And in our neighbours

[TipperaryBaggie]

Brilliant!

[kettering_baggie]

There's got to be a joke about not comparing apples with pears in here somewhere......

Does anything compare with a nice pear?

[WBA123]

I too remember how the Serbs laughed at the threats of 'action' from the EU.

A few weeks ago a Remain supporting poster couldn't wait to post on how he had seen a piece on how much more efficient the EU were at procuring the vaccine than we were. Reckon he just repeated something he read that was anti Brexit and chucked it out there without much thought for its veracity. Oh wait! That's something only Brexiteers do after reading The Mail.

Meanwhile just checking who has administered most doses. The EU or my village hall.

Someone remind me who it might of been. And does the poster feel inclined to give us his update on how the UK has done v The EU on what is probably the most important issue right now.

Maybe we have a bit of missed communication here. My point was and still is the EU's buying power is far greater than ours. They have an economy 10x larger than ours and 8x the population. Do you refute that?

I'm also constantly perplexed by this 'us v them' attitude. You do understand that it is in our interests for our largest trading partner to have a population that is also be vaccinated as well, right?

Finally, as for efficiency it's clear throughout the whole pandemic the EU have been more efficient than us. Otherwise we wouldn't have the highest death toll in Europe or one of the highest death rates in the world. Our Government have got almost EVERYTHING wrong. From not taking it seriously to begin with, to late lockdowns, to not checking arrivals into the country, to mixed public messaging, to wearing face masks in public, to sending kids back to school for one day, to PPE, to track and trace and many others. Seriously, I wouldn't be banging the drum about our 'efficiency'.

But lets hope they have got it right with the vaccine, again I wouldn't shout too loudly until the end is in sight. Our Government have decided to vaccinate against the manufacturers advice of 2 weeks after the first jab - instead it has been 12 weeks afterwards, now reducing to 6. Why? I would imagine as I have said all along - they care more about PR and polls than they do about saving lives. So everyday when they tell you 5m or 6m or however many have been vaccinated against and it gives us all hope - great. I hope that's true. But from what I have read, there hasn't been much research into the efficacy of a delayed 2nd jab. Which means they are taking a bit of a gamble. Correct me if I am wrong, as I know you seem to enjoy..

[boingy]

It is us and them. They don’t give a stuff about us. When this is over please go and live in Europe. You can suck up to the EU but remember what the EU commissioner said “We don’t take our mandate from the people”

[wbaliquidator]

Ding Dong !
So the delay of second jab was advice by our scientists not based on any political narrative. There are arguments both ways but from what I’ve discovered and read I think the decision is correct. I’d rather trust Van-Tam an eminent Virologist and specialist in epidemiology than the governing body of GP’s. The efficacy for the P/Bio in Israel is showing excellent protection number first dose ( data 27th Jan) and the AZ always indicated the first dose had the most influence. Need to cut transmission as fast as=more doses given.

I’m not going to defend our government in hindsight they made lots of mistakes and will continue to do so. Let remember that there were many influential groups who were against lockdown like the Mayors of Manchester and Bham on both political divides. Many on here were questioning the Science of lockdown I recall. As for Boarders PHE advised against it saying in the scheme of things it was already too late. By the time China admitted the facts it has been estimated that there were over 1000! Outbreaks across the UK but little did we know. Stable door scenario.
But I must take issue with the EU
All these EU threats are a distraction and trying to deflect from their own inadequacies and jealousy they now have towards us.
So in late April early May the UK committed to purchase stocks of most of the main candidates for Vaccines. AZ said they would not make a profit from the initial rollout. P/Bio and Mod and other said they would and that was their choice.

In Typical fashion the EU eventually in August decided to order. Using their buying power chose to favour the P/Bio and ordered, although predictions were that the cost would be about 10 times more than the AZ vaccine. Also they chose to order a significant amount less of the AZ

By the end of December the UK and many other countries had authorised the main 3 vaccines and roll out began at pace in some countries with Israel leading the way.
The EU /EMA still has NOT approved the AZ ……!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maybe today? Lets hope so.

The EU is embarrassed that the UK is doing so well. If our figures were as low as theirs then they would be quiet on the subject but they are not.
So P/Bio announced they have reduced supply to EU by 61% that’s only 31M Doses and to be fair they did pay them over $400M up front. But I’ve not seen much acrimony towards their biggest supplier the US P/bio, NO they pick on the UK, Threaten our supplies AND THEY HAVE NOT EVEN AUTHORISED ITS USE ANYWAY !!

There is an US and THEM situation it’s been like this since we joined the EU. BUT it’s not individual government themselves it’s those Commission leaders those purists, a clique, dreamers but all powerful.
Jealousy

[WBA123]

It is us and them. They don’t give a stuff about us. When this is over please go and live in Europe. You can suck up to the EU but remember what the EU commissioner said “We don’t take our mandate from the people”

And that 'us v them' attitude is why this country will be poorer for at least the next generation and probably the one after that too. Well done. The EU is our largest customer, by some distance. And you are making them an enemy.

Out of interest, because presumably you know what you voted for, can you tell me when it will be 'over'? I presume when all of our trade deals around the world have been concluded and we've updated the deal with the EU to one that we're all happy with? What am I looking at - 10, 20, 50 years? As you know exactly what you have voted for it should be a straightforward question to answer.

Then I'll make an informed decision....Ta

[baggieal]

And that 'us v them' attitude is why this country will be poorer for at least the next generation and probably the one after that too. Well done. The EU is our largest customer, by some distance. And you are making them an enemy.

Out of interest, because presumably you know what you voted for, can you tell me when it will 'over'? I presume when all of our trade deals around the world have been concluded and we've updated the deal with the EU to one that we're all happy with? What am I looking at - 10, 20, 50 years? As you know exactly what you have voted for it should be a straightforward question to answer.

Then I'll make an informed decision....Ta

Our business is certainly poorer as very few in the EU want to order from UK businesses anymore with Import and Customs charges as goods have become too expensive + all the red tape and hoops! Sadly, on this one contention i was wrong and 123 was right!

Don't get me going on the virus with the UK having one of the worst death rates in the world due to the slowness of Boris and Co. Even now we can't leave the country but apart from red zone countries - anybody can still enter! Incredible! What's Boris done to plug immigration which was why many voted him in? Still those dinghies keep coming and coming......

[WBA123]

Our business is certainly poorer as very few in the EU want to order from UK businesses anymore with Import and Customs charges as goods have become too expensive + all the red tape and hoops! Sadly, on this one contention i was wrong and 123 was right!

Don't get me going on the virus with the UK having one of the worst death rates in the world due to the slowness of Boris and Co. Even now we can't leave the country but apart from red zone countries - anybody can still enter! Incredible! What's Boris done to plug immigration which was why many voted him in? Still those dinghies keep coming and coming......

I said a while ago, the result of the referendum will be that immigration from EU countries will decrease and from Non EU countries will increase.

Which is crazy for us financially, EU immigration benefits the country in tax receipts. Non EU immigration is the opposite.

[baggieal]

I said a while ago, the result of the referendum will be that immigration from EU countries will decrease and from Non EU countries will increase.

Which is crazy for us financially, EU immigration benefits the country in tax receipts. Non EU immigration is the opposite.

You did! Not many EU immigrants not working in this country as the Polish for example really are hard grafters. The problem is those who cross the channel from war torn countries who offer nothing albeit want aid and shelter. There was no differentiation about the two sets when many voted Brexit. An immigrant was an immigrant. The Brits are too lazy to pick all the fruit so thousands of Romanians do it!

Rather than paying for the Romanians to do it and hire planes - perhaps those coming over on dinghies can get off their backsides until cases are assessed. There's no such thing as a free lunch - but there is to many

[WBA123]

Ding Dong !
So the delay of second jab was advice by our scientists not based on any political narrative. There are arguments both ways but from what I’ve discovered and read I think the decision is correct. I’d rather trust Van-Tam an eminent Virologist and specialist in epidemiology than the governing body of GP’s. The efficacy for the P/Bio in Israel is showing excellent protection number first dose ( data 27th Jan) and the AZ always indicated the first dose had the most influence. Need to cut transmission as fast as=more doses given.

I’m not going to defend our government in hindsight they made lots of mistakes and will continue to do so. Let remember that there were many influential groups who were against lockdown like the Mayors of Manchester and Bham on both political divides. Many on here were questioning the Science of lockdown I recall. As for Boarders PHE advised against it saying in the scheme of things it was already too late. By the time China admitted the facts it has been estimated that there were over 1000! Outbreaks across the UK but little did we know. Stable door scenario.
But I must take issue with the EU
All these EU threats are a distraction and trying to deflect from their own inadequacies and jealousy they now have towards us.
So in late April early May the UK committed to purchase stocks of most of the main candidates for Vaccines. AZ said they would not make a profit from the initial rollout. P/Bio and Mod and other said they would and that was their choice.

In Typical fashion the EU eventually in August decided to order. Using their buying power chose to favour the P/Bio and ordered, although predictions were that the cost would be about 10 times more than the AZ vaccine. Also they chose to order a significant amount less of the AZ

By the end of December the UK and many other countries had authorised the main 3 vaccines and roll out began at pace in some countries with Israel leading the way.
The EU /EMA still has NOT approved the AZ ……!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! Maybe today? Lets hope so.

The EU is embarrassed that the UK is doing so well. If our figures were as low as theirs then they would be quiet on the subject but they are not.
So P/Bio announced they have reduced supply to EU by 61% that’s only 31M Doses and to be fair they did pay them over $400M up front. But I’ve not seen much acrimony towards their biggest supplier the US P/bio, NO they pick on the UK, Threaten our supplies AND THEY HAVE NOT EVEN AUTHORISED ITS USE ANYWAY !!

There is an US and THEM situation it’s been like this since we joined the EU. BUT it’s not individual government themselves it’s those Commission leaders those purists, a clique, dreamers but all powerful.
Jealousy

I work with a couple of Europeans and I was just talking to them about this AZ issue. They told me the way its being reported by the press in the EU is wildly different than here. In Germany, it is being reported as a contractual issue. In the UK, its a national dogfight between the UK and the EU.

The UK press are succeeding again in making this a nationalistic issue.

Will we ever learn our lesson do you think?