O/T:- Vaccines: Pro/Anti & Conspiracy Theories [Originally Covid Pass and Meadow Ln.]

[Maggie's Farm]

I think it's most likely a number of different groups trying to seize the opportunity for a near global sized power grab, be it financial, political or 'ethical'. It's not just extremely wealthy or influential people driving this along. it's average people who think it will bring about a political utopia or a reverse to climate change or an end to all illness and human suffering etc. One group will eventually come to dominate but probably not until we've gone to war over it.

ok, food for thought, thanks. Just to be clear, what are you hearing these groups are doing to sieze this opportunity? Pushing vaccines that have bad side effects or long term issues or are pointless? Sowing confusion and dividing opinion?

[Maggie's Farm]

If we're talking poetry therapy for these testing times, also try Wendell Berry:

The Peace of Wild Things

When despair for the world grows in me
and I wake in the night at the least sound
in fear of what my life and my children’s lives may be,
I go and lie down where the wood drake
rests in his beauty on the water, and the great heron feeds.
I come into the peace of wild things
who do not tax their lives with forethought
of grief. I come into the presence of still water.
And I feel above me the day-blind stars
waiting with their light. For a time
I rest in the grace of the world, and am free.

[lunaspie]

It's time to dispense some more cracker-barrel philosophy from the stoop :

'Never wrestle with a pig - you both get dirty and the pig enjoys it.'

[upthemaggies]

ok, food for thought, thanks. Just to be clear, what are you hearing these groups are doing to sieze this opportunity? Pushing vaccines that have bad side effects or long term issues or are pointless? Sowing confusion and dividing opinion?

The global population is currently 7.9 billion. Average age of that global population is just under 30.

If we accept recourses are dwindling and we believe climate change is going to have at least some additional impact on those resources, it's clear what the biggest problem is going to be - if it isn't the biggest problem already.

This doesn't however mean the whole world is going to come together to solve the problem, it's going to suit China and Russia for example if the west effectively commits suicide. Basically, "You want to reduce the population? you go first then."

The virus and the vaccines are two sides of the same coin and that's going to become the ultimate currency for power in a bio-tech age.

You can adapt vaccines or a virus to target a specific race or age group with a random variety of mortality issues (heart, liver, brain, tumours) over random periods of time to give you plausibility denial. You could be looking to wipe out sections of your own population or an enemy population. Who creates the most effective vaccines adapted in the shortest possible time with a swift roll out is going to be one step ahead of that game. Ditto a man-made virus.

How you bring this all of this into focus with an obvious objective. I don't think we can, too many big players with their own interests against a backdrop of chaos, such is the nature of the universe, You'll have collusion and unlikely alliances all over the place. One thing we can be sure about is that most people are going to suffer as always and a small percentage are going have a good time no matter what.

[Maggie's Farm]

The global population is currently 7.9 billion. Average age of that global population is just under 30.

If we accept recourses are dwindling and we believe climate change is going to have at least some additional impact on those resources, it's clear what the biggest problem is going to be - if it isn't the biggest problem already.

hi utm, bit uphill to xmas here, but getting back...

it's not clear to me what point you're trying to make here. I'm aware of a severe global disparity of resources, but most everyone I see IRL is already fat and still stuffing themselves with food and drink and tesla. What is the biggest problem going to be? Are you referring to food shortages?

You can adapt vaccines or a virus to target a specific race or age group with a random variety of mortality issues (heart, liver, brain, tumours) over random periods of time to give you plausibility denial. You could be looking to wipe out sections of your own population or an enemy population. Who creates the most effective vaccines adapted in the shortest possible time with a swift roll out is going to be one step ahead of that game. Ditto a man-made virus.

I guess someone could, and after Iraqui WMDs, the 2016 US election, Cambridge Analytica, and all, it should be clear to everyone that there are people who are willing and capable of gaming the system on a big scale, but this sounds extremely James Bond to me.

I don't know how to know that **** isn't happening, but I haven't seen anything that's convinced me it is - and I think the burden of proof is on the people who say something nefarious is underway. I don't find the efforts and, to date, inability of the world to get this problem under control as evidence of a plot, more the opposite. occam's razor springs to mind.

How you bring this all of this into focus with an obvious objective. I don't think we can

agree. which makes me think there isn't a focus. William of Ockham: "It's 'just' a viral pandemic!" (although I do think the definitive c19 origins story has yet to be written)

One thing we can be sure about is that most people are going to suffer as always and a small percentage are going have a good time no matter what.

pain is inevitable, suffering is optional, as they say. No, totally agree with this, but it has ever been thus.

Does the existence of downtrodden masses prove there's a deliberate hand(s) in this pandemic?

[BigFatPie]

Back in the real world, here’s a really interesting thread on what the early data says about omicron. Headline, it does, for various suggested reasons, look milder than delta.

https://twitter.com/jburnmurdoch/sta...425581069?s=21

[upthemaggies]

hi utm, bit uphill to xmas here, but getting back...

it's not clear to me what point you're trying to make here. I'm aware of a severe global disparity of resources, but most everyone I see IRL is already fat and still stuffing themselves with food and drink and tesla. What is the biggest problem going to be? Are you referring to food shortages?



I guess someone could, and after Iraqui WMDs, the 2016 US election, Cambridge Analytica, and all, it should be clear to everyone that there are people who are willing and capable of gaming the system on a big scale, but this sounds extremely James Bond to me.

I don't know how to know that **** isn't happening, but I haven't seen anything that's convinced me it is - and I think the burden of proof is on the people who say something nefarious is underway. I don't find the efforts and, to date, inability of the world to get this problem under control as evidence of a plot, more the opposite. occam's razor springs to mind.



agree. which makes me think there isn't a focus. William of Ockham: "It's 'just' a viral pandemic!" (although I do think the definitive c19 origins story has yet to be written)



pain is inevitable, suffering is optional, as they say. No, totally agree with this, but it has ever been thus.

Does the existence of downtrodden masses prove there's a deliberate hand(s) in this pandemic?

The ability to manufacture a virus by manipulating DNA with little expertise and relatively inexpensive equipment is exponential.
Think how cheap it now is to get your ancestry tested in this way compared to 10/15/20 years ago.

I don't know whether or how much to believe climate change predictions, but governments seem to be taking this very seriously. We can't pretend population growth isn't at least going to ramp up the pressure on food supplies, energy consumption and migration (concentrating the pressure on certain areas). Add climate change to that, then you're going to have a real problem trying to sustain the population which is increasing at a crazy rate.

Conspiracy theories tend to be a story about a set of characters doing this that or the other to work towards a conclusion, but unless it's an all nuclear war scenario then there cannot be a conclusion, it's an ever unfolding development with unforeseen consequences, so I couldn't commit to "I think this or that is going to happen for this reason" or the idea that all world leaders could agree to one ultimate objective that suits the interests of all.

Depopulation has to be on a lot of people's minds, especially those running the show or the most privileged, I guess that is my point. Could be that there's some sort of collective subconscious realisation that this is what we have to do to survive, hence self-hating westerners not having kids whilst destroying their own culture and now something being done in the name of health which will actually achieve the opposite.

I'm mostly thinking aloud here and I know it is a bit vague, but I'm just trying my best to try and work out what the hell is going on rather than to shrug it all off pretending that these **** in charge really do care about me and my family.

[bule1]

https://www.bbc.co.uk/sport/football/59774778

Sorry but they are their own worst enemies. To the conspiracy theorists, I say if they cannot sort parking around the old Broadmarsh area out without a krypton factor style task, how do you think "those in control" can contirve somethin as complex as this?