O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[Andy_Faber]

Not so sure its 'over' Tricky,especially wrt overseas travel. HMG are only in control of one end of the pipe, look at the Welsh fans banned from Amsterdam for instance.

I think however that HMG dropped a massive ******* not putting India on the Red list two weeks earlier and it's coming back to bite us now, especially as my (gotta admit limited) experience of self-isolation compliance amongst those returning from India is that it is nil - I'm aware of a family in my parents RIP's old village who came back from India on a the wednesday before the red list announcement and hosted an open house for their property, which they were selling, on the following saturday! (I know this because it was my former family home and they informed me out of courtesy).

No idea why HMG missed this trick with India, you can't even wave the cultural sensitivities card on this one as Pakistan and Bangla Desh WERE put on this list. Just a decision that HMG got wrong IMO

[ramAnag]

No idea why HMG missed this trick with India, you can't even wave the cultural sensitivities card on this one as Pakistan and Bangla Desh WERE put on this list. Just a decision that HMG got wrong IMO

Hmmm...nothing to do with ‘cultural sensitivities’...all to do with keeping those we are keen on creating major trade ‘replacement’ deals with ‘sweet’...i.e. we need India...we don’t ‘need’ Pakistan and Bangladesh.

How can it be over, Tricky? This country has worse figures as far as the Indian/Delta variant is concerned than anywhere else in Europe. Yes, of course our vaccination programme is helping, or appears to be, but we really can’t blame other nations for being reluctant to accept visitors from a place increasingly perceived as ‘Plague Island’...and, like AF, I speak as someone extremely keen to visit Southern Europe in early autumn.

[Andy_Faber]

Hmmm...nothing to do with ‘cultural sensitivities’...all to do with keeping those we are keen on creating major trade ‘replacement’ deals with ‘sweet’...i.e. we need India...we don’t ‘need’ Pakistan and Bangladesh.

How can it be over, Tricky? This country has worse figures as far as the Indian/Delta variant is concerned than anywhere else in Europe. Yes, of course our vaccination programme is helping, or appears to be, but we really can’t blame other nations for being reluctant to accept visitors from a place increasingly perceived as ‘Plague Island’...and, like AF, I speak as someone extremely keen to visit Southern Europe in early autumn.

Yes there may be something in the trade deal thing, something doesnt add up

Its not over, far from it, but as my stats from yesterday show there aren't really any countries not still stuck in the plague pit, we have some worse indicators, some better, I trust the scientific reports not the news media

[ramAnag]

Yes there may be something in the trade deal thing, something doesnt add up

Its not over, far from it, but as my stats from yesterday show there aren't really any countries not still stuck in the plague pit, we have some worse indicators, some better, I trust the scientific reports not the news media

I too trust science over media excitability...but I think you have to be aware that, in the same way as there is the responsible news media and the totally irresponsible politically driven news media, some scientific commentators are in the ‘pocket’ of Government while others are entirely objective.

Unfortunately the scientists aren’t all singing from the same ‘hymn sheet’...for my part I’ll listen most closely to those who remain independent and have no links to Government and no vested interest in telling us all how well they and HMG have done.

As an example...I’ve had two doses of the AZ vaccine and no problems. I may be going to benefit shortly because, over here, I’m considered as ‘fully protected’ as it is possible to be. I have very close family in the eastern U.S. and in that particular part they don’t recognise the AZ vaccine at all and don’t dispense it. Who’s right? They can’t both be...but surely the science should be the same on both sides of the ‘pond’.

Sh*t...they’ve just said on Sky I can’t go to Afghanistan or Mongolia...all my holiday hopes dashed then!

[MadAmster]

In the week ending last Tuesday, we had 5714 new cases. That's 34 per 100,000 of the population and 4.3% of those tested proving positive. 160 new hospitalisations. 32 new admissions to the ICU. 17 deaths. The R value is 0.77

We also have 26267 people seen to be infectious. That's around 150 per 100,000. To be granted "travel freedom" to many countries that has to drop below 50. Of course, we also have to look at their figures as well so we don't have to quarantine when we return.....

No plans at the moment to fly to the sun.

[wanderlust]

I think the government were faced with a crisis that they were unprepared for despite the potential for a pandemic being raised to the planning committee years ago - I guess at the time the government didn't see it as a ***y way of spending the public purse and that really has come back to bite us economically.
And this alludes to my biggest concern about this government - their decisions seem to be driven by the populism that got them elected in the first place.
Rather than "do we need to do this?" they seem to decide on the basis of "how will this play with the voters?"
When they decided on lockdown for example, it wasn't a case of we need to do this now but we'll do it in two weeks' time - which immediately sent all the dickheads out for a two week covid party that massively exacerbated the problem.
"Following the science" went out of the window when they sensed that folk were getting twitchy so they picked a date that would be the laughable "freedom day" regardless of what the science was saying.
And that's the problem with populist governments - they have to be popular, so they don't take hard but necessary decisions.
The other problem is that populist governments can get away with murder - literally in this case - because those who voted for them and the media that got them elected will never admit they were wrong and will trot out "mitigating circumstances" as an excuse - but eventually that will wear thin with or without the song.

https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presente...h-anniversary/

[ramAnag]

I think the government were faced with a crisis that they were unprepared for despite the potential for a pandemic being raised to the planning committee years ago - I guess at the time the government didn't see it as a ***y way of spending the public purse and that really has come back to bite us economically.
And this alludes to my biggest concern about this government - their decisions seem to be driven by the populism that got them elected in the first place.
Rather than "do we need to do this?" they seem to decide on the basis of "how will this play with the voters?"
When they decided on lockdown for example, it wasn't a case of we need to do this now but we'll do it in two weeks' time - which immediately sent all the dickheads out for a two week covid party that massively exacerbated the problem.
"Following the science" went out of the window when they sensed that folk were getting twitchy so they picked a date that would be the laughable "freedom day" regardless of what the science was saying.
And that's the problem with populist governments - they have to be popular, so they don't take hard but necessary decisions.
The other problem is that populist governments can get away with murder - literally in this case - because those who voted for them and the media that got them elected will never admit they were wrong and will trot out "mitigating circumstances" as an excuse - but eventually that will wear thin with or without the song.

https://www.lbc.co.uk/radio/presente...h-anniversary/

Great post...aka, agree with every word of it!

As for the song. Perhaps comparison with North Korea is a tad extreme, but it does remind me of U.S. excesses, eg...about three years ago I attended one of my grandaughter’s ‘graduation ceremonies’ over there. She was five (!!) at the time and had to wear a mortar board and gown, hold her hand on her heart and swear allegiance to the flag. Laughable or sinister indoctrination? You decide, I know what I believe.

[Trickytreesreds]

Hmmm...nothing to do with ‘cultural sensitivities’...all to do with keeping those we are keen on creating major trade ‘replacement’ deals with ‘sweet’...i.e. we need India...we don’t ‘need’ Pakistan and Bangladesh.

How can it be over, Tricky? This country has worse figures as far as the Indian/Delta variant is concerned than anywhere else in Europe. Yes, of course our vaccination programme is helping, or appears to be, but we really can’t blame other nations for being reluctant to accept visitors from a place increasingly perceived as ‘Plague Island’...and, like AF, I speak as someone extremely keen to visit Southern Europe in early autumn.

I never said COVID was over. I meant the restrictions being imposed as being ham fisted and a waste of time.
There is now more damage being done, to future lives and peoples economic futures than whats being saved.
Even you cannot defend 12.2 million people being denied treatment, due to hospital back logs.
We are either in lock down or we are not.
Its that simple. WE ARE/WE AREN'T/A BIT HERE/ A BIT THERE doesn't cut it anymore.

Vaccination, is nearly done. (My local surgery, sent a text today, that every adult can be first or second dosed now)

Shutting everything down because, there might be a Scilly isles strain, or Antarctic version next, isn't washable with the general public anymore.

I nearly lost my life, due to NHS **** ups with delays. That was pre COVID. In todays situation, I'd be kissing my ass goodbye. That same situation will be looming over thousands at this very moment.

Enough is enough.

[ramAnag]

I never said COVID was over. I meant the restrictions being imposed as being ham fisted and a waste of time.
There is now more damage being done, to future lives and peoples economic futures than whats being saved.
Even you cannot defend 12.2 million people being denied treatment, due to hospital back logs.
We are either in lock down or we are not.
Its that simple. WE ARE/WE AREN'T/A BIT HERE/ A BIT THERE doesn't cut it anymore.

Vaccination, is nearly done. (My local surgery, sent a text today, that every adult can be first or second dosed now)

Shutting everything down because, there might be a Scilly isles strain, or Antarctic version next, isn't washable with the general public anymore.

I nearly lost my life, due to NHS **** ups with delays. That was pre COVID. In todays situation, I'd be kissing my ass goodbye. That same situation will be looming over thousands at this very moment.

Enough is enough.

You said, ‘Lift it. It’s over’ and have followed that up with ‘Enough is enough’.

I understand and appreciate where you’re coming from and far be it from me to defend this Government but, partly because of your entirely understandable vested interest, you are over simplifying and belittling things. It’s not about there might be a ‘Scilly Islands’ or ‘Antarctic’ strain...the Indian/Delta ‘version’ poses a very real threat and none of us can afford a two steps forward three steps back scenario...imo.

[ramAnag]

Seeing as some ‘wit’ has changed the thread title more specifically to Matt ‘Hands off cocks, on socks’...I fear we may be asking the wrong question.
So a cabinet minister has an alleged affair with his advisor/aid. Big deal...work place relationships happen and I’m not sure the ‘social distancing’ is that massive a deal either. They’ve been seen together a lot, attended meetings together etc...so I’m not sure any further exchange of bodily fluids that may have taken place makes that much difference.
What is of greater concern, imo, is the way this ‘old University friend’ appears to have been made a non executive member of the Dept. of Health and Social Care and has been receiving around £15k for a role which involves 15-20 DAYS of work per YEAR.
Nepotism is a far greater ‘crime’ than ***ual impropriety imo, and it would appear that ‘Tory sleaze’ is alive and well in Westminster.