O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[Geoff Parkstone]

No

[ramAnag]

No

Glad we’ve cleared that up then. About as clear as this Government’s policy on...anything and everything.

[Ram59]

Okay...so you approve of their handling of the Nightingale Hospitals, their stance on schools, the time given to debate the latest Covid and Brexit developments and the fact that Parliament won’t be expected to function again after tomorrow until 11th January?

Firstly, the Nightingale hospitals should have been used at the beginning of this second wave, to keep normal hospitals covid free. The problem with the staffing of the Nightingale hospitals is down to absenteeism, I know from a friend in the NHS that there are a significant number of people in her department who are 'isolating' or swinging the lead. These excessive numbers could be preventing the opening of the Nightingales.

I believe that the primary schools should remain open for the welfare of the children and to allow their parents to go to work. In a nod to you RA, these teachers should be treated as carers and be vaccinated. I think that children of key workers and those sitting exams should also return and their teachers vaccinated.

Parliament should return, but I don't think that much practical use will be gained from this. The Brexit deal will pass because nobody wants the alternative, so there's no debate to be had there. The government's handling of the covid crisis is being played out in the full glare of the media and I think that there is little that parliament can do to make much difference.

[ramAnag]

Firstly, the Nightingale hospitals should have been used at the beginning of this second wave, to keep normal hospitals covid free. The problem with the staffing of the Nightingale hospitals is down to absenteeism, I know from a friend in the NHS that there are a significant number of people in her department who are 'isolating' or swinging the lead. These excessive numbers could be preventing the opening of the Nightingales.

I believe that the primary schools should remain open for the welfare of the children and to allow their parents to go to work. In a nod to you RA, these teachers should be treated as carers and be vaccinated. I think that children of key workers and those sitting exams should also return and their teachers vaccinated.

Parliament should return, but I don't think that much practical use will be gained from this. The Brexit deal will pass because nobody wants the alternative, so there's no debate to be had there. The government's handling of the covid crisis is being played out in the full glare of the media and I think that there is little that parliament can do to make much difference.

The exam issue is a ‘smokescreen’, Ram. All these exam courses are two year courses. Pupils due to take exams this year already lost a large proportion of the last academic year and this year hasn’t been as uninterrupted as some would have you believe. Plenty of examples of year groups having to be sent home for periods of time last term.

With respect, it’s not a ‘nod to me’ that teachers should be vaccinated...it’s just common sense...but the point surely is, with at least one variant of the virus thought to be more easily transmissible by children we can’t afford to have the virus going back onto countless homes if we want to stop the spread until widespread vaccination takes place.

[Geoff Parkstone]

Glad we’ve cleared that up then. About as clear as this Government’s policy on...anything and everything.

When presented with two black or white options when my response would be a shade of grey, then I can only answer no in both cases. Policy is neither a disaster nor perfect.

[ramAnag]

When presented with two black or white options when my response would be a shade of grey, then I can only answer no in both cases. Policy is neither a disaster nor perfect.

Ah, I see you’ve returned to the sanctuary of your Brexit indecisiveness.
Okay...so what have they done well...how have the Boris bunch inspired any degree of confidence in their integrity and competence over recent weeks?

[Geoff Parkstone]

Prima facie certain aspects of the Brexit trade agreement are sound; actually concluding a deal is a positive; chucking much of the country into Tier 4 seems sensible; short circuiting the 5 day spreader opportunity over Xmas looks right. I'm not saying the preludes to all these things were perfect - the processes have been flawed, the timings have been perhaps delayed too long but you cannot hang the government for (a) announcing Xmas an (b) cancelling Xmas in a volatile environment - unless you are so one eyed as to criticise for the sake of it.

I'm not indecisive as you contend, what I do is to assess the position, recognise that there is not an absolute right or an absolute wrong, rather a bit of both in the governmental approach. On the other hand you are so one eyed as to come across as blind.

[ramAnag]

‘Blind’ or consistent?
I’ve consistently opposed Brexit but was relieved we ended up with a deal. Whether that ‘deal’ will be as beneficial as our original one as full members of the EU is all that should matter. After five years of wrangling the fact that our ‘sovereign’ Parliament now gets a whole half day to debate the bill is, imo, ridiculous.

This thread though is about the handling of the pandemic.
I don’t think I have ever criticised for the sake of it. What would be the point of that?
I praised the creation of the Nightingale Hospitals earlier in the year...but where are they now, when, as you suggest, they are most needed?
I was critical of the Christmas decision...not because of the ‘cancelling’ Christmas aspect...but because of the bone headed, populist, stubbornness which led to them ignoring all the scientific advice in the first place and then led to having to make a typically last minute ‘U turn’ which led to disappointment and confusion for millions.
As regards schools...I’d love to see them remain open but only when it’s safe for that to happen. I’m told, by friends and acquaintances in the pharmaceutical industry, that there may be seven variants of the original virus. That in itself isn’t as concerning as it might sound but the fact is that, until the vaccine is widely available and implemented, there is one particular variant which appears to be much more transmissible by children.
The aim at the moment is surely, after nine months of disruption, to remain as safe as possible until the vaccine(s) take effect.
Having children and young people in schools and universities mixing in large groups and then returning home is not, in the light of the new variant, compatible with maintaining that ‘safety’.
That is what SAGE suggest and I don’t think there’s a hint of myopia in arguing that case. Unfortunately the Government will, as ever, leave such decisions to the last minute...unless, of course, it’s about their own participation in keeping the country running in which case they’re happy to postpone until 11th January.

[MadAmster]

Weren't the Nightingale's intended to take hospital overflow that never happened.

They also have the problem that there are no staff to run them......

[ramAnag]

Weren't the Nightingale's intended to take hospital overflow that never happened.

They also have the problem that there are no staff to run them......

Indeed...but that ‘overflow’ seems more likely now than it has at any time since late April.

As regards the NHS staff shortage, which is also true, might it be relevant to consider who has been ‘in charge’ for the last ten and a half years?