McClean whinging again.

[Grist_To_The_Mill]

Oh, for the good old days to return.

If only, for a day.

" any last requests?"

Yes, did I tell you I'm a vegan

[Redshank]

Yes, I do agree with his actions, because I value free speech.

I have a huge admiration and respect for those people who died for our freedoms.

We live in a country where I am allowed to say that I don't believe in god, or that I don't support the monarchy.

I'm also acutely aware that many of the people that died for this country will have disagreed with me on those things.

The reality is, thanks in great part to many of those people, I do enjoy that free speech - statements which in the past I could have been given the death penalty for in this country, and still could be in others.

That's the whole point of free speech, the thing I value about it, is it applies to everyone.

I'm quite happy to be strongly disagreed with when I say these things. That's free speech too. I don't come here expressing my views and getting upset when people oppose them.

I just think it would be very sad for our country if people felt uncomfortable saying things not because people were going to disagree with them (which is fine), but rather because they knew they were going to be subjected to abuse.

So, in summary, I think those who dish out such abuse are actually doing a disservice to those who died for our freedom.

In a way, by saying what he believes, McClean is doing more to honour the sacrifice that those have made for this country than those who would gladly have opposing views to theirs subjected to so much abuse that people don't feel comfortable expressing them.

Excellent post.
Can't disagree with any of that.

[LittleSquirt]

McLeans problem is not that he doesn't go along with all these things, poppies, queen etc, but that he actively makes a meal out of not doing so. He could just not do something, but he has to make a song and dance about it. And that's when it turns from quietly declining to join in with what others are doing, to making it known he isn't and turning it into a protest. And then he moans when he gets abused for actively making it known he is not joining in.

Yes we get why you don't wear poppy, but there is a difference between just not wearing one and making a point of telling the whole world that you aren't. People might except it more if he didn't make a song and dance over it. If he quietly respected those that do, people might respect why he doesn't.

[Brin]

McLeans problem is not that he doesn't go along with all these things, poppies, queen etc, but that he actively makes a meal out of not doing so. He could just not do something, but he has to make a song and dance about it. And that's when it turns from quietly declining to join in with what others are doing, to making it known he isn't and turning it into a protest. And then he moans when he gets abused for actively making it known he is not joining in.

Yes we get why you don't wear poppy, but there is a difference between just not wearing one and making a point of telling the whole world that you aren't. People might except it more if he didn't make a song and dance over it. If he quietly respected those that do, people might respect why he doesn't.

LittleSquirt, very valid points you make there. Thing is he's the type never to try that because he wouldn't be getting his 15 minutes of annual fame.

[John2]

McLeans problem is not that he doesn't go along with all these things, poppies, queen etc, but that he actively makes a meal out of not doing so. He could just not do something, but he has to make a song and dance about it. And that's when it turns from quietly declining to join in with what others are doing, to making it known he isn't and turning it into a protest. And then he moans when he gets abused for actively making it known he is not joining in.

Yes we get why you don't wear poppy, but there is a difference between just not wearing one and making a point of telling the whole world that you aren't. People might except it more if he didn't make a song and dance over it. If he quietly respected those that do, people might respect why he doesn't.

Sorry, but you've completely missed the point.

You're saying he shouldn't protest if he doesn't want abuse.

In a free society, why shouldn't he feel comfortable protesting if that's what he wants to say?

That's not free speech.

There is a big distinction between being disagreed with, and being subjected to abuse.

People who don't really care about that distinction are at risk of turning us into the sort of country that the people who fought for this country were fighting against.

[Stovicmiller]

He should **** off back to Ireland and earn his living there , but he won’t do that.

[Lolmorgan]

Yes, I do agree with his actions, because I value free speech.

I have a huge admiration and respect for those people who died for our freedoms.

We live in a country where I am allowed to say that I don't believe in god, or that I don't support the monarchy.

I'm also acutely aware that many of the people that died for this country will have disagreed with me on those things.

The reality is, thanks in great part to many of those people, I do enjoy that free speech - statements which in the past I could have been given the death penalty for in this country, and still could be in others.

That's the whole point of free speech, the thing I value about it, is it applies to everyone.

I'm quite happy to be strongly disagreed with when I say these things. That's free speech too. I don't come here expressing my views and getting upset when people oppose them.

I just think it would be very sad for our country if people felt uncomfortable saying things not because people were going to disagree with them (which is fine), but rather because they knew they were going to be subjected to abuse.

So, in summary, I think those who dish out such abuse are actually doing a disservice to those who died for our freedom.

In a way, by saying what he believes, McClean is doing more to honour the sacrifice that those have made for this country than those who would gladly have opposing views to theirs subjected to so much abuse that people don't feel comfortable expressing them.

John2 come back later tonight & give us your opinion on the Rotherham game. We are away at Stoke by the way.

[clarkey1974]

So the EFL (or as was) don’t do anything about it he says….well Kirk broadfoot got a 10 game with the incident involving him and McLean if anyone remembers …maybe he should think about that and others who have conveniently forgot about that incident..

[KerrAvon]

McLeans problem is not that he doesn't go along with all these things, poppies, queen etc, but that he actively makes a meal out of not doing so. He could just not do something, but he has to make a song and dance about it. And that's when it turns from quietly declining to join in with what others are doing, to making it known he isn't and turning it into a protest. And then he moans when he gets abused for actively making it known he is not joining in.

Yes we get why you don't wear poppy, but there is a difference between just not wearing one and making a point of telling the whole world that you aren't. People might except it more if he didn't make a song and dance over it. If he quietly respected those that do, people might respect why he doesn't.

Has he made a meal out of not going along with poppies and queen's etc., or is the like of The Sun and Daily Mail that have run stories with invented 'fury' and 'storm erupts' about his position?

I haven't really followed McLean's career and genuinely don't know the answer to that question. All I've really seen is posts on here where people 'make a meal' out of his views.

[John2]

John2 come back later tonight & give us your opinion on the Rotherham game. We are away at Stoke by the way.

How come you've discouraged me from expressing a political opinion but not, for example, the initiator of this thread?

Kind of proves my points. Some people only want free speech to mean things they agree with.

Also, all this stuff about "why doesn't he go back to Ireland"... what a sad reflection of our country if we'd rather drive people out than be a place where people feel safe expressing themselves.

What sort of world do we want to create for the next generation?