Callum Butcher

[Arabdownsouth]

100% ...

Hes not good enough IMO .. and while hes "only" been sent off 3 times this time around if we are being honest we all know it could easily be a lot more than that including in big games like Derby's .

He really could have cost the team big time on Saturday and aside from that ,and call me old fashioned if you will , but I find what he did on Saturday a pretty low act.

Kicking is part and parcel of football but to do that to someone , when they aren't ready for it , is about as cowardly a sit comes in my book .

He's only been sent off 3 times altogether, in his United career I said not just his current spell. Could easily be more? Same could be said about Scott Brown surely?

He's done plenty of good things in a United shirt and absolutely doesn't deserve the harsh criticism he's currently getting. Yeah he ****ed up on Saturday, but we got the points and we move on. Everyone loves a midfield hard man but then slate the guy for his disciplinary record. He stopped us getting rag dolled in midfield the way we were with the likes of Rabbitch and Barton in the middle. People have very short memories.

[shedka]

He's only been sent off 3 times altogether, in his United career I said not just his current spell. Could easily be more? Same could be said about Scott Brown surely?

He's done plenty of good things in a United shirt and absolutely doesn't deserve the harsh criticism he's currently getting. Yeah he ****ed up on Saturday, but we got the points and we move on. Everyone loves a midfield hard man but then slate the guy for his disciplinary record. He stopped us getting rag dolled in midfield the way we were with the likes of Rabbitch and Barton in the middle. People have very short memories.

Spot on, especially about short memories

The Butch is the man, has plenty fans who support him and are happy to have him at the club and as part of the squad and aren't using one moment of stupidity to have a good kick

[Yeats 62]

He's only been sent off 3 times altogether, in his United career I said not just his current spell. Could easily be more? Same could be said about Scott Brown surely?

He's done plenty of good things in a United shirt and absolutely doesn't deserve the harsh criticism he's currently getting. Yeah he ****ed up on Saturday, but we got the points and we move on. Everyone loves a midfield hard man but then slate the guy for his disciplinary record. He stopped us getting rag dolled in midfield the way we were with the likes of Rabbitch and Barton in the middle. People have very short memories.

Fair dooz ADS , but I would prefer that he got his bookings, or sending offs, for breaking up play, or nailing someone running the show. Co*k flicking should be left to the dressing room, preferably with a wet towel and not his fingers We also don't seem to be getting rag dolled these days even when he isn't playing.

There is defo still a place for him in the team/squad , but that sending off was needless and ridiculous. Now if any of our midfielders are injured he can't even come in for the Rossco match.

PS : totally agree with the Rabbitch Barton sentiments.

[Arabdownsouth]

Fair dooz ADS , but I would prefer that he got his bookings, or sending offs, for breaking up play, or nailing someone running the show. Co*k flicking should be left to the dressing room, preferably with a wet towel and not his fingers We also don't seem to be getting rag dolled these days even when he isn't playing.

There is defo still a place for him in the team/squad , but that sending off was needless and ridiculous. Now if any of our midfielders are injured he can't even come in for the Rossco match.

PS : totally agree with the Rabbitch Barton sentiments.

Yeah he got it wrong on Saturday and I'm as baffled as anyone as to what he was thinking. But my post is more in relation to the people writing him off as not good enough tbh. He definitely has a job still to do for us in my book.

[Arabdownsouth]

Spot on, especially about short memories

The Butch is the man, has plenty fans who support him and are happy to have him at the club and as part of the squad and aren't using one moment of stupidity to have a good kick

Good to hear ��

[Whitfieldarab]

Yes,It was a moment of madness but it could have been so costly for us.

Sending offs and multiple bookings aside he's just not a very good footballer. Fuchs does his job and more so no need for him to be in our starting line up unless we have injuries in central defence or at a push central midfield. Maybe if The Butch was a few inches taller he would have made a decent centre half and got more gam time in that position but he's a smallish centre half trying to be a midfielder and he's just not got the ability.

[stokearab]

I think the reason we are keeping ball better is more than just because Butcher is being kept out the team. One of the very worst at loosing the ball last season was Harkes, and in that respect he is a totally different player.

Just like some are saying Harkes is a better player because of those around him, there is no reason that Callum cant also be better should he get the chance to replace any of the 4 ahead of him.

The hoofball eye bleeding football we played just at the end under Neilson then under Mellon had a midfield of Butcher Harkes and Pawlett. Shankland was isolated and often we couldn't hold onto the ball long enough to create anything for him. And as Offshore will tell you there was no width!

I was one of the biggest critics of those 3 midfielders but a few things have changed.

TC is asking us to keep the passes from the back 4 shorter and he's asked all the players to stop playing the first ball and wait to play a higher percentage ball. As a result the midfielders are getting a bit more time on the ball. Harkes and Pawlett have both improved as a result. I didn't think TC could improve them but all credit because he has. But the jury's out on whether Butcher can raise his game in the same way, we've yet to find out.

Add to that another ball playing midfielder in Levitt and an outball in Niskanen and we're starting to see why we're getting better results and better performances. (We've probably seen more chances created this season than we did all year under MM)

Young coaches put a lot of emphasis on things like individual possession stats ie passes completed, but not just that, passes completed under pressure/creative passes/on the deck passes/passes made when ball received with back to goal etc and this is maybe harsh but you need to on the field to generate any stats.

[Chick A Saw]

The hoofball eye bleeding football we played just at the end under Neilson then under Mellon had a midfield of Butcher Harkes and Pawlett. Shankland was isolated and often we couldn't hold onto the ball long enough to create anything for him. And as Offshore will tell you there was no width!

I was one of the biggest critics of those 3 midfielders but a few things have changed.

TC is asking us to keep the passes from the back 4 shorter and he's asked all the players to stop playing the first ball and wait to play a higher percentage ball. As a result the midfielders are getting a bit more time on the ball. Harkes and Pawlett have both improved as a result. I didn't think TC could improve them but all credit because he has. But the jury's out on whether Butcher can raise his game in the same way, we've yet to find out.

Add to that another ball playing midfielder in Levitt and an outball in Niskanen and we're starting to see why we're getting better results and better performances. (We've probably seen more chances created this season than we did all year under MM)

Young coaches put a lot of emphasis on things like individual possession stats ie passes completed, but not just that, passes completed under pressure/creative passes/on the deck passes/passes made when ball received with back to goal etc and this is maybe harsh but you need to on the field to generate any stats.

Bud, i saw all the eye bleeding stuff, i moaned about the poor passing in midfield, and about the lack of out ball and width. I did however think that, despite him being a big factor in not just loosing the ball but blatantly giving it away, that Harkes best position was playing further forward, just like i thought with Sam Stanton. Thankfully it looks to me like having the defensive base we have built is allowing Harkes to get further forward and become our consistently best midfielder. While better players when on their game, Levitt and Fuchs seem to be struggling with injury lately, and have had a couple of really bad games.

The time on the ball thing, i think Edwards, Mulgrew and Levitt/Fuchs/Glass are the ones who are getting more time, but that allows the more attack minded to get into positions where quick passing and movement is creating the chances.

Cant remember exactly what TTT said, but its along the lines that there are games where Butcher should get his place, and v Aberdeen in my mind was one of them, but he did what he did. And while i would think that most peoples first choice of midfield is Levitt, Fuchs, Harkes, 2 of these are struggling to make Saturday, so who comes in with Butcher out as well? Say that Levitt and Fuchs dont make it for Well on Tuesday, its back to Butcher, unless of course its a 2 game ban he is on?

No way am i trying to say Butcher is our best, but he is here and deserves to get a proper chance to see if he can improve, and stop ticklin baws!

[GUNBOAT]

[QUOTE=Chick A Saw;3991

No way am i trying to say Butcher is our best, but he is here and deserves to get a proper chance to see if he can improve, and stop ticklin baws! [/QUOTE]


Well he is not gonna get his chance in the immediate future because i think its a two game ban for violent conduct.It is true he got out of jail on Saturday but we may well ship points we should have won in our next two games due to injuries and his needless suspension.

[shedka]

No but thankfully back available a week on Sunday vs Celtic

A 3 game week with two very difficult away games over tomorrow and Tues, already been picking up injuries so may well need him by then

Hope Sporle is in contention soon too, even from the bench offers something different