Tims And They Banners The Other Night.

[islaydarkblue]

Seems pretty damning to me Islay. We just have no effective oversight of anything that holyrood does. Local opinion is constsntly over ruled in planning matters and the Conservative, Labour and Lib Dem MSP's who actually represent more Scots just seem unable to work to gether to show up the failings. I suppose in part it will be because they were part of the committees who approved the decisions. Maybe a different way of reporting the committee decisions could highlight how the SNP and Greens simply steamroller their views. Perhaps full voting figures are available? Be ironic if the other parties actually agreed with the decisions taken! Maybe it's not just a simple case of SNP incompetence and more a failure of Holyrood.

As far as I am aware the Holyrood committees have a built in majority for the SNP and the Greens who will vote on party lines even if it is a poor deal for the Scottish people.
The stupid Greens MSPs led by Wee Pat have stopped the improvements to the trunk road network throughout Scotland because Wee Pat wants everyone to cycle everywhere like him.
Wee Pat is another MSP who is only interested in the Glasgow and Edinburgh area of Scotland and he could not give a toss about any other part of Scotland.
Meanwhile the Transport Scotland bosses who arranged for 40mph stickers to stuck on every 50 mph road sign on the A90 Kingsway from just before the underpass for the Crematorium roundabout all the way to the Swallow roundabout for the Queen’s hearse journey have forgotten to remove these 40 mph stickers.
Sadly this is par for the course as far as the incompetent bosses at Transport Scotland are concerned.

[islaydarkblue]

Seems pretty damning to me Islay. We just have no effective oversight of anything that holyrood does. Local opinion is constsntly over ruled in planning matters and the Conservative, Labour and Lib Dem MSP's who actually represent more Scots just seem unable to work to gether to show up the failings. I suppose in part it will be because they were part of the committees who approved the decisions. Maybe a different way of reporting the committee decisions could highlight how the SNP and Greens simply steamroller their views. Perhaps full voting figures are available? Be ironic if the other parties actually agreed with the decisions taken! Maybe it's not just a simple case of SNP incompetence and more a failure of Holyrood.

There is simple solution.
Before every local Government and Scottish Government election the Conservative, Labour and Lib Dems leaders should get together and arrange for one candidate who is most likely to win the seat to stand on a Unionist ticket and go ‘head to head’ against the SNP candidate. The Greens are too lazy to put up candidates in the first past the post part of the Scottish Government elections whilst they are a waste of space as a local authority candidate as they are anti business.
The same procedure would have to take place in the U.K. Government election where one candidate representing the pro union parties would stand in each constituency against the SNP candidate.
That would soon get rid of the SNP candidates whereas at present the Unionist vote is split amongst the Conservative, Labour and Lib Dem
candidates throughout Scotland while the pro independence supporters voting for the SNP candidates.

[Deeranged]

There is simple solution.
Before every local Government and Scottish Government election the Conservative, Labour and Lib Dems leaders should get together and arrange for one candidate who is most likely to win the seat to stand on a Unionist ticket and go ‘head to head’ against the SNP candidate. The Greens are too lazy to put up candidates in the first past the post part of the Scottish Government elections whilst they are a waste of space as a local authority candidate as they are anti business.
The same procedure would have to take place in the U.K. Government election where one candidate representing the pro union parties would stand in each constituency against the SNP candidate.
That would soon get rid of the SNP candidates whereas at present the Unionist vote is split amongst the Conservative, Labour and Lib Dem
candidates throughout Scotland while the pro independence supporters voting for the SNP candidates.

You really are just a Nazi aren't you? Overthrow democracy at any cost.

[BCram]

You really are just a Nazi aren't you? Overthrow democracy at any cost.

Now now Deeranged. Play nice! I thought Islay was trying to explain how democracy could deliver a non SNP government.Remember in most elections those who vote for staying in the union out number those who vote for independence.

[Deeranged]

Now now Deeranged. Play nice! I thought Islay was trying to explain how democracy could deliver a non SNP government.Remember in most elections those who vote for staying in the union out number those who vote for independence.

However, reducing choice is not really democratic. It would result in governmental carnage if it came off with three or four political phillosphies vying for superiority and three or four parties fighting for control, each claiming they had more of their supporters voting for 'the alliance' than any of the others. Just like like pro union supporters always claim more of them voted at every election than pro independence supporters - despite the fact that many Labour and Liberal supporters are also pro independence but just don't vote SNP.

But hey, if it gets rid of the party that draws more votes than any other party at every election in Scotland it's fair right?

[BCram]

However, reducing choice is not really democratic. It would result in governmental carnage if it came off with three or four political phillosphies vying for superiority and three or four parties fighting for control, each claiming they had more of their supporters voting for 'the alliance' than any of the others. Just like like pro union supporters always claim more of them voted at every election than pro independence supporters - despite the fact that many Labour and Liberal supporters are also pro independence but just don't vote SNP.

But hey, if it gets rid of the party that draws more votes than any other party at every election in Scotland it's fair right?

I thought the voting system for Holyrood was designed to prevent Labour from running the country in perpetuity. Turns out when the Tartan Tories had eaten up the Conservative vote they then turned to the left under the brilliant leadership of Alec Salmond and we are now faced with a totalitarian state run by the SNP with a little help from the Greens. No effective opposition despite as you confirm more people vote for Unionist supporting parties than independence supporting ones. The indyref showed that when there was a choice between the union or independence the country split 45% to 55%. Some SNP supporters must have voted NO because they were Labour voters who disliked the possibility of a Conservative MSP more than being represented by a left wing SNP MSP or Lib Dems who didn't want either Labour of Conservatives.

[Deeranged]

The indyref showed that when there was a choice between the union or independence the country split 45% to 55%.

That was more than a generation ago and the lies spun by UK Labour and Conservative politicians at the time have been exposed and the Tories have taken us out of the EU aagainst a clear majority of the wishes of the people of Scotland. I don't believe an equivalent referendum would produce the same result today as it did over a generation ago.

[BCram]

My definition of a generation is basically the legal age for a girl to have a baby. 16years. 2030 seems an appropriate year.

[Deebunked]

That was more than a generation ago and the lies spun by UK Labour and Conservative politicians at the time have been exposed and the Tories have taken us out of the EU aagainst a clear majority of the wishes of the people of Scotland. I don't believe an equivalent referendum would produce the same result today as it did over a generation ago.

More than a generation ago? Are you sure?

Here's a sensible article on that topic for you

https://isogg.org/wiki/How_long_is_a...ides_an_answer

Nobody suggests 8 years as a generation and the only reason to have one now is the SNP and their cabal know the Tories will be out soon, which would reduce then protest vote.

[Deeranged]

My definition of a generation is basically the legal age for a girl to have a baby. 16years. 2030 seems an appropriate year.

Mine's a bit different.

'All of the people born and living at about the same time' or ' all the people of about the same age within a society or within a particular family'. The word 'about' says quite implicitly that it is not set as a hard and fast rule.

There is no definition of generation that includes a specific period of time, rather it refers to the people existing at a single point in time. However it is normal, although definitely not correct, to assume a span of time of the order of the time it takes for a person to be born until they produce offspring - that time varies between individuals and can be anything from around 12 / 13 years to over 60 years so generation can't possibly be defined by that measure.

Couple of points, firstly there is no actual legal age for a girl to have a baby, the legal age of ***ual consent is 16 but that's only a societal norm not a biological imperative so is a different thing entirely. If a girl should get pupped at 13, even by a 12 year old boy, she has the legal right to have that baby whether society thinks she should or not. Secondly if the 'legal age' for a girl to have a baby changes, to 20 for example (I think it's 20 in China due to their population control laws), does your definition of a generation change?

Is the length of a generation different in China from the length of a generation in Scotland? What about Austria where the legal age of consent is 14? Is the definition of a generation different there?