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Thread: The Wokeness Thread

  1. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramAnag View Post
    No idea why my Haydon Roberts post has been moved here...however I’m perfectly happy to be regarded as having a social conscience and a sense of social justice. Always have had...if that makes me ‘woke’ then so be it, but I don’t recall waking.
    Maybe it’s just a combination of common sense and the way I was brought up...for which I remain immensely grateful.

    There are aspects of modern life that I disagree with...I, generally, don’t believe in ‘positive discrimination’, I don’t believe that veganism is next to Godliness (whatever that is), I don’t believe that being homo***ual makes people particularly ‘cool’, but neither do I feel remotely threatened by those who do and that seems to be the difference.

    I also couldn’t miss the irony identified in Swales’ final sentence (#17). Andy, after all you’ve chucked at me (and Swale) recently you really do need to give yourself a good talking to.

    P.S. Just noticed that this thread has allegedly been started by me. It certainly wasn’t Mr. Moderator...indeed my only observation was that I couldn’t understand why the ‘New Signings’ thread had been taken over by ‘woke’ comments. Clearly ‘The Wokeness Thread’ has been started (twice) by no one other than yourself so please use your privilege to clarify that and remove my name from the thread.
    I’ll sort the above out when I get home rA, I think you’ll find that any comments which had both footy and O/T comments were copied rather than moved but I’ll stand corrrcted

  2. #22
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    The great irony of all these woke targets (to use a probably wrong phrase) is that by recognising the rights of (a) you often have to take away the rights of another group (b). Example: Recognition of trans MtoF rights to assert their chosen gender often creates a problem for women - in terms of their non acceptance of the new members of their gender in refuges, sports or simply toilets in clubs.

    It sort of sems to me that hetero***ual women are the group most negatively impacted by woke culture. eg a woman finally escapes from abusive relationship with man, gets place in refuge only to find she is sharing that refuge by someone who is (at least birth biologically) in her eyes male. That cannot be good

  3. #23
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    Look no further than the witch hunt of JK Rowling, for daring to not pamper to the rabid obssession of these loons.
    For daring to claim that a woman is a term to describe a female, not a person who "menstrates".
    You couldn't make this **** up, you really couldn't.
    What does she get for her opinion? abuse/ calls for her head/cancellation/outcast
    Its beyond ridiculous and actually the worst of misogyny going.
    For daring to seperate a biological female from a trans.

    https://www.dailysignal.com/2020/06/...y-of-the-woke/

    Bonkers

  4. #24
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    Hmmm...but, as Swale has already suggested, all you two are doing is referring to the extremes and they’re indicative of nothing.
    Of course there will be issues and of course there will be individuals who overreact but, by and large, if being ‘woke’ equates to having a social conscience, an ability to empathise and a desire for social justice...then count me unashamedly in.

  5. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Andy_Faber View Post
    I’ll sort the above out when I get home rA, I think you’ll find that any comments which had both footy and O/T comments were copied rather than moved but I’ll stand corrrcted
    My comment was entirely about football, AF. It was the source of GP’s ‘Brighton based joke’ which had nothing to do with me.
    The fact that my ‘New signings’ observation was in some way the beginning of comments about ‘woke’ has been entirely down to GP and yourself.

  6. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramAnag View Post
    My comment was entirely about football, AF. It was the source of GP’s ‘Brighton based joke’ which had nothing to do with me.
    The fact that my ‘New signings’ observation was in some way the beginning of comments about ‘woke’ has been entirely down to GP and yourself.
    Oh yes it did rA, you know you provoked me! My comment was not woke, some might say the opposite. So let us all hold our hands up, deny original authorship and blame it on, umm DCFCA - the universal scapegoat!

    PS how long before we need a minister for drought amongst this heatwave?

  7. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geoff Parkstone View Post
    The great irony of all these woke targets (to use a probably wrong phrase) is that by recognising the rights of (a) you often have to take away the rights of another group (b). Example: Recognition of trans MtoF rights to assert their chosen gender often creates a problem for women - in terms of their non acceptance of the new members of their gender in refuges, sports or simply toilets in clubs.

    It sort of sems to me that hetero***ual women are the group most negatively impacted by woke culture. eg a woman finally escapes from abusive relationship with man, gets place in refuge only to find she is sharing that refuge by someone who is (at least birth biologically) in her eyes male. That cannot be good
    Right lets just step back and think about this a minute.

    Yes "woke" targets is the wrong phrase - not every person who campaigns for change is doing it because they are "woke", it might be convenient for a Tory party weak on actual government to lump these things together as woke lefty ideology, but for an person capable of sentient thought its clear that this is complicated and that pretending that the reality does not exist is not a way of managing it.

    Transgender is a specific issue thats a hot topic right now and its a complicated subject, it needs proper adult debate and consideration of what is required to accommodate those who are genuinely suffering from gender issues.

    Its not "woke" culture that is threatening heters exual women. There isno such thing as woke culture for a start, its an aggressive pressure group not being challenged enough by those in authority, that happens a lot in many areas of human activity.

    Its wrong to think that because weight is given to a section of the population that this means you take away the rights of another group - yes there may have to be compromise, after all if there are for example 100 places each year for Cambridge university and previously these all went to public school educated students. Widening the admission to include those from state school is inevitably going to mean that less public school students will get in.

    The same can equally be said about non "woke" pressure - as in the banning of abortion - impacts negatively on women, the refusal to control guns, impacts negatively on all those who ahve been killed by guns.

    The reality is that any change in law, or behaviour or rules etc. can have an impact, that can be negative and it can be pushed on society by single interest pressure groups from across the political spectrum. That has nothing to do with being woke, which on the whole is about fairness, justice and avoiding discrimination wherever possible.

  8. #28
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    Quote Originally Posted by swaledale View Post
    Right lets just step back and think about this a minute.

    Yes "woke" targets is the wrong phrase - not every person who campaigns for change is doing it because they are "woke", it might be convenient for a Tory party weak on actual government to lump these things together as woke lefty ideology, but for an person capable of sentient thought its clear that this is complicated and that pretending that the reality does not exist is not a way of managing it.

    Transgender is a specific issue thats a hot topic right now and its a complicated subject, it needs proper adult debate and consideration of what is required to accommodate those who are genuinely suffering from gender issues.

    Its not "woke" culture that is threatening heters exual women. There isno such thing as woke culture for a start, its an aggressive pressure group not being challenged enough by those in authority, that happens a lot in many areas of human activity.

    Its wrong to think that because weight is given to a section of the population that this means you take away the rights of another group - yes there may have to be compromise, after all if there are for example 100 places each year for Cambridge university and previously these all went to public school educated students. Widening the admission to include those from state school is inevitably going to mean that less public school students will get in.

    The same can equally be said about non "woke" pressure - as in the banning of abortion - impacts negatively on women, the refusal to control guns, impacts negatively on all those who ahve been killed by guns.

    The reality is that any change in law, or behaviour or rules etc. can have an impact, that can be negative and it can be pushed on society by single interest pressure groups from across the political spectrum. That has nothing to do with being woke, which on the whole is about fairness, justice and avoiding discrimination wherever possible.
    Agree with all that.

    Thanks for the ‘action’, AF. It’s all yours.

  9. #29
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramAnag View Post
    I’m puzzled by this term ‘woke’ or ‘overwoking’. Perhaps those, basically Tricky and Andy, who seem slightly obsessed with it it could explain...what does it actually mean?
    From what I can gather it seems to imply having a social conscience and challenging the idea that it is wrong that certain sections of society should be oppressed in some way.
    If that is the case though, why do they seem to always use the term ‘woke’ in a pejorative sense? I mean aren’t the possession of a social conscience and a sense of social justice good and admirable qualities?
    The term woke, as defined elsewhere here and on more trusted places on the internet, original meant roughly as you suggest, and nowt wrong with people who are 'woke' in that manner. Just nice, kind, thoughtful folk youmight say

    However, the term was initially hijacked by those who combined their view on social justice with an uncompromising, often unpleasant and mob mentalty response to anyone with a different view. As a response to that, the term was gradually takenover by those who DID have a different view, be it considered, extreme or nuanced and has developed from a complimentary to derogatory term. The majority of 'woke' ideology comes from what you would call 'the left'. The equivalent from the right is just referred to I guess as 'extremist'

    The phrase 'overwoking' was invented by me just for Swales' benefit - despite his protestations to the contrary his wokeness let him down when he assumed, and made an issue of, a comment about crossdressing. His repeated and lengthy attempts to clarify show his sensitivity to being rumbled but in other settings (ie facebook/twitter) there could have been a cast of thousands of 'the Woke' baying for blood of the O/P of the comment.
    Last edited by Andy_Faber; 12-07-2022 at 09:20 PM.

  10. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by ramAnag View Post
    Agree with all that.

    Thanks for the ‘action’, AF. It’s all yours.
    Apologies for the initial balls up, nothing personal

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