O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[Trickytreesreds]

Hopefully only a matter of time until common sense and decency take priority over half baked populist nonsense.

Please show/ tell me where this common sense/ decency is coming from ? Show me a shining light.

As for your populist nonsense. As AF is ponting out, it is becoming very "popular" all over the world.


Perhaps you need to remind yourself.

populism
/ˈpɒpjʊlɪz(ə)m/
noun

1.
a political approach that strives to appeal to ordinary people who feel that their concerns are disregarded by established elite groups:

[ramAnag]

Please show/ tell me where this common sense/ decency is coming from ? Show me a shining light.

As for your populist nonsense. As AF is ponting out, it is becoming very "popular" all over the world.


Perhaps you need to remind yourself.

populism
/ˈpɒpjʊlɪz(ə)m/
noun

1.
a political approach that strives to appeal to ordinary people who feel that their concerns are disregarded by established elite groups:

Populism assumes there to be two groups of people...the ‘pure people’ and the ‘corrupt elite’.

Unfortunately the ‘people’ are anything but ‘pure’ while there are far too many ‘corrupt elites’...but it doesn’t have to be like that.

We...Society...actually need an ‘elite’...we need individuals to govern and guide. Unfortunately that ‘elite’ is invariably made up of politicians...and the politicians only typical area of expertise is, unsurprisingly, the self serving business of politics.

We need an honest ‘elite’ of genuine experts to provide the guidance that society needs. That is surely one thing the pandemic has taught us. Tbh I don’t know how we manage that trick, but it has to be better than the current system of dishonest incompetents with little capacity for joined up thought and honest communication because their mind sets are governed by the need to be re-elected every few years.

[Trickytreesreds]

Populism assumes there to be two groups of people...the ‘pure people’ and the ‘corrupt elite’.

Unfortunately the ‘people’ are anything but ‘pure’ while there are far too many ‘corrupt elites’...but it doesn’t have to be like that.

We...Society...actually need an ‘elite’...we need individuals to govern and guide. Unfortunately that ‘elite’ is invariably made up of politicians...and the politicians only typical area of expertise is, unsurprisingly, the self serving business of politics.

We need an honest ‘elite’ of genuine experts to provide the guidance that society needs. That is surely one thing the pandemic has taught us. Tbh I don’t know how we manage that trick, but it has to be better than the current system of dishonest incompetents with little capacity for joined up thought and honest communication because their mind sets are governed by the need to be re-elected every few years.

So we are in agreement then, the current crop of leaders pisses everyone right off.

Perhaps you miss the point of, that is why populism surged.
You probably mean the Tories, I mean everyone. The government/the opposition parties.
Brexit- the surge of power grab by an unelected elite in Europe.
The population finally says, enough!!!!

It is everywhere, with groups and companies and politicians telling us that they know best.
Well unfortunately, they seem to forget the population decides that, not them.

Now the chances of you finding a utopia of uncorrupted/honest/ sincere leaders, that we all want. Are about as likely as me, getting my wish of the Minogue sisters, wrestling naked in a paddling pool of jelly.

So it comes right back, to what you call a red herring. The population ends up voting for the best available, out of the tosh on the field.

Pretty sorry really isn't it.

[ramAnag]

So we are in agreement then, the current crop of leaders pisses everyone right off.

Perhaps you miss the point of, that is why populism surged.
You probably mean the Tories, I mean everyone. The government/the opposition parties.
Brexit- the surge of power grab by an unelected elite in Europe.
The population finally says, enough!!!!

It is everywhere, with groups and companies and politicians telling us that they know best.
Well unfortunately, they seem to forget the population decides that, not them.

Now the chances of you finding a utopia of uncorrupted/honest/ sincere leaders, that we all want. Are about as likely as me, getting my wish of the Minogue sisters, wrestling naked in a paddling pool of jelly.

So it comes right back, to what you call a red herring. The population ends up voting for the best available, out of the tosh on the field.

Pretty sorry really isn't it.

Yep...it is ‘pretty sorry’ and I suppose there is some sort of agreement between us about the current crop of leaders and yes, I accept my suggestion is utopian, but by ‘populism’ I am referring to over simplified ‘gut reaction’ solutions and your comment about the ‘population’ deciding and ‘finally saying enough’ is just wrong.
After all...Brexit typifies the above and how many of the population/electorate ‘decided’ enough was enough and that this was the way forward? About 17.4 million out of approximately 47 million...no wonder then that society is so divided.

[MadAmster]

The biggest shock is the new variant no news reader is telling you about. Why won't they tell us about the llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysilio gogogoch variant?

[Trickytreesreds]

Yep...it is ‘pretty sorry’ and I suppose there is some sort of agreement between us about the current crop of leaders and yes, I accept my suggestion is utopian, but by ‘populism’ I am referring to over simplified ‘gut reaction’ solutions and your comment about the ‘population’ deciding and ‘finally saying enough’ is just wrong.
After all...Brexit typifies the above and how many of the population/electorate ‘decided’ enough was enough and that this was the way forward? About 17.4 million out of approximately 47 million...no wonder then that society is so divided.

I wasn't quoting figures RA.
I was on about the surge of back lash that went across the nation.
It wasn't long ago, (especially where the EU was concerned), that folks just said nothing and let it happen.
Common market/ EEC / to EU. Maastricht to Lisbon.
The population was bamboozled and ignored.
The pure arrogance of elitist politicians

My whole point is, these people work for us. They are supposed to represent us.

That in essense is why Johnson and Farage got support. They listened, picked a side and got on with it.
Right or wrong is irrellevent.
Johnson surged in the election with it, whilst Labour and Libs bombed.
Every time Conservatives deviate from that, back comes Farage and takes a massive chunk of Tory support with him.

Its a lesson Labour could well learn from, seeing as they are or were, the working class party.

From Nuclear weapons to immigration. All have a public opinion, but Labour never listens.

[Andy_Faber]

The biggest shock is the new variant no news reader is telling you about. Why won't they tell us about the llanfairpwllgwyngyllgogerychwyrndrobwllllantysilio gogogoch variant?

I think you spelled variant wrong

[ramAnag]

I wasn't quoting figures RA.
I was on about the surge of back lash that went across the nation.
It wasn't long ago, (especially where the EU was concerned), that folks just said nothing and let it happen.
Common market/ EEC / to EU. Maastricht to Lisbon.
The population was bamboozled and ignored.
The pure arrogance of elitist politicians

My whole point is, these people work for us. They are supposed to represent us.

That in essense is why Johnson and Farage got support. They listened, picked a side and got on with it.
Right or wrong is irrellevent.
Johnson surged in the election with it, whilst Labour and Libs bombed.
Every time Conservatives deviate from that, back comes Farage and takes a massive chunk of Tory support with him.

Its a lesson Labour could well learn from, seeing as they are or were, the working class party.

From Nuclear weapons to immigration. All have a public opinion, but Labour never listens.

But sadly, all opinions aren’t worth the same, Tricky.
You’ll claim that’s me being elitist, but it’s not. It’s the same in all walks of life...from this forum to the much bigger political picture.

As for Johnson and Farage (feel free to add Gove, Williamson, Hancock, Patel, Rhys Mogg)...all they’ve ever listened to is what resounds with the new vociferous minority in order to bring them power. If you’ve fallen for that one...sorry but more fool you.

Either way...your point was that they had ‘listened to the population’ (66,000,000) by which I imagine you meant the electorate or potential electorate (approx 47,000,000). Their sound and fury then attracted the support of 17,400,000 of that 47,000,000. We’ve been here before of course...but how can that ever be viewed as the voice of the people/population/electorate?

Getting back on topic. The next huge issue is whether or not the return to normality can continue with the next steps out of lockdown planned for 21st June in the light of the Indian variant.
I, of course don’t know the answer but I’d much prefer to follow informed and educated scientific advice rather than the less expert and politically motivated meanderings of politicians.

[MadAmster]

I think you spelled variant wrong

I know I didn't but you used the USA spelling for the past tense of the verb "to spell" which is a huge crime in my lessons young man

[Trickytreesreds]

I, of course don’t know the answer but I’d much prefer to follow informed and educated scientific advice rather than the less expert and politically motivated meanderings of politicians.

RA, neither of us knows the answer and no matter what is chosen, it will be wrong for many either way.
The experts as you say, always go by worse case scenario. The consequences away from what they want, also costs lives.
( I always love a John Knott quote about experts, over the Harriers ability to fight. "Ex as in has been and spert as in drip under pressure)
So it's a gamble and guessing game.
There are enough protests and fuel for rioting now. What do you suppose is going to happen if he extends or reimposes restrictions?
The same way, if he doesn't and death toll rises, who'll be screaming then?

Personnally, we have to drive the nails in on the vacinnation completion and get out of this mess.
1.3 million illegal immigrants granted amnesty to get vaccinated (how the feck has it got to that level?)
But if that is what is needed, so be it.

This can't go on forever.