o/t covid farce

[Trickytreesreds]

So after the exposure of Hancocks texts and the COVID fiasco. Can we all agree that most of the COVID pandemic was a lie and blown out of all proportion?

This was obviously political and NOT SCIENCE BASED, maybe partygate and pubgate can be explained away by the way the rules were ignored?

Hancock at least needs holding to account here, maybe even charges?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmSpeou2ojY

[Andy_Faber]

So after the exposure of Hancocks texts and the COVID fiasco. Can we all agree that most of the COVID pandemic was a lie and blown out of all proportion?

This was obviously political and NOT SCIENCE BASED, maybe partygate and pubgate can be explained away by the way the rules were ignored?

Hancock at least needs holding to account here, maybe even charges?

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=vmSpeou2ojY

I’ll beg to differ, mistakes made worldwide by politicians (mostly) and scientists (in good faith), it was definitely a thing and I just thank God the real pointy heads got a shift on with a vaccine or I think I’d be dead now.

What’s your point?

[ramAnag]

I’ll beg to differ, mistakes made worldwide by politicians (mostly) and scientists (in good faith), it was definitely a thing and I just thank God the real pointy heads got a shift on with a vaccine or I think I’d be dead now.

What’s your point?

Agree completely. Can someone please shut him up?

[Trickytreesreds]

I’ll beg to differ, mistakes made worldwide by politicians (mostly) and scientists (in good faith), it was definitely a thing and I just thank God the real pointy heads got a shift on with a vaccine or I think I’d be dead now.

What’s your point?

My point sir, was that once we had opened the lock down route. Certain elements took full advantage to implement control.

Lock down one. Completely necessary, as was the implementation of the vaccine asap.
Lock down 2? No way. The care home abuse was vitually criminal among this.
To read those messages of Hancock and his cronies, laughing at the general public blindly following their actions was disgusting.
laughing at those Paying to isolate in hotels after travelling
Enpowering the police into an arm of the government
Joking about when to implement their "new strain" as to bring about more control measures.

If you or anyone, hasn't been concerned by any of these messages, then I'm amazed.

NB RA, if you want me shut up, then do it yourself. You bang on about debate and treating others fairly. Yet rather than simply re***e anything I say, you scream for others to do your dirty work. Pathetic.

[swaledale]

My point sir, was that once we had opened the lock down route. Certain elements took full advantage to implement control.

Lock down one. Completely necessary, as was the implementation of the vaccine asap.
Lock down 2? No way. The care home abuse was vitually criminal among this.
To read those messages of Hancock and his cronies, laughing at the general public blindly following their actions was disgusting.
laughing at those Paying to isolate in hotels after travelling
Enpowering the police into an arm of the government
Joking about when to implement their "new strain" as to bring about more control measures.

If you or anyone, hasn't been concerned by any of these messages, then I'm amazed.

NB RA, if you want me shut up, then do it yourself. You bang on about debate and treating others fairly. Yet rather than simply re***e anything I say, you scream for others to do your dirty work. Pathetic.

But Tricky, as is often the case, you have changed the nuance of your argument, because the thrust of your post was Covid farce and you were stating quite clearly that the whole thing was a hoax/unnecessary etc. etc.

I'm sure there are many issues over the handling of Covid that the government got wrong, but making a judgement based on a series of selectively leaked Whatsapp messages is hardly sound.

I'm sure that if you were privy to discussions that went on between any group of people you might take issue with what was said, but without proper context its impossible to distinguish between a light hearted or off the cuff remark and a serious one. So no I'm not overly concerned about these messages, other than it proves just how stupid Hancock is!!

[Trickytreesreds]

But Tricky, as is often the case, you have changed the nuance of your argument, because the thrust of your post was Covid farce and you were stating quite clearly that the whole thing was a hoax/unnecessary etc. etc.

I'm sure there are many issues over the handling of Covid that the government got wrong, but making a judgement based on a series of selectively leaked Whatsapp messages is hardly sound.

I'm sure that if you were privy to discussions that went on between any group of people you might take issue with what was said, but without proper context its impossible to distinguish between a light hearted or off the cuff remark and a serious one. So no I'm not overly concerned about these messages, other than it proves just how stupid Hancock is!!

No sir i didn't,
I said the panic was blown out of all proportion and stand by that.
It is slowly leaking out, they have had everyone on puppet strings for quite some time.
No one denies there wasn't a new virus. But to bring the world to a dead stop? Behave.
You yourself was blasting the damage lockdowns have done and the long term damage to the economy and people who will then die with long term ailments.

They've had our pants down.
Still things are coming out.

https://flipboard.com/@dailymailuk/t...647496046-%2F0

[MadAmster]

I said the panic was blown out of all proportion and stand by that.

No one denies there wasn't a new virus. But to bring the world to a dead stop? Behave.

You yourself was blasting the damage lockdowns have done and the long term damage to the economy and people who will then die with long term ailments.

Quite how, in the same post, you can say "blown out of proportion" and then "people who will then die with long term ailments".

The Dutch health service is struggling for staff. They have been hit by an epidemic of doctors, nurses, auxiliary staff, paramedics etc all with long covid. Around 20% on sick leave. Not all long covid, the others are down with mental issues, burn out and the like due to having been massively overworked form over 2 years. Two years in which they were risking their lives on a daily basis.

There also signs that many are thinking of leaving and doing other work as they see their own health, both mental and physical, deteriorating.

Is that also the case in the UK?

I mention the Dutch situation as I'm not aware of the current UK stats.

[swaledale]

You won't be surprised to hear me say absolutely not!

I note the usual suspects, are, with the benefit of hindsight and not having been in a position to have to manage the spread of a highly contagious virus, for which there was no vaccine. When the evidence from other countries including Italy for example was that health services were being overwhelmed and people were dying.

What the leaks do show, is actually not in support of an assertion that lockdown was unnecessary, certainly the first or second before the vaccine was available. They do show the discussion and dissent amongst government dealing with an unprecedented situation.

The balance of evidence shows that government-imposed restrictions that reduced people’s social contacts cut infection rates and saved lives. It also suggests that countries that acted more quickly to impose social restrictions did a better job of protecting the economy. Allowing the virus to spread uncontrolled would have incurred substantial economic costs and higher death rates.

The big issue here is that this government kicked the public enquiry on Covid into the long grass, other countries have already had there reviews published, and we are still waiting for it to report. That's too long, there were certainly things the government did wrong, which inlcude not locking down soon enough, not having clear policies on mitigating the harm closing schools did, why they opened pubs before schools after wards and that stupid "eat out to help out scheme".

But I'm not drawing flawed conclusions from a series of leaked whatsapp messages published in an anti lockdown paper which are being used by those ideologically opposed to lockdowns and which actually don't contain all the information necessary to make a independent judgement.

What is true, that vaccination means one generally can shrug off covid, so limiting exposure amongst the population prior to a vaccine being available did save lives and that even the one country Sweden that did have looser rules (although the main difference is that they werent mandatory), had a higher death rate than its Scandinavian neighbours, a population more cooperative over observing social distancing, yet admits it should have acted quicker to implement measures and closed restaurant's.

To say it was obviously political and not science based is erroneous! Obviously political decisions were made as politicians are elected to run the country! Not everything the scientists suggested was adopted, not all the modelling was a 100% accurate - models never are, they are an indication. One would expect there to be heated debate amongst them, thats a sign of good governance surely?

[Ramshank72]

Sorry to go Swaledale on you, but you talk some real crap sometimes, you'll be claiming the Holocaust was a hoax next.
(Sorry Swale, just tongue in cheek)

[swaledale]

Sorry to go Swaledale on you, but you talk some real crap sometimes, you'll be claiming the Holocaust was a hoax next.
(Sorry Swale, just tongue in cheek)

No probs Ramshank I do have a sense of humour and not that thin skinned!