Was wondering about batteries

[islaydarkblue]

Thanks Deeranged. Good to know that when I am out near a wind farm that I am not likely to be in danger from a flying vane. I tried to find out how much energy could be expected from a turbine and its power output rating. It seems that there's a bit of debate about how much electricity will be generated and I would love to know if the principle of making payments to the owner of the turbines is only initiated if the demand from the grid is so low that there is no demand for wind power. It seemed to me that this is exactly when battery storage would be used. It find it hard to believe that batteries will ever be capable of storing enough electricity to smooth out the supply and create a 100% wind farm based renewable energy supply system.

Scottish Renewables are quick to tell us that on a Sunday when it is windy and sunny renewables (solar panels and wind turbines) have produced 100% of the electricity required in Scotland.
However the same Scottish Renewables fail to tell us how much electricity the same renewables in Scotland produced in a cloudy day in December when there is little wind blowing due to an area of high pressure sitting stationary over Scotland.

[islaydarkblue]

Just Googled wind speeds and turbines. Operating range is 7 to 55mph. Now looking to see if there are stats for how often the turbines are stopped because of too much wind.

The house next door to me on Islay has a 2.5KW Provan wind turbine erected in the large garden. During windy weather it cannot be switched off because the rope has broken and the makers of the wind turbine have gone bust.

[islaydarkblue]

worked on a couple of wind turbines when they were first introduced.
if i mind right, batteries are only used to induce power to the turbine to start it up, then the wind takes over.
if there is insufficient wind power, the system then swaps over to the grid.

If there is a night match at Dens, and there is a power failure, small diesel generators automatically kick in and supply power for emergency
light systems only, for stairwells and walkways .

same on an oil rig, if the turbines fail ,battery banks kick in and supply power for emergency light systems, which would only last about
4-6 hours.
a black start, then commences and a standby diesel generator is started to supply power to control systems to start up a turbine,
which will reinstate power to the rig,

You are correct about the wind turbines being plugged into the national grid in periods of calm weather otherwise the turbines would seize up.
That is why you see the blades of wind turbines in wind farms staggering round during calm weather.
From November 2019 until May 2020 the main electricity cable from the Mainland to the island of Jura and then onto Islay was wrecked by an unknown object. The main cable lies on the seabed between Mainland Argyll and the island of Jura was probably wrecked by a dredger fishing boat illegally operating in this area but nobody admitted it.
The diesel powered electricity generating station in Bowmore was operating flat keeping the lights on and the nine whisky distilleries on Islay plus Jura whisky distillery in full production.
Wee Greta Thunberg would have ‘done her nut’ if she had found about diesel being used to power an electricity generating station for almost six months.

[Deeranged]

A number of years ago I saw a photograph on the internet of a large wind turbine where one of its blades had sheared off during storm force winds.
About four years there was a property for sale in the Rhinns area of Islay. Included in the sale was a free standing wind turbine which had blown over in stormy weather.
There was a photograph of the wind turbine which toppled over.

Seimens Gamesa had an issue with material from an OEM I believe that resulted in a one off failure - not sure it was a shear though, more likely a complete detach at gear hub. Obviously I could be wrong.

I'd think if the fallen turbine on Islay was four years ago on a private property it will have been an early type of turbine installed by a dodgy contractor. The monstrosities you see blighting the environment on top of hills all over the country are much better designed, much more robust and are unlikely to fall over.

I can understand why someone would have visions of these things throwing blades or falling over mind. They just look clumsy and most definitely look out of place in our countryside.

[The AuldYin]

I'll ask my daughter today about the battery storage thing, and if anyone has any specific questions about renewable energy fire them up and I'll ask her. One answer I know I'll get is they don't have all the answers and thing and attitudes take time to change but change they have to and they will whether we like it or not. Scrapping everything and continue to eat up fossil fuels because some auld stick shaker from Islay heard a story down the pub that wind turbines are gonna come crashing through your window at any minute simply won't happen.

[Deeranged]

All energy is renewable - energy can be neither created nor destroyed. The energy used in burning oil and gas was buried millions of years ago, we're simply enhancing it.

[islaydarkblue]

Seimens Gamesa had an issue with material from an OEM I believe that resulted in a one off failure - not sure it was a shear though, more likely a complete detach at gear hub. Obviously I could be wrong.

I'd think if the fallen turbine on Islay was four years ago on a private property it will have been an early type of turbine installed by a dodgy contractor. The monstrosities you see blighting the environment on top of hills all over the country are much better designed, much more robust and are unlikely to fall over.

I can understand why someone would have visions of these things throwing blades or falling over mind. They just look clumsy and most definitely look out of place in our countryside.

I think that the wind turbine which fell down was installed ‘on the cheap’.
As far as I am aware the individual wing turbines installed in gardens on Islay are either sunk into a substantial concrete base or held up by guy ropes. This wind turbine had neither.
I agree that the wind turbines in our countryside are an eyesore and out of place but unfortunately the SNP controlled Scottish Government think that they are wonderful and they will help reach Net Zero CO2 emissions by 2045.
Useless jetting off to attend COP28 at our expense is certainly not helping to save the planet.
COP28 could have been held by video conferencing but that would mean that the delegates and ‘hangers on’ would not get a ‘free’ fortnight’s holiday.

[BCram]

I'll ask my daughter today about the battery storage thing, and if anyone has any specific questions about renewable energy fire them up and I'll ask her. One answer I know I'll get is they don't have all the answers and thing and attitudes take time to change but change they have to and they will whether we like it or not. Scrapping everything and continue to eat up fossil fuels because some auld stick shaker from Islay heard a story down the pub that wind turbines are gonna come crashing through your window at any minute simply won't happen.

Thanks AuldYin. your response about having access to someone who actually deals with the issues is exactly what I had hoped for. I think the politicians have much too much power to manage public opinion. They employ really clever and talented people to "research" and produce arguments that seem to be intellectually sound but when you drill down into them they have some basic assumption that is contentious.

The point that got me interested was that battery power has been an issue for decades and I don't see how legislating for the removal of fossil fuel in Scotland is going to help the world. China, India and Russia have refused to sign the treaties and are actually expanding their usage of these fossil fuels to help them to manufacture the kit that we are buying to phase out our fossil fuel energy sources. I think you are right to point out the obsessive drive towards net zero carbon. Somehow we need to find our own Greta Thunberg to explain how wrong-headed our politicians approach is.

[islaydarkblue]

I'll ask my daughter today about the battery storage thing, and if anyone has any specific questions about renewable energy fire them up and I'll ask her. One answer I know I'll get is they don't have all the answers and thing and attitudes take time to change but change they have to and they will whether we like it or not. Scrapping everything and continue to eat up fossil fuels because some auld stick shaker from Islay heard a story down the pub that wind turbines are gonna come crashing through your window at any minute simply won't happen.

I was a member of the Islay Energy Trust steering group from 2004 until November 2006 and I learnt a lot about renewable energy during that period.

[BCram]

All energy is renewable - energy can be neither created nor destroyed. The energy used in burning oil and gas was buried millions of years ago, we're simply enhancing it.

Exactly. What kind of atmosphere was there on earth when it managed to lay down such vast deposits of fossil based materials. Were mammals alive?