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Thread: Brighton Hove Albion - v - Leeds United ***Matchday Thread***

  1. #51
    Join Date
    Jul 2013
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    8,611
    Quote Originally Posted by hopelesslyoptimistic View Post
    The sad thing is that as teams evolve and progress sometimes some of the foundations that got them to that position are no longer good enough to allow the evolution to continue.

    From now for the next season or so there will be hard questions for a lot of players beyond Alioski

    Cooper
    Berardi
    Roberts
    Shackleton
    Gotts
    Mcalmont
    Costa
    Harrison
    Klich (if he doesn’t recover his mojo)

    Not slagging any of them off they are all great but they have got the club to the point where they may need to upgrade and is no poor reflection on them but more a testament to how far they brought us along the journey.

    Alioski when he plays well is a diamond but has days where he is so frustrating. He will rightly be fondly remembered for many a year when he moves on.
    Evolution my dear fellow.

  2. #52
    Quote Originally Posted by Billyni View Post
    Evolution my dear fellow.
    How very Darwinian young Holmes

  3. #53
    Join Date
    Oct 2010
    Posts
    1,282
    I really respect your veiws WTF but will differ on Alioski as I've watched the fellow play many times in matches and his style is unorthodox in whatever role he's played in or conditions he's endured pitch wise or hostile crowd wise.

    He lacks the element of composure in my opinion.Yep, others can lose,keep,regain or maintain their composure but they also appear to have the ability to stay calm (excepting Coopers rush of blood tackling) overall.

    He is a live wire for sure and very mouthy off the ball to linesmen and the opposition and sometimes loses valuable concentration because of it - yep,he winds up players but also they can wind him up to,I've often even seen him engage in ding-dongs with the opposition bench during the game when in progress.

    But he is one of the squad players that is a true family man and is not one of the regulars seen around Leeds city centre and the players always speak kindly of him according to my elder brother who mixes with them when over in town.Obviously his families strong Muslim Faith will be a major consideration to his next move one would assume.

    Whatever his next move I wish him and family well.

  4. #54
    Join Date
    Jan 2012
    Posts
    3,181
    Quote Originally Posted by WTF11 View Post
    Look back on the "conversations" we have had Pete, I "shot you down" (if that's how you look at it), for making it quite clear that ANY criticism of a player who wears the shirt is to be "discouraged" ("boils your pi55" if I remember rightly?), which in my view (and that of plenty of others) is simply nonesense. Players who don't perform when playing at any level of professional football should expect criticism if they don't meet expectations of the club and supporters. Same applies to any professional, in sport, finance, civil engineering, whatever.

    Alioski isn't perfect, and he certainly isn't the best left back in the PL, but neither is he the worst. He isn't blessed with the ability to be a Dallas (or a Madeley), not many players are, but I'd rather have 11 Alioskis than 11 Rodrigos (as a for instance). He has played out of position for the better part of two seasons and never (at least in public) bitched or complained, just got on with the job to the best of his ability, and from that unfamiliar position has contributed both assists and goals. I for one hope he stays at least for another year, but if he leaves at seasons end, then he goes with this supporters heartfelt best wishes.

    What I referred to by "selective support was your trenchant views expressed here when Cooper was (rightly IMHO) criticised, and the silence over the last few weeks when Alioski has come in for regular and (again IMHO) unjustified criticism. Even if we take away the justified/unjustified opinions, simple natural fairness seems to have gone out of the window with Alioski, and I for one don't understand why.
    Look,What boils my piss IS any player being criticised,Why?,Because this is the first season for all of our players at this level, correct me if i am wrong but we are comfortably mid table and have given EVERY team in this league on our day a game of football, been very exciting at times, been poor at times but in the main exciting, This is my only point, again my opinion, Certainly MB will be able to tell us who is good enough and who isnt for the premier league for next season he knows much more than all of us put together..

  5. #55
    Join Date
    May 2010
    Posts
    10,524
    Reality from that game was:

    No Raphinha, No Kalvin, No Rodrigo (unfit and not match sharp) and even no Costa.

    Starting that game short of all of those players was never going to yield a great result agains a team that plays with back 5, should probably have been a 0-0. Alioski did his usual idiocy and the game turned there.

    Move on and who cares was a weak team and we are safe, not going to judge the team on that just highlights maybe how we need more quality next season to make that next step and again pushed home the fact that we desperatley need someone who can fill in for Kalvin with any level of competency as none of our squad can currently, think we have lost 7 of 9 that he hasn't played.

  6. #56
    Join Date
    Jan 2003
    Posts
    15,986
    Spot on.

    We don't have effective cover for Phillips.

    He's not flashy, but he certainly gets the job done.

  7. #57
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    15,359
    Quote Originally Posted by joellufcprice View Post
    Reality from that game was:

    No Raphinha, No Kalvin, No Rodrigo (unfit and not match sharp) and even no Costa.

    Starting that game short of all of those players was never going to yield a great result agains a team that plays with back 5, should probably have been a 0-0. Alioski did his usual idiocy and the game turned there.

    Move on and who cares was a weak team and we are safe, not going to judge the team on that just highlights maybe how we need more quality next season to make that next step and again pushed home the fact that we desperatley need someone who can fill in for Kalvin with any level of competency as none of our squad can currently, think we have lost 7 of 9 that he hasn't played.
    And that's what I mean, the casual insult levelled at Alioski. At least Totty refers to Coopers "rush of blood" tackling, rather idiocy or being a clown etc (and which player has earned a red?).

  8. #58
    Join Date
    Nov 2011
    Posts
    15,359
    Quote Originally Posted by pete1967b View Post
    Look,What boils my piss IS any player being criticised,Why?,Because this is the first season for all of our players at this level, correct me if i am wrong but we are comfortably mid table and have given EVERY team in this league on our day a game of football, been very exciting at times, been poor at times but in the main exciting, This is my only point, again my opinion, Certainly MB will be able to tell us who is good enough and who isnt for the premier league for next season he knows much more than all of us put together..
    And there's the rub. At what point (in time, games played, any metric you want to choose) does it become legitimate/permissible to criticise a player?. Any by criticism, just so there's no confusion by what I mean, I'm not talking about name-calling (Clown, fool, idiot etc, the kind of things we ought to leave behind in the schoolyard), but about critique of skill, capability, effort, commitment when applied to what a player is supposed to be doing when playing for Leeds United (Players private lives are just that, private, and unless infringing on the law of the land, I don't give a flying f00k who they are diddling, as long as it doesn't interfere with their performance on the filed of play).

    It's neither possible, nor desirable (IMHO) to have a "cut-off" point, other than when the player signs on the dotted line. From that point on, their performance is subject to as much examination and criticism as a player who has been with the club forever and is now in their testimonial year (doesn't happen much nowadays!), by the club, pundits, supporters etc, nothing else is workable, or healthy.

    We probably won't agree, even though I suspect we (and others) want the same thing.

  9. #59
    Quote Originally Posted by WTF11 View Post
    And there's the rub. At what point (in time, games played, any metric you want to choose) does it become legitimate/permissible to criticise a player?. Any by criticism, just so there's no confusion by what I mean, I'm not talking about name-calling (Clown, fool, idiot etc, the kind of things we ought to leave behind in the schoolyard), but about critique of skill, capability, effort, commitment when applied to what a player is supposed to be doing when playing for Leeds United (Players private lives are just that, private, and unless infringing on the law of the land, I don't give a flying f00k who they are diddling, as long as it doesn't interfere with their performance on the filed of play).

    It's neither possible, nor desirable (IMHO) to have a "cut-off" point, other than when the player signs on the dotted line. From that point on, their performance is subject to as much examination and criticism as a player who has been with the club forever and is now in their testimonial year (doesn't happen much nowadays!), by the club, pundits, supporters etc, nothing else is workable, or healthy.

    We probably won't agree, even though I suspect we (and others) want the same thing.
    ]

    It is possible to both like Alioski but recognise he is more prone than other players to have days when he has moments of madness.

    When he messes up and gives away a needless penalty he is likely to get the odd comment.

    Cooper got similar when he got sent off.
    Last edited by hopelesslyoptimistic; 03-05-2021 at 07:47 PM.

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