O/T. The Government's handling of Covid

[swaledale]

We have very high death rates from a global pandemic and the government’s handling of that pandemic shares the same marks of ignoring the science, promising big and delivering late and small. What is saving us at the moment is that when the scientists dig in their heels even this government does the right thing (late), that UK science (not under government guidance or leadership) has delivered vaccines and that the NHS has been too strong and wonderful an institution to allow us to die in even greater numbers. The bright spots in the pandemic are the areas where government has been unable to cock it up and where public service has remained the bedrock of how the system works despite this government’s incompetence.

[MadAmster]

.... HMG. The gift that keeps on giving. The Guardian reported today that there are billions of poundsworth of PPE floating about........ somewhere. It's just that nobody knows where.

[ramAnag]

We have very high death rates from a global pandemic and the government’s handling of that pandemic shares the same marks of ignoring the science, promising big and delivering late and small. What is saving us at the moment is that when the scientists dig in their heels even this government does the right thing (late), that UK science (not under government guidance or leadership) has delivered vaccines and that the NHS has been too strong and wonderful an institution to allow us to die in even greater numbers. The bright spots in the pandemic are the areas where government has been unable to cock it up and where public service has remained the bedrock of how the system works despite this government’s incompetence.

I think that’s fair comment Swale. Just as Churchill can’t be personally credited with the success of the Normandy landings, so Johnson can’t be personally credited with the success of the vaccination programme or personally held to account for the emergence of the British/Kent variant.
The job of any PM, particularly at a time of crisis, is to be a figurehead, a leader and first rate communicator. Unfortunately he seems to have failed on all those counts hence MA’s alleged 25/75% approximate success/failure rate in terms of the Government’s handling of Covid.
The other main job of a leader, and I appreciate that this was done with only Brexit - and not Covid - on the immediate horizon, is to choose a good team/Cabinet to implement strategies.
Looking at the current bunch it seems likely that only Hancock and Sunak might emerge with any eventual credit. Words fail me as far as the child like Williamson, the rabbit in the headlights Gove, ‘Cruella’ Patel and ‘Arthur Daley’ Jenrick are concerned. Not good choices at all imo.

[swaledale]

I think that’s fair comment Swale. Just as Churchill can’t be personally credited with the success of the Normandy landings, so Johnson can’t be personally credited with the success of the vaccination programme or personally held to account for the emergence of the British/Kent variant.
The job of any PM, particularly at a time of crisis, is to be a figurehead, a leader and first rate communicator. Unfortunately he seems to have failed on all those counts hence MA’s alleged 25/75% approximate success/failure rate in terms of the Government’s handling of Covid.
The other main job of a leader, and I appreciate that this was done with only Brexit - and not Covid - on the immediate horizon, is to choose a good team/Cabinet to implement strategies.
Looking at the current bunch it seems likely that only Hancock and Sunak might emerge with any eventual credit. Words fail me as far as the child like Williamson, the rabbit in the headlights Gove, ‘Cruella’ Patel and ‘Arthur Daley’ Jenrick are concerned. Not good choices at all imo.

You will forgive me if I don't share you enthusiasm for Hancock, he is useless and as for Sunak, well eat to help out was supposedly one of his ideas, so not so sure that compared to the other useless ****wits, its not just that in comparison he seems partially sentient. Anyway Sunak has done the easy part, doling out money, the hard part comes post pandemic.

[Andy_Faber]

you might find it comforting (and/or equally disturbing) to become a member of yougov.co.uk chat, where such issues are not discussed but actually voted on. Government/Boris sentiment is currently running at something like what we should now call 'The MA Derivation', my vote was probably a bit less so because IMO the voting buttons weren't nuanced enough

What reduces its impact somewhat, and I discussed this with my civil servant bag-carrier friend, is that further analysis which is apparently done but we don't see on such opinion polls shows that they are heavily subscribed-to by those with 'an issue' with those in charge/with the intellectual option (see Brexit etc) so should be detuned a few clicks. interesting though

[ramAnag]

You will forgive me if I don't share you enthusiasm for Hancock, he is useless and as for Sunak, well eat to help out was supposedly one of his ideas, so not so sure that compared to the other useless ****wits, its not just that in comparison he seems partially sentient. Anyway Sunak has done the easy part, doling out money, the hard part comes post pandemic.

Not disagreeing...I have no ‘enthusiasm’ for Hancock but after an appalling start and step into the unknown he seems to have restored some small degree of credibility since the turn of the year. You’re right about ‘eat out to help out’...hadn’t realised it was a Sunak ‘brainwave’.
Either way...it’s all ‘relative’ and the others I mentioned appear much much worse than useless.

[swaledale]

Not disagreeing...I have no ‘enthusiasm’ for Hancock but after an appalling start and step into the unknown he seems to have restored some small degree of credibility since the turn of the year. You’re right about ‘eat out to help out’...hadn’t realised it was a Sunak ‘brainwave’.
Either way...it’s all ‘relative’ and the others I mentioned appear much much worse than useless.

I've known a good many senior people look credible off the back of others efforts!

[ramAnag]

I've known a good many senior people look credible off the back of others efforts!

Indeed! In all walks of life...and that I suspect is the point. The fact that the vaccination process appears to be going well is actually down to two groups of people imo...those in charge of procurement and those in charge of administering and running the vaccination centres.
I praised the process I went through last weekend because it was so well organised, but that, in truth, is probably 90% down to the folk at my local surgery and 10% down to the funding provided by a higher authority.

[Ram59]

We have very high death rates from a global pandemic and the government’s handling of that pandemic shares the same marks of ignoring the science, promising big and delivering late and small. What is saving us at the moment is that when the scientists dig in their heels even this government does the right thing (late), that UK science (not under government guidance or leadership) has delivered vaccines and that the NHS has been too strong and wonderful an institution to allow us to die in even greater numbers. The bright spots in the pandemic are the areas where government has been unable to cock it up and where public service has remained the bedrock of how the system works despite this government’s incompetence.

As usual Swale, you're full of inaccuracies, to suit your agenda. The success of the vaccine procurement is almost entirely down to the government and not our scientists. The government set up a programme assessing 100s of different companies developing potential vaccines from March of last year. They settled on a choice of 7 different companies and put the orders and money in, to much criticism from many people, experts, politicians, etc, in this country. By unbelievable luck or more likely good judgement, 5 of these 7 are either in use or are shortly to be used in our vaccination programme. These vaccines are all amongst the first few to be rolled out, amongst the 100s that have either failed or are no where near roll out.

You've changed your tune as well, 'UK science has delivered the vaccine'? Unbelievable, those over 80s will be pissing themselves. Remember, the vaccines that we'll be using over next few months will be those ordered by this government, from a number of countries, not just the UK. On the subject of the UK Oxford vaccine, it was recently reported that the Oxford laboratory was on the brink of signing an agreement with a US drug firm, but the UK government persuaded them to go to the Swedes, fearing that the US company would only be interested in profit and would prevent the UK from getting first priority on the vaccines.

There will be many investigations into this pandemic, statistics worldwide don't add up and maybe one day there'll be some explanations as to why different countries had different figures. The UK's death toll is exceptionally high, when compared with many other countries in comparison to the case rate. I've analysed the figures of several European countries and the results that compared with the case rate, the UK's death rate is twice that of Germany and almost 3 times that of Sweden. The question is why?

[Andy_Faber]

As usual Swale, you're full of inaccuracies, to suit your agenda. The success of the vaccine procurement is almost entirely down to the government and not our scientists. The government set up a programme assessing 100s of different companies developing potential vaccines from March of last year. They settled on a choice of 7 different companies and put the orders and money in, to much criticism from many people, experts, politicians, etc, in this country. By unbelievable luck or more likely good judgement, 5 of these 7 are either in use or are shortly to be used in our vaccination programme. These vaccines are all amongst the first few to be rolled out, amongst the 100s that have either failed or are no where near roll out.

You've changed your tune as well, 'UK science has delivered the vaccine'? Unbelievable, those over 80s will be pissing themselves. Remember, the vaccines that we'll be using over next few months will be those ordered by this government, from a number of countries, not just the UK. On the subject of the UK Oxford vaccine, it was recently reported that the Oxford laboratory was on the brink of signing an agreement with a US drug firm, but the UK government persuaded them to go to the Swedes, fearing that the US company would only be interested in profit and would prevent the UK from getting first priority on the vaccines.

There will be many investigations into this pandemic, statistics worldwide don't add up and maybe one day there'll be some explanations as to why different countries had different figures. The UK's death toll is exceptionally high, when compared with many other countries in comparison to the case rate. I've analysed the figures of several European countries and the results that compared with the case rate, the UK's death rate is twice that of Germany and almost 3 times that of Sweden. The question is why?

agreed again Ram and yes I saw the info about the change in manufacturer