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Thread: Your Summer Sporting Fix

  1. #21
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    Spoiler alert * British Lions * Spoiler alert for those who didn’t watch it live.............................................. .......................................

    What a second half performance. Brilliant stuff. More of the same please next week.

  2. #22
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    BMX. Great gold in the women's and ditto silver in the men's.

    Was the performance of Dutch lad Kimman to take the gold in the men's the performance of these games so far? I'll tell you why I think it is. He was involved in a crash (see video below) with an official on a training run 4 days ago. He fractured a knee cap in the crash. He still won gold. Absolutely amazing.


  3. #23
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    [QUOTE=MadAmster;39829929]BMX. Great gold in the women's and ditto silver in the men's.

    Was the performance of Dutch lad Kimman to take the gold in the men's the performance of these games so far? I'll tell you why I think it is. He was involved in a crash (see video below) with an official on a training run 4 days ago. He fractured a knee cap in the crash. He still won gold. Absolutely amazing.

    Huge respect to him, MA.
    Out of interest what is your opinion over Simone Biles’ withdrawal.
    Have to say I don’t share in the huge outpouring of sympathy. Sport is full of moments of stress, from taking a penalty in the Euros at Wembley to Kelle Roos being tormented by the South Stand each time he catches a cross cleanly.
    It’s tough and that’s why it’s so richly rewarded.
    People like Kimman and the athletes (and parents of athletes) who have made huge sacrifices to get where they are deserve all the plaudits going imo.
    Those who drop out as the going gets tough...perhaps not.

  4. #24
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    [QUOTE=ramAnag;39830008]
    Quote Originally Posted by MadAmster View Post
    BMX. Great gold in the women's and ditto silver in the men's.

    Was the performance of Dutch lad Kimman to take the gold in the men's the performance of these games so far? I'll tell you why I think it is. He was involved in a crash (see video below) with an official on a training run 4 days ago. He fractured a knee cap in the crash. He still won gold. Absolutely amazing.

    Huge respect to him, MA.
    Out of interest what is your opinion over Simone Biles’ withdrawal.
    Have to say I don’t share in the huge outpouring of sympathy. Sport is full of moments of stress, from taking a penalty in the Euros at Wembley to Kelle Roos being tormented by the South Stand each time he catches a cross cleanly.
    It’s tough and that’s why it’s so richly rewarded.
    People like Kimman and the athletes (and parents of athletes) who have made huge sacrifices to get where they are deserve all the plaudits going imo.
    Those who drop out as the going gets tough...perhaps not.
    I am one of those who have sympathy with Simone Biles. I understand your point rA and 20 odd years ago would, more than likely, have shared it.

    In today's "enlightened" climate, she has, as happens all too often with non-Caucasian sporters, as well as the plaudits she has justifiably received, she has, regrettably, been bombarded with racist and ***ist abuse. Unlike as appears to happen with footballers of colour, she has not only been abused when she lost, she has also been abused, probably by the same jodrells, when she has won.

    On top of that, it is pretty normal practice in the world of female gymnastics to have have the coaches abuse their pupils both mentally, verbally and physically. The 5h1t has recently hit the fan in Holland on this. Following multiple complaints from gymnasts both current and past, there was an investigation. The gymnasts were found to be correct. Several of the national squad coaches have already been suspended. Another, who is still under investigation is the coach of 2 of the NL gymnasts who also happen to be his daughters. He wasn't allowed to join them and coach them in Tokyo. Neither did well and 1 of them was a defending champion.

    You and I have no idea what goes on in these young ladies minds. The internal abuse from coaches and externally from anti social media must be horrendous. Biles was EXPECTED to win everything. Every loss would trigger utter bile (no pun intended) online. Bile to which nobody, whatever age or gender, should be exposed. Just because she is good at gymnastics, why should she have to be 100% immune to the hate? She shouldn't. She seems to have decided that she wasn't enjoying her gymnastics and that, added to the abuse and pressure, she wasn't in a state where she could do herself justice. She knows that failure would lead to more and harsher outpourings of hate. Outpourings she would not have suffered had she been white IMO.

    She's not the first. Osaka retired from Roland Garros and didn't enter Wimbledon as the hate was causing her mental health to suffer. I am certain you will have helped kids who were being abused at school and admonished the abusers. I know I have. Athletes have no "kind teacher" to admonish the bullies because the bullying is done anonymously in most cases. They have zero protection.

    Sporters have to be right in mind and body to perform optimally. If they're not "right" they won't be at their best. Another example is Dumoulin the Dutch cyclist. In the latter half of 2020, he stopped enjoying cycling. He finally came to the conclusion that the data related training regimes the team did were not designed for someone of his build/weight but for smaller/lighter cyclists and it was affecting his results. It took no account of his intuitive approach to training for HIM. In talks with the team he announced in January of this year that he was taking a break. In Jan/Feb he didn't touch a bike at all. March he went on a couple of rides with friends and got the enjoyment back. Trained in April by himself and, towards the end of the month, told the team he was ready to cycle again and wat he had in mind. The team said great. He went to Swizerland to train. His goal to get a medal in the Olympic time trial. He took silver.

    In short, we don't know what it takes to excel in sport. We are also not mental health experts. It is, IMO, not for us to judge Biles or Osaka or Dumoulin or any sporter who is having mental health problems. Just like neither of us like racism but have no idea what it's like to be racially abused......

    Just my opinion, not a criticism.

  5. #25
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    [QUOTE=MadAmster;39830071]
    Quote Originally Posted by ramAnag View Post

    I am one of those who have sympathy with Simone Biles. I understand your point rA and 20 odd years ago would, more than likely, have shared it.

    In today's "enlightened" climate, she has, as happens all too often with non-Caucasian sporters, as well as the plaudits she has justifiably received, she has, regrettably, been bombarded with racist and ***ist abuse. Unlike as appears to happen with footballers of colour, she has not only been abused when she lost, she has also been abused, probably by the same jodrells, when she has won.

    On top of that, it is pretty normal practice in the world of female gymnastics to have have the coaches abuse their pupils both mentally, verbally and physically. The 5h1t has recently hit the fan in Holland on this. Following multiple complaints from gymnasts both current and past, there was an investigation. The gymnasts were found to be correct. Several of the national squad coaches have already been suspended. Another, who is still under investigation is the coach of 2 of the NL gymnasts who also happen to be his daughters. He wasn't allowed to join them and coach them in Tokyo. Neither did well and 1 of them was a defending champion.

    You and I have no idea what goes on in these young ladies minds. The internal abuse from coaches and externally from anti social media must be horrendous. Biles was EXPECTED to win everything. Every loss would trigger utter bile (no pun intended) online. Bile to which nobody, whatever age or gender, should be exposed. Just because she is good at gymnastics, why should she have to be 100% immune to the hate? She shouldn't. She seems to have decided that she wasn't enjoying her gymnastics and that, added to the abuse and pressure, she wasn't in a state where she could do herself justice. She knows that failure would lead to more and harsher outpourings of hate. Outpourings she would not have suffered had she been white IMO.

    She's not the first. Osaka retired from Roland Garros and didn't enter Wimbledon as the hate was causing her mental health to suffer. I am certain you will have helped kids who were being abused at school and admonished the abusers. I know I have. Athletes have no "kind teacher" to admonish the bullies because the bullying is done anonymously in most cases. They have zero protection.

    Sporters have to be right in mind and body to perform optimally. If they're not "right" they won't be at their best. Another example is Dumoulin the Dutch cyclist. In the latter half of 2020, he stopped enjoying cycling. He finally came to the conclusion that the data related training regimes the team did were not designed for someone of his build/weight but for smaller/lighter cyclists and it was affecting his results. It took no account of his intuitive approach to training for HIM. In talks with the team he announced in January of this year that he was taking a break. In Jan/Feb he didn't touch a bike at all. March he went on a couple of rides with friends and got the enjoyment back. Trained in April by himself and, towards the end of the month, told the team he was ready to cycle again and wat he had in mind. The team said great. He went to Swizerland to train. His goal to get a medal in the Olympic time trial. He took silver.

    In short, we don't know what it takes to excel in sport. We are also not mental health experts. It is, IMO, not for us to judge Biles or Osaka or Dumoulin or any sporter who is having mental health problems. Just like neither of us like racism but have no idea what it's like to be racially abused......

    Just my opinion, not a criticism.
    Very fair points. Didn’t actually know about the racist and s exist abuse and, like you, I claim no expertise in the area of mental health.
    Superficially it seemed to me that she was walking away because she couldn’t handle the ‘stress’ of competition.
    To me such stress is nothing compared with losing a loved one, facing serious illness/injury, losing a job or even having to face another ‘Monday morning’ in a particularly challenging occupation such as policing, nursing and others.
    The ‘stress’ she faced seemed, to me, to be effectively ‘occupational’ and to claim that she wasn’t having ‘fun’ at the Olympics appeared a bit ‘drippy’ but I totally accept that we don’t know all the ins and outs and all your points about abuse and mental well being.

  6. #26
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    I imagine going into school on a Monday morning was pretty stressful too, rA?

    I always think that you need to walk a mile in someone else's shoes before concluding on the stress levels anyone is subject to in any walk of life. Its all too easy to think that such and such a person has an easy lifestyle, hugely well paid doing what they enjoy etc, but its never always quite how it sees from the outside.

    Take that Japanese tennis player - travelling the world, doing what she loves, making a mint..... on the fact of it, most people would give their right ******* for her career, but them fields aren't always greener...

  7. #27
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    .... and now we can add Ben Stokes to the list who is taking an "indefinite break" from cricket to sort out his mental well being.

  8. #28
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    Not directly related to sport but both my daughters, level headed girls, have made fairly big decisions for what they describe as 'the sake of their mental health' - my youngest for instance acquired a dog and quit a pretty lucrative sideline hobby for such a reason in the last six months. Its a phrase and a condition i've had to get used to as it was just totally absent from my younger days, maybe yours

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by MadAmster View Post
    .... and now we can add Ben Stokes to the list who is taking an "indefinite break" from cricket to sort out his mental well being.
    Hmmm...just in time for my trip to Trent Bridge next week.
    More seriously...it’s complex. What we used to call nervous breakdowns or depression now comes under the ‘umbrella’ of mental health and well-being.
    I wish all three of the high profile ‘athletes’ well, but can’t ignore the coincidence of their mental health issues coinciding with dips in form.
    Concentrating on Stokes - because I know nothing about tennis or gymnastics - he had his, partially self inflicted, problems two or three years ago and has done well to put those behind him. Beyond that there has been his father’s serious illness and ultimately his death, enormously difficult, but we all have to deal with that and the alternative is much worse.
    Then there are his injuries. Think I’m right in saying he bats left handed and bowls right handed. He has a right shoulder problem which has disrupted his bowling and the very badly broken finger on his left hand is going to impair both his batting and his slip fielding.
    Physical injury then has probably played a huge part in any mental health issues as he has to come to terms with, temporarily at least, not being one of the world’s top five all rounders.
    We have to be sympathetic, of course we do, but we also can’t, imo, throw the baby out with the bath water and encourage an ‘epidemic’ of mental health issues to replace fight and determination.
    It’s a relatively new concept in top level sport and doubtless the media exposure that top level athletes have to cope with has played a part, but I suspect the stress and anxiety experienced by sports stars is actually no greater than it is for many leading more mundane and ordinary lives. We all have to deal with the peaks and troughs of life...maybe the high profile sports superstars can just afford to verbalise and ‘give in’ to their feelings in a way which other mere mortals can’t.

  10. #30
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    Osaka said pre Paris thatwe wasn't going to speak to the press because their questions were too personal and invasive. She would have been OK if the questions were only aimed at the match she'd just played. They weren't and weren't going to be. She got fined for missing the PC after her 1st round win. Was threatened with disqualification if she did it again so she quit the tournament. She also missed Wimbledon for the same reason.

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