Leeds United transfer rumours....

[Monaco_Totty]

If & buts as ever with development.
The LUFC develop planning is as contentious as smokers outside hospital doors

Not sure 'kids' today want to bench warm at any level & if the likes of an elder experienced pro (Llorente) are happy to bench-warm then it makes man management decisions easier.

Not sure any club & coach would give (our youngsters) a team place 'run' in the PL presently ?

Not personally convinced many fringe named players mentioned are good enough presently for a PL starting place but each to their own opinion ?

Fact is PL has huge turnover with regard to youth development.
Incredibly, 97 per cent of players who made it through professional Premier League academies have never made a single EPL appearance as big money transfers for players abroad often keep the homegrown talent of clubs out of the first team.

Reasons for that - depending on your view points.

Mentality at Leeds is now survival & it shows - just hope it all now pans out & maybe mid-table obscurity is the next stage strategy.

[WTF11]

If & buts as ever with development.
The LUFC develop planning is as contentious as smokers outside hospital doors

Not sure 'kids' today want to bench warm at any level & if the likes of an elder experienced pro (Llorente) are happy to bench-warm then it makes man management decisions easier.

Not sure any club & coach would give (our youngsters) a team place 'run' in the PL presently ?

Not personally convinced many fringe named players mentioned are good enough presently for a PL starting place but each to their own opinion ?

Fact is PL has huge turnover with regard to youth development.
Incredibly, 97 per cent of players who made it through professional Premier League academies have never made a single EPL appearance as big money transfers for players abroad often keep the homegrown talent of clubs out of the first team.

Reasons for that - depending on your view points.

Mentality at Leeds is now survival & it shows - just hope it all now pans out & maybe mid-table obscurity is the next stage strategy.

Most threads relating to transfers, especially when started at the outset of a transfer window, are focussed on the 1st team. This thread is no exception. There may have been some peripheral comments relating to some minor youth incomings, but the 125 - 150m mentioned in several posts relates to 1st team players (as evidenced by the fact that all apart from Rutter I believe, included in that figure have played for the 1st team since being brought to LUFC.

Academy/youth development is fine in principle, but as you rightly point out, a vanishingly small number of such players ever play in the PL. LUFC is no different, so we come back to the key question posed a few times in this thread, what value are we seeing in the 1st team to justify the vast sum spent on new players?

[Monaco_Totty]

Most threads relating to transfers, especially when started at the outset of a transfer window, are focussed on the 1st team. This thread is no exception. There may have been some peripheral comments relating to some minor youth incomings, but the 125 - 150m mentioned in several posts relates to 1st team players (as evidenced by the fact that all apart from Rutter I believe, included in that figure have played for the 1st team since being brought to LUFC.

Academy/youth development is fine in principle, but as you rightly point out, a vanishingly small number of such players ever play in the PL. LUFC is no different, so we come back to the key question posed a few times in this thread, what value are we seeing in the 1st team to justify the vast sum spent on new players?

As I previously mentioned 'many reasons' - so this might help answer your key thought.

https://www.thesportsman.com/article...er-squad-value

[WTF11]

As I previously mentioned 'many reasons' - so this might help answer your key thought.

https://www.thesportsman.com/article...er-squad-value

Not sure that "reasoning" was at the heart of my query. There will of course be many reasons for acquiring a player, or players, my question was about the value that accrues to LUFC for the investment it makes, not in youth players, but in the vast outlay for a set of 1st team players with very little pedigree, and absence of credible track record, and with favourite positions for which we already have a suitable supply of PL-experienced players (not that Marsch appears to care much about where he positions players or their preferences/past performances).

So no, the article isn't answering anything really. Don't know who Connor Keane is, but what his message is with that article is beyond me (I'm easily fooled, obviously).

So Fulham have been able to score points for the lowest cost per point and a squad "value" of £212m and are 7th in the PL, it's cost Leeds £15m per ppoint and we're 15th (Not 14th as per the article), and Chelski have "paid" £30.5m per point, and are 10th in the PL.

Firstly, define value? If its independent valuation such as Transfermarkt, ok, if it's Mr Keanes figures, less so. I'd prefer "cost to acquire" given the context of the thread. Secondly, over what period of time have the value/costs been incurred, the debate on this thread has been reasonably specific in terms of "since the 2022 Summer transfer window, no such definition in Mr Keanes article. Just another example of "lies, damned lies and statistics", telling us not a lot and earning Mr Keane a healthy commission I'm sure.

Sorry, no, it (the article), answers nothing and adds nothing much to the overall sum of intelligence regarding have LUFC got value for their investment.

[BelfastAndy]

A couple of names were 'nailed on' earlier this afternoon. Now both going elsewhere. Lol.

[ozleeds]

"Being fair to the club"?????

We have been in that transitional period since the 49-ers cast their baleful influence over the club, well before Marsch. We weren't in a good place when Bielsa was sacked, but the lack of support then, is in stark contrast to the splurge of money that Marsch has been the beneficiary of. Makes you wonder just how "engineered" Bielsas departure was and who were the engineers.

The 49-ers signed an agreement regarding a takeover by 2024. Why would they want to rush anything when the clubs current predicament makes any buyout less attractive than it has been since we gained promotion?

As for "recruitment strategy", there isn't one apart from the criteria I've mentioned several times previously, and what you say in your post is spot on and describes very accurately the inability of our DoF to deal with a Premier league recruitment system. Agree that he, like Marsch is now (and has for some time been), out of his depth, trouble is the influence of the 49-ers on everything is unhelpful to say the least, given as Spaldy says in #169, they seem to be attempting to adopt an NFL approach to creating a PL club, it won't work.

Hope the 49rs are happy with what they are achieving as it will be funny if we get relegated they pull out as they stated there only in for the premier league.

[ozleeds]

If & buts as ever with development.
The LUFC develop planning is as contentious as smokers outside hospital doors

Not sure 'kids' today want to bench warm at any level & if the likes of an elder experienced pro (Llorente) are happy to bench-warm then it makes man management decisions easier.

Not sure any club & coach would give (our youngsters) a team place 'run' in the PL presently ?

Not personally convinced many fringe named players mentioned are good enough presently for a PL starting place but each to their own opinion ?

Fact is PL has huge turnover with regard to youth development.
Incredibly, 97 per cent of players who made it through professional Premier League academies have never made a single EPL appearance as big money transfers for players abroad often keep the homegrown talent of clubs out of the first team.

Reasons for that - depending on your view points.

Mentality at Leeds is now survival & it shows - just hope it all now pans out & maybe mid-table obscurity is the next stage strategy.

Neither Gnonto to Summer were thought to be ready for the premier league but as we found out there are more than ready. The kid from Chelsea looks ready-made is a beast and has shown he can handle it better than the bigger spend buys like Rocca.
Like you say each to their own thoughts but apparently, we were assembling the best young talent so hence we were not spending for the senior team how has that changed and same crap results.

[Monaco_Totty]

Not sure that "reasoning" was at the heart of my query. There will of course be many reasons for acquiring a player, or players, my question was about the value that accrues to LUFC for the investment it makes, not in youth players, but in the vast outlay for a set of 1st team players with very little pedigree, and absence of credible track record, and with favourite positions for which we already have a suitable supply of PL-experienced players (not that Marsch appears to care much about where he positions players or their preferences/past performances).

So no, the article isn't answering anything really. Don't know who Connor Keane is, but what his message is with that article is beyond me (I'm easily fooled, obviously).

So Fulham have been able to score points for the lowest cost per point and a squad "value" of £212m and are 7th in the PL, it's cost Leeds £15m per ppoint and we're 15th (Not 14th as per the article), and Chelski have "paid" £30.5m per point, and are 10th in the PL.

Firstly, define value? If its independent valuation such as Transfermarkt, ok, if it's Mr Keanes figures, less so. I'd prefer "cost to acquire" given the context of the thread. Secondly, over what period of time have the value/costs been incurred, the debate on this thread has been reasonably specific in terms of "since the 2022 Summer transfer window, no such definition in Mr Keanes article. Just another example of "lies, damned lies and statistics", telling us not a lot and earning Mr Keane a healthy commission I'm sure.

Sorry, no, it (the article), answers nothing and adds nothing much to the overall sum of intelligence regarding have LUFC got value for their investment.

I can only equate value as i perceive it & also how I see the club presently perceive it but it may not fit how you want to perceive value & said article which I perceived to be 'fair' was dated start of Jan window 2023.😊


So WTF - as i said regarding 'Value' & its many reasons all obviously each to their own & complex.


For fans -"your support is of great value" clubs will say when i renew my ST, for starters every season.


Mmmm, Value today ?
The new 2022/23 FFP kicks in for transactions now for clubs bigger spends on individual players, hence our paying via installments over period of contracts - thus longer contracts now offered for a reason.


Value ?
Some clubs have had a business model rather than a trophy winning model - differing reasons & opinions on what we've had or got now - no doubt. 😊


Value in Season 2022/23 transfer ins & outs ?
New 2022/23 FFP rules allow clubs to make a limited loss (which can obviously be covered by wealthy owners) of €60m/£59.6m over a three years frame allowance.
However at Leeds turning a profit, offsetting expenditure against capital or football development projects & boosting revenues helps to stretch that new FFP envelope - Obviously Radz has now sealed his rather stretched envelope & appears to have left his business side value-model to others now, I'd suggest.


Value ?
A club has to assign a buyout clause for every player, this clause is the amount of money the club demands to break the contract. Hence long contracts for young players like Rutter & the Leeds policy of buying young talented Internationals that can be moved on easier than older players if they're sold for whatever reason.


Value pros & cons examples ?
Young Joffy - under contract, out on loan now maybe with other club paying half his wages & a possible future big fee sell on.

Dan James - under contract, out on loan with London club covering most of his wages, of decent age to sell on for transfer fee.

Firpo - under contract, possible loan out or sell on with decent age related transfer fee for all parties concerned, I'd suspect.


Transfer fees aren't a player’s concern as most players will get a transfer bonus when their club sells them via clauses in their contracts.
Bigger Leeds signings can terminate a contract for just cause if the club doesn't play them in at least 10% of the games of a season is now the norm, formally called the sporting justification rule - aka benching rule.


In essence no black & white answer to your assertion of a crystal ball 'exact-value' requirement as it depends on how one perceives it in a complex industry providing a team game, consisting of individuals playing to a Coaches instructions who is under an Owners budget which we wont see figures-wise for a while, but hey-ho nowt wrong with having an opinion in the mean time, imo 🤗

[Monaco_Totty]

McKennie flying in tonight according to Twitter - Mmm.

Understand Leeds will pay €1.2m loan fee — deal will include buy option clause for €33m plus add ons* #LUFC Leeds president Radrizzani unlocked the deal with Juventus in the night. McKennie has agreed personal terms with Leeds.

The Weston McKennie Story: Teamwork Across Time
https://youtu.be/3vb1UvOpxxg

Left Turin Airport at teatime on a private jet to Leeds.
https://twitter.com/romeoagresti/sta...5yKtwo5mK8gnYQ

Firpo dancing to the news !
https://twitter.com/LadToDad_/status...9hZlld73lDjaKQ

[Orgoner]

A loan might be the better option for us in this instance?