O/t bbc

[mistaram]

Come on RA, before the ultra right got involved, we had the first BLM protest which by and large went off peacefully. Unfortunately, Rent a mob decided to go down to Downing St, where they hurled abuse and anything else that they could lay their hands on, at police officers, deliberately dressed in normal uniform, so as not to provoke anyone. Do you not recall the mounted police woman's horse bolting after having a Boris bike thrown at it?

No left of centre politicians or BLM spokespersons would condemn this totally unprovoked attack on the police.

The police played it softly, softly, but still took a battering. Its continuing every night in London with illegal parties.

Excuse me it wasn't the left who were goading the police at Chuchills statue. It was right wing fascists who through flares and metal barriers at the police Please don't make the excuse about who got involved first . Violence is intolerable whether it be left or right

[Ram59]

Excuse me it wasn't the left who were goading the police at Chuchills statue. It was right wing fascists who through flares and metal barriers at the police Please don't make the excuse about who got involved first . Violence is intolerable whether it be left or right

Agreed Mista, I was just pointing out that these 'civil disturbances' started with factions of the otherwise peaceful blm protesters and it didn't help when they weren't universally condemned.

We've even got people defending the Liverpool fans, it's alright though because they've had to wait 30 years. Bull****, there are a 100,000 Liverpool fans who celebrated properly and didn't drag down the name of the club.

The BBC and other media will repeatedly hound Johnson to condemn the likes of Cummings, yet they let leaders of these groups of thugs off lightly.

[Andy_Faber]

No I don’t, as I suspect you well know.

Nor have I seen any evidence that the BLM movement supports those aims. Easy for causes to be hijacked by those with more sinister agendas...remember the poll tax riots?

You provide the evidence and I’ll reconsider my support.

It’s on their Facebook page

[ramAnag]

Agreed Mista, I was just pointing out that these 'civil disturbances' started with factions of the otherwise peaceful blm protesters and it didn't help when they weren't universally condemned.

We've even got people defending the Liverpool fans, it's alright though because they've had to wait 30 years. Bull****, there are a 100,000 Liverpool fans who celebrated properly and didn't drag down the name of the club.

The BBC and other media will repeatedly hound Johnson to condemn the likes of Cummings, yet they let leaders of these groups of thugs off lightly.

So we agree that it was the ‘right wing fascists’ who created most of the ‘rioting’ problem.

I agree with you about the behaviour of Liverpool fans, both the majority and the more media attractive minority.

The difference between Johnson and Cummings, compared with the ‘leaders of these groups of thugs’, is that the former are meant to be real leaders who set an example. They have palpably failed imo, and I can’t help but feel that the behaviour of the not so great British public has deteriorated significantly since the Durham fiasco and the emergence of a more obvious ‘one rule for them’ mentality.

Andy...I’ve never been on Facebook in my life so I wouldn’t know.
Suffice it to say...I don’t support any of the aims you described and I’m puzzled. As ever I take notice of what you write, but as far as the better known and perhaps original aims are concerned I support the BLM movement.

[Trickytreesreds]

So we agree that it was the ‘right wing fascists’ who created most of the ‘rioting’ problem.



Andy...I’ve never been on Facebook in my life so I wouldn’t know.
Suffice it to say...I don’t support any of the aims you described and I’m puzzled. As ever I take notice of what you write, but as far as the better known and perhaps original aims are concerned I support the BLM movement.

I wouldn't argue with you on that RA. But who has decided what the real aims are?
The ones organising these protests, seem to be using the sentiments of opinions like yours, whilst having a completely different agenda.
It seems I'm afraid to not be about equality or tolerence. It's what certian anarchists want it to be and what the press are pushing by distorting stories.

Remember the Florida massacre in the gay club? The LGBT community were outraged and fueled by the press in what was deemed a terrorism attack on gay people. Being the US made it even sweeter for them.

Recently we had the Reading murders. I only found out 2 days ago, that all 3 men were gay?
No outrage, no demos, no fury.
Why? Well for me, the fact a BLM rally had been held there earlier and the attacker was a Muslim was an inconvenient truth.
It was hushed up and hardly mentioned. It isn't the first time.
The press are playing a strange game at the moment. They love whipping people up, for demo's. If its a minority/anti Tory/Anti US demos, then great. If the right have one, it's an affront of moral outrage.
Here's one I remember from a year ago, ash Sakar about Trump. Her hypocrisy is hilarious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNFOVkB6JjQ&t=15s
Piers Morgan ffs

[Trickytreesreds]

So we agree that it was the ‘right wing fascists’ who created most of the ‘rioting’ problem.

I agree with you about the behaviour of Liverpool fans, both the majority and the more media attractive minority.

The difference between Johnson and Cummings, compared with the ‘leaders of these groups of thugs’, is that the former are meant to be real leaders who set an example. They have palpably failed imo, and I can’t help but feel that the behaviour of the not so great British public has deteriorated significantly since the Durham fiasco and the emergence of a more obvious ‘one rule for them’ mentality.

Andy...I’ve never been on Facebook in my life so I wouldn’t know.
Suffice it to say...I don’t support any of the aims you described and I’m puzzled. As ever I take notice of what you write, but as far as the better known and perhaps original aims are concerned I support the BLM movement.

RA I think you have to re examine that whole situation.
1. The BLM protests were allowed in very low key circumstances
2. The police wore normal kit and kept a distance
3. It didn't stop an element looking for something to "kick off" For you to say it was peaceful and all right wing is wrong on so many levels.
It started peaceful but went down hill. Here is someones video walking with them. It doesn't even show the monument assualts, which should have engaged the police due to criminal damage. But they didn't.
4. The "far right" as you call it was mainly ex service men and a few old age football hooligans. However the press loved bigging that one up
5. The cops come out in force and full battle gear. It was squashed as I would expected the other protests to be, but weren't.

Here's the video done, didn't look peaceful to me.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=J7gwU-Qop24

[mistaram]

I wouldn't argue with you on that RA. But who has decided what the real aims are?
The ones organising these protests, seem to be using the sentiments of opinions like yours, whilst having a completely different agenda.
It seems I'm afraid to not be about equality or tolerence. It's what certian anarchists want it to be and what the press are pushing by distorting stories.

Remember the Florida massacre in the gay club? The LGBT community were outraged and fueled by the press in what was deemed a terrorism attack on gay people. Being the US made it even sweeter for them.

Recently we had the Reading murders. I only found out 2 days ago, that all 3 men were gay?
No outrage, no demos, no fury.
Why? Well for me, the fact a BLM rally had been held there earlier and the attacker was a Muslim was an inconvenient truth.
It was hushed up and hardly mentioned. It isn't the first time.
The press are playing a strange game at the moment. They love whipping people up, for demo's. If its a minority/anti Tory/Anti US demos, then great. If the right have one, it's an affront of moral outrage.
Here's one I remember from a year ago, ash Sakar about Trump. Her hypocrisy is hilarious.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jNFOVkB6JjQ&t=15s
Piers Morgan ffs

Tricky not sure what your trying to say about the three men being gay in the Reading attack . What does matter that there was BLM rally earlier in the day How has been hushed up there are videos on Y/tube of the whole incident . Four pages in the Sun yesterday ,go on their webpage there's a video Nothing to do with gays at all it was a terrorist related murder Instead sneering and trying to blame the BBC can't your anger at our intelligence service, police etc Who knew what the alleged was about they had been watching him for three years He has just come of a deradicalisation programme Try putting the blame where it belongs not at the press and media outlets

[swaledale]

Completely evaded the point RA.
Are you condoning the banning of KH for her own opinions, when she has said nothing illegal? Sounds very anti democratic and western to me does that.
No one has to listen to her, but for someone to decide whether you can/can't is getting very 1984 to me.

Thicky why don't you **** off and post your ignorant ravings on some other Forum? ****ing ****!

[ramAnag]

I’m really not sure what your point is Tricky...so, taking them all in order.

Yes certain ‘anarchists’ and extremists have attached themselves to the BLM cause...and served only to damage the cause.

Yes, I remember the Florida Gay Club massacre. Owen Jones got particularly emotional about it and was hammered, by you amongst others, for his response.

Unlike the Reading murders the Florida attack was a premeditated, targeted attack involving automatic weapons. I don’t know too much about the Reading incident but I suspect the fact that there had been a BLM rally there earlier in the day is irrelevant, and I also suspect that they were perpetrated by a man who had serious mental health issues and a knife. The fact that he was a Muslim doesn’t make it a ‘terrorist attack’ anymore than the more recent Glasgow incident could be described - as it incorrectly initially was - as a terrorist incident because it involved asylum seekers.

I don’t take any notice of Piers Morgan...just another professional loudmouth imo...so no comment.

‘The police wore normal kit’ because, in the circumstances they didn’t want to appear provocative, and because the protest wasn’t expected to become violent.

They were more prepared when the ‘far right’ declared their involvement because they know, from experience, what such individuals are all about. Frankly, whenever the far/extreme right are involved it always involves violence and must be like policing Millwall v West Ham.

Finally, I don’t understand your obsession with the ‘press’ being on the side of the ‘left’.
The Guardian and the Mirror may be fairly described as being moderately left wing. The BBC and the Independent - and I know you’ll disagree about the former - are, imo, fair, unbiased and even handed.
The rest are somewhere between centre and further right...they are not all queuing up to ‘whip up’ support for essentially left of centre causes...far from it.

[Trickytreesreds]

I’m really not sure what your point is Tricky...so, taking them all in order.

Yes certain ‘anarchists’ and extremists have attached themselves to the BLM cause...and served only to damage the cause.

Yes, I remember the Florida Gay Club massacre. Owen Jones got particularly emotional about it and was hammered, by you amongst others, for his response.

Unlike the Reading murders the Florida attack was a premeditated, targeted attack involving automatic weapons. I don’t know too much about the Reading incident but I suspect the fact that there had been a BLM rally there earlier in the day is irrelevant, and I also suspect that they were perpetrated by a man who had serious mental health issues and a knife. The fact that he was a Muslim doesn’t make it a ‘terrorist attack’ anymore than the more recent Glasgow incident could be described - as it incorrectly initially was - as a terrorist incident because it involved asylum seekers.

I don’t take any notice of Piers Morgan...just another professional loudmouth imo...so no comment.

‘The police wore normal kit’ because, in the circumstances they didn’t want to appear provocative, and because the protest wasn’t expected to become violent.

They were more prepared when the ‘far right’ declared their involvement because they know, from experience, what such individuals are all about. Frankly, whenever the far/extreme right are involved it always involves violence and must be like policing Millwall v West Ham.

Finally, I don’t understand your obsession with the ‘press’ being on the side of the ‘left’.
The Guardian and the Mirror may be fairly described as being moderately left wing. The BBC and the Independent - and I know you’ll disagree about the former - are, imo, fair, unbiased and even handed.
The rest are somewhere between centre and further right...they are not all queuing up to ‘whip up’ support for essentially left of centre causes...far from it.

Thank you for a thought out repsonse.
My point is that the press paint the picture how they want you to see it.
The BLM rallies were painted as peaceful, they were not. The police toned down their prescense, yet were still attacked and abused. So much so, they "ran away" rather than confront a crime. There is loads of personal videos of this online. You aren't a daft lad. Yet your opinion seems limited by what you watch on the BBC and read in the guardian. Has it ever occurred to you that possibly, just possibly that the content they show has been streamed and edited to show a situation from one side?
Does this look peaceful/respectful and well intended?
https://www.facebook.com/10000950858...591091867/?t=2

The far right hold a rally, yet the police go kitted up from the off. The monuments are boarded up after all the graffitti attacks have been allowed to happen, against a protest that wants to protect them?

Why wasn't this done from day one?

It seems to me to be a one sided response. The BLM/activists/ANTIFA can cause criminal damage, assault the police and the response is mediocre.
But the right have a demo( not going to call them far right as most of them were ex service personel), get confronted by the riot squad and their access denied. What is the differece?
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=kc2Z_kK1vlc