 are your opinion. Unprovable.

Also since when has higher tax take been an advantage?? Personally I like lower tax.

As for access to EU healthcare this is very much a double edged sword - we surrender access to our overstretched and underfunded NHS to health tourism as quid pro quo.

I now anticipate another mile long ramble rehashing the same old same old that has sustained this thread's evolution toward 1000 ����

You like LOWER TAX take?? Really? How the **** do you think essential services and infrastructure in the Uk can be funded?

European immigrants who arrived in the UK since 2000 have contributed more than £20bn to UK public finances between 2001 and 2011. Moreover, they have endowed the country with productive human capital that would have cost the UK £6.8bn in spending on education. - no they are not my opinion they are factually proven!

Was that short enough for you?

[AngryRam]

So you cannot simply list the factual benefits of Leaving the EU/

Enough said i think!

I do think you have said enough, you aint said much but you have said enough. Always look forward to your football related posts but my god what have you done here on this thread? Gobsmacked, really i am totally gobsmacked.
With that post alone you have taken us back to page 4.. I know you will say it has not been answered but really fella it has and in spades.

[roger_ramjet]

You like LOWER TAX take?? Really? How the **** do you think essential services and infrastructure in the Uk can be funded?

European immigrants who arrived in the UK since 2000 have contributed more than £20bn to UK public finances between 2001 and 2011. Moreover, they have endowed the country with productive human capital that would have cost the UK £6.8bn in spending on education. - no they are not my opinion they are factually proven!

Was that short enough for you?

Im not a fan of centralised government spending preferring to leave the money in the hands of the wage earner to spend at his or her discretion. Im a "rugged individualist" I believe the technical term is.

As for your latter comments they do not prove a stronger economy or a cheaper cost of living. They are some random numbers associated with the use of a migrant work force which I guess came from EU but could have been independently sourced from anywhere. Its akin to arguing that the Job Centre has made our economy strong: it hasnt, it has supplied a resource, thats all.

As Angry said, stick to football xxx

[roger_ramjet]

You dont have to be in the EU to source migrant labour. Indeed its best not to be as you can control it and utilise it on your OWN terms if you are not in the club and there are no automatic rights to work in UK.

[swaledale]

I do think you have said enough, you aint said much but you have said enough. Always look forward to your football related posts but my god what have you done here on this thread? Gobsmacked, really i am totally gobsmacked.
With that post alone you have taken us back to page 4.. I know you will say it has not been answered but really fella it has and in spades.

We ahve different views but I ahve answered or given my reasons for remain being abetter bet in two posts, yet you won't proivde a short list of the benefits that leave will bring?

[swaledale]

Im not a fan of centralised government spending preferring to leave the money in the hands of the wage earner to spend at his or her discretion. Im a "rugged individualist" I believe the technical term is.

As for your latter comments they do not prove a stronger economy or a cheaper cost of living. They are some random numbers associated with the use of a migrant work force which I guess came from EU but could have been independently sourced from anywhere. Its akin to arguing that the Job Centre has made our economy strong: it hasnt, it has supplied a resource, thats all.

As Angry said, stick to football xxx

Thats not even an argument, so your in favour of going back to medieval times and feudalism where the majority of the population relied upn the patronage of theose fotunate enough to be rich?

I take it you dont drive on roads, use airports use the NHS, schools, happy to let your home burn down, not bothered about public health etc. etc. Oh and no defence forces then? Rog you kill me with that last statement you cannot really believe that.

And no the figures are independently researched facts not from the EU, **** me you can't dismiss everything as pure propaganda, I rather think its you who need to stick to football as the real world seems to evade your consciousness!!

[ramAnag]

Now the dust has settled and everyone has now excepted Brexit, Who would you like to be our next Prime Minister, I know most folk would want Nigel Farage but at the moment that's not possible.

Flippin' 'eck...seems even seven weeks on the dust has hardly 'settled'.

Angry...you don't half get agitated and...well...angry when you're challenged and not getting your own way. Don't want to fall out with you at all but for someone who initially told me to 'keep my political ****e off a football forum' and that you found politics 'boring' you've had an awful lot to say.

Most of this debate has been reasonable, intelligent and relatively polite. Towards the end it's got a touch polarised with myself, Swale and BaaLocks tending towards the 'left' and Tricky, Ram59 and yourself further to the 'right' but you are inclined, imo, to make things personal when the going gets a bit tough. Your comment about me not liking change for instance and being conservative in my comments is just a totally unfounded assumption that you have plucked from nowhere and been completely unable to substantiate. Indeed if either of us appears as a 'traditionalist' - and I've no objection to that - it's you rather than me.

Some of your comments about Swale too are unfounded. He may be passionate but, imo, he has put forward logical and well reasoned arguments and if the debate has become rather repetitive it is only because, after so many posts, the argument has come full circle. Once you start repeatedly going down the 'I despair...I really do' line and questioning the intelligence of others simply because they disagree with you, I think it's often a sign that you yourself may have run out of things to say.

Roger...you may be quite right in your comment about Koreans and the Japanese making up much of the *** tourism industry...I wouldn't know. Neither country is famed for having a high Muslim population though is it? So my point stands.

[ramAnag]

That's a very rocky road to go down, even suggesting that we select who can vote and who can't. I don't disagree that some 17 year old are not capable of voting. Look hard enough and you might find a few 10 year olds. There has to be a start point somewhere, if they reduce that to 16, I won't have a massive issue.. Doubt many will use it but that goes throughout the age bands. As for a 70/80 year old, they have earns the right to have a say. I would have massive issues if the vote was taken away from senior citizens just because they might die soon. That really is dangerous ground.

There you go again, where have I said the vote should be 'taken away from senior citizens because they might die soon'? Don't even bother looking because I haven't. My point was that, when the last EU vote was 41 years ago it seems odd to me that we don't consider allowing 17 year olds to vote when they obviously have a bigger stake in the future than many of the eighty and ninety year olds who may well be suffering from age related 'incapacitation'.

To be more specific...there are plenty of seventeen year olds in full time employment, full time education/training or allowed to fight for their country who, on the evidence of past experience, may now not have a chance to vote on the subject of EU membership until they are 58. In comparison I know of elderly people in care, many of whom are suffering short term memory loss or even Alzheimer's, who were fully entitled to vote.

Without being remotely disrespectful to the elderly I'd love you to tell me how that makes sense.

[AdiSalisbury]

Sooooo..... bendy bananas, crashing economy, Bulgarian neighbours, little Englanders, impending doom, European superstate and more cash for the NHS. Time to take Swaley off the ignore list and get back to the football